1. #1
    High Overlord Landfall's Avatar
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    Yet another priest asking for help :)

    So, i levelled my priest up through LFG/questing in northrend and doing the LFG system as disc from the start i learned how to play this spec well. I can easily heal heroics and have done Totc10, and bits in 25 man. I've tried to get as much kit as possible but with gemming im not really sue the appropirete way. I dont have mana issues on the longer fights with Shadowfiend and hymn of hope. My link is: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...on&cn=Landholy
    I was thinking that i should take out the 20 int gem and MP5 gem?
    I appreciate that my kit isnt 'imba' but it's not always the kit that makes the player, something gearscore overlooks slightly. But thats a different debate
    So i'm basicaly asking for some guidence as to what i should do next in both kit at gems and what sort of level of raid i can heal. I personaly dont feel my kit is up to ICC 10 standards but then again i've not really got any idea.
    And please dont shoot me down in flames, im just asking for advice

  2. #2
    Blademaster Svn's Avatar
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    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    well, as far as int goes, you're a disc priest and have said yourself you never run out of mana and your mana regen is decent. So, theres really no need to stack it, for a priest it just provides more mana pool and a slightly higher crit rate. The talent bonuses you get from spirit are much more valuable. When i cached your armory profile it said your enchanting was still at 30, I'd work on that (for the embroidery you can do to your cloak, and of course chanting your own gear is nice as well). My spell power unbuffed is around 2600, I don't know exactly, but ICC is prolly around 2500 to heal effectively. So, you're a little low there, but if you switched some of those half and half gems for full on sp it could help that number. I'm not exactly sure what you meant by 'kit', I'm not very fluent with acronyms so I do apologize. You're also missing a boot enchant and if you had your enchanting up you could put sp on your rings, which is a nice bonus as well. Your haste is okay as well, I mean overall gear is decent just little things. Do you have a good rotation down? and are you quick to react? are pretty big things as well as far as disc healing, you don't have the enormous POP! heals others have, it's more about damage reduction so you have to be quick on your feet. Oh yeah, change those mp5 chants for spirit or crit or something else. Hope this was helpful Ive been playing my priest for a couple years now so drop me a line if you need any more help. Lok'Tar my Dwarven friend.

  3. #3

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Svn
    #1 well, as far as int goes, you're a disc priest and have said yourself you never run out of mana and your mana regen is decent. So, theres really no need to stack it, for a priest it just provides more mana pool and a slightly higher crit rate. The talent bonuses you get from spirit are much more valuable.

    #2When i cached your armory profile it said your enchanting was still at 30, I'd work on that (for the embroidery you can do to your cloak, and of course chanting your own gear is nice as well). My spell power unbuffed is around 2600, I don't know exactly, but ICC is prolly around 2500 to heal effectively. So, you're a little low there, but if you switched some of those half and half gems for full on sp it could help that number. Your haste is okay as well, I mean overall gear is decent just little things

    3#Do you have a good rotation down? and are you quick to react? are pretty big things as well as far as disc healing, you don't have the enormous POP! heals others have, it's more about damage reduction so you have to be quick on your feet.

    #4Oh yeah, change those mp5 chants for spirit or crit or something else. Hope this was helpful Ive been playing my priest for a couple years now so drop me a line if you need any more help. Lok'Tar my Dwarven friend.
    #1 :
    (To gain 1% crit @L80 you need 166,6667 Intellect)
    The talent bonus you ... Wait what ?
    As disc priest you dont benefit at all from spirit. Your best regen is and will always be Intellect as disc and never Spirit.

    #2 :
    He is right about the proffesions. Though the Sp amount is allright for now, seeing that you are disc. With Innerfire and 25m raid buffed/flask etc You'll be close to 2.5 k sp, which is okay for now. It will increase as your gear gets better so do not worry too much about that now.

    Keep gemming haste and sp. Consider taking your 12 sp and 10 int gems for a 12 sp + 10 haste instead

    #3:
    Oh yeah because penance isnt a POP heal in anyway ? - I am sorry but to me it seems like you have never played a Disc Priest. - Penance is by far the most powerful *Oh shit heal* there is and the spirit suggestion makes my point even stronger.

    #4:
    You can change the head/shoulder enchants for crit instead, but it is not vital at this point - you can wait until you get a new item for the slot.
    But DO NOT take spirit.

    If you want you could also consider not taking all your gem meta's(socket bonus) by gemming pure SP and Haste instead of 12 SP + 10 Spirit ( visa vie the spirit discussion)

    --
    @ Svn I simply have a hard time believing that you have played priest for a couple of years when you write that kind of bollocks.

    @ OP :
    I can not see why you should just feel that your are good on your way and should keep up your good work.

    In case you want a longer wall of text and a link to some real math about Priests
    Read any of the stickies and/or check out worshaka's post here
    http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-pr...sg2137807/#new

    Edit :

    I just had a closer look at your spec/glyphs - and it could do with some improvementa.

    1# Get Minor glyph of shadowfiend.
    2# You did not max out inspiration, wich is a must in my opinion - I would go with a spec like this http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#bVcbuhhVRIsffRtbhtc - You can choose not to take Desperate prayer and use it in Holy Specialization.

  4. #4

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    I have to disagree with you on the spec you are suggesting mate.
    Imo you should go with this instead: http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#bVcbuhhVRIsffRtfxzc

    The only one of your spells that gets anything from "Divine Fury" is "Greater Heal". You are gonna use GH very rarely, you are either on the raid shielding duty or tank healing. If you want to be the best tank healer possible you dont want to use Greater Heal. GH is too slow without being hasted from "Borrowed Time", the only times you would want to use it is if you have "Borrowed Time". Lets assume you are on tankhealing duty, you are spamming the tank and his weakened soul wears off. The first you want to do is shield him, after your shield you will have borrowed time, now you can either cast a GH or a FH. Lets say the tank takes a 10k hit, 6k gets absorbed by your shield and then you only have 4k left to heal which makes it natural to keep spamming FH anyway.
    Imo avoid "Divine Fury" or atleast take "Spell Warding" instead, there is simply too small benefit from it.

    Sphinxz
    (This signature was removed for violation of the Avatar & Signature Guidelines)

  5. #5

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    Yet you spend 3 points in renew ? ..

    Besides - I still believe that GH is more viable than Fh for tank healing, granted that you have enough haste.

    And the fact that you can throw a Gh if needed with BT after a penance makes you a more viable healer/lifesaver.

    If you can come with some good reasons to choose 2% crit(viable to a certain extend imo) and 3*IR(meh viable) over 0.5 sec faster Gh I would very much like to hear them.

    Let the games begin .

  6. #6

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    i propose for 10man:
    http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#bVcbuhhVRIsffRtby0c:AbZV
    I almost never use GH on Tankheal, only Penance/FHspam due to imp FH
    5/5 spellwarding is stronger then a lot of people think imo


  7. #7

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    I certainly can
    Discipline is a support healer, they have a bad throughput but are yet very viable due to their unique "Predmg healing" in form of shields. Discipline is a niche spec, only space for 1 of them in a raid-enviroment.
    As before mentioned the strength of the Disc spec is "Predmg healing" or absortion. Since this is almost the only thing you bring to a raid, except a few nice cooldowns and 3% dmg reduction, you would want to be brilliant in that narrow area you are working around.
    Tank healing as disc is about keeping a rotation and then critting as much as possible. Lets take an example, the time frame is 30 seconds and we assume we are playing with 50% holy crit, which is reachable with good gear.

    If spamming FH you will get 1.5 sec / 30 casts. 20 casts and with 50% crit chance that would in theory be 10 crits preventing even further dmg.
    If spamming GH you will get 3.0 sec / 30 casts. 10 casts and with 50% crit chance that would in theory be 5 crits preventing even further on the dmg.

    You obviously want to get most casts of since the more casts you get off the more you will crit in the end.
    Another reason not to use GH is that a disc priest isnt supposed to be tankhealing alone, they normally work with a paladin who makes sure that the throughput is there by doing insanely big holy lights.
    A lot of the disc tree is also built around FH and the talent "Improved Flash Heal" along with the "Glyph og Flash Heal" makes it much more manaefficient to use that over GH.

    Let the games continue

    Cheers Sphinxz
    (This signature was removed for violation of the Avatar & Signature Guidelines)

  8. #8

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    I will not argue with you about proactive healing. Indeed right you are.

    However - Your calculation is flawed.

    You see if you have good enough gear to have 50% crit raid buffed - would you really end up having absolut 0 haste ? ..

    So lets do some math with all the stats you can obtain.

    @L80 1 % haste = 32,79 haste rating
    25% = 819,75 = 820 haste rating

    So in this setup we will have 25% haste rating and 50 % crit raid buffed.

    Flash heal cast time:
    [ Base_Cast_time-(Base_cast_time/100*25) ]

    (1.5/100*25) = 0.375
    1,5-0,375 = 1,125

    That means that you will have a 1.1 second Fh cast, that is just within the border of gcd.

    If you then apply BT you will have additional 25% haste.

    That means that your 1.1 second Fh will be at:
    (1.5/100*50) = 0,75
    1,5-0,75 = 0,75

    A 0,75 second long cast is simply waste of time and mana, since you will have to wait for your gcd to wear off.

    That means that every time you use a PW:S your Fh is not viable ( and even with 10% haste (327,9 haste rating (lol) its still not viable) - now how often do you cast a PW:S shield as disc priest ?

    If we then take Gh - Without Divine Fury.

    (3.0/100*25) = 0.75
    3,0-0,75 = 2,25

    Now you have a 2,25 cast Gh with just the amount of haste you have on your gear.

    Lets put BT on aswell:
    (3.0/100*50) = 1.5
    3,0-1,5 = 1,5

    Woop , now you have a 1.5 Gh with haste+Bt. Now that is viable.
    But then with Divine Fury, you can withdraw further 0,5 seconds.

    That is a 1.0 second Gh - Boom heal on top of penance.

    When you are not affected by BT - Your Gh's cast time would be:
    (2,5/100*25) = 0,625
    2.5-0,625 = 1,875

    Now if a Gh at 1,875 casttime is not viable I will personally delete my priest (maybe not, but it sounds good )

    --

    Let the games continue.. further


  9. #9

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    Hmm, I like You discussion but still can't decide who is right:P

    Let the games continue faster ;P

  10. #10
    High Overlord Landfall's Avatar
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    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    Cheers for the advice. I had respeced and goten the glyph of shadowfiend. Also replaced some of my gems with SP+haste.
    Now to see how i hold up in a raid

  11. #11

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    Quote Originally Posted by IgotRICKrolled

    (1.5/100*25) = 0.375
    1,5-0,375 = 1,125

    That means that with average latency you will have a 1.1 second Fh cast, that is just within the border of gcd.
    now, I'm not joining the debate, since I actually believe there is room for GH at times in a raid.
    however, can I have your connection please? latency that makes my spells execute faster insteda of adding time between casts would be pure win with shadow and clipping mind flay.

  12. #12

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    Although tjis GH debate is one of the more common in this forum (and it starts over and over again ), IgotRICKrolled post is really good. Basically My thoughts are that GH is meanly viable for Disc, especially considering that crit brings a nice DA with it.

    But once again, this does not prove at any moment that you should cast GH each time PW:S is casted. On a DPS player, GH would just be OH so pointless (most of the time I mean). GH use is mostly dedicated to tanks when strong damages come and burst heal is required. Whatever the fight is, by the end FH shall probably be more casted than GH, but just saying GH is crap for a disc is just not true.

  13. #13

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    Quote Originally Posted by tatienne
    now, I'm not joining the debate, since I actually believe there is room for GH at times in a raid.
    however, can I have your connection please? latency that makes my spells execute faster insteda of adding time between casts would be pure win with shadow and clipping mind flay.
    Oh... thank you for pointing that out.. What I meant was that the 0.025 seconds is such a small difference, that with average latency it would feel and shown(quartz) like a 1.1 - though the truth might be alot closer to 1.150.

    I apologize any misleading'ness - Post edited.

    @ Ândrömèdâ

    Well of course! I am not saying that Gh is THE only way to go - but it is definetly viable as you point out yourself.

    [Disclaimer : Regarding the "post seen before" - you know when you put some heart in a post, and someone says it did not hit bullseye ? Then you either defend or admit that you were wrong. ...]

  14. #14

    Re: Yet another priest asking for help :)

    Your calculation seems more or less accurate and I believe that you can reach those haste caps as a disc priest and in the second you get your haste to a point where your hasted FH get below global CD, it is more valueable to do a GH, no doubt. I think a disc priest really can optimize his play if he plays around those haste "caps" and find out what suits the best. And if you honestly can get a hasted GH down to 1.0 sec cast you should definately go for it.

    As for spamming GH instead of FH, I dont think this will get viable seeing that you probably wont be able to cap your FH to less than 1 sec global CD, unhasted.

    Sphinxz

    Edit: Im going skiing in France in about 7 hours, that means there is a good chance I wont respond more to this post. Thank you for a nontrolled and intelligent discussion, cheers.
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