1. #1

    Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    I must admit, I don't know a lot about Affliction. I've been running as Destruction for awhile and really only know how to properly play that spec. I recently got into a guild who has a very well geared Destruction Warlock. I was wondering if it made sense for me to switch my spec for the good of the raid. Does it matter? Would it really help the raid for me to do this? The guild hasn't approached me to do this, I was just wondering if I should go ahead and begin investigating it myself.

    I got to thinking this because last night my CoE would consistently drop from a boss. I kept reapplying it and thought later on that perhaps the other Warlock was applying it and maybe we were competing with each other over it. Is that a possibility?

  2. #2

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    CoE was probably being replaced by Earth and Moon (Balance Druid) or Ebon Plague (Unholy Death Knight). (You can check "Raid Composition" on the top left side of MMO-Champion to see buffs and debuffs overlap.)

    Afflic probably provides slightly higher DPS, but Destruction provides a quicker ramp-up time. I dual spec as them, actually- some fights prefer one, some fights prefer the other.
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  3. #3

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    If your curse of elements was dropping off prematurely, then it is likely the other lock was applying his own. Balance druids and Unholy DKs both apply the 13% increased magic damage debuff as well, but theirs doesn't also apply a penalty to resistances, so I don't think their debuffs would overwrite CoE. If it is the other warlock you're having an issue with, then spec changing isn't necessarily the answer... that's just a matter of coordinating ahead of time who's going to put up CoE.

    As far as what each spec brings, it's my understanding that destruction brings replenishment and solid dps, affliction brings increased damage, particularly on mobility fights (so much of your damage is dot and instant cast you can maintain an astonishingly high amount of your output while running around), and demonology brings demonic pact for increased spell damage. My opinion would be for you to play whatever you feel you can do the best with... switching to affliction won't likely benefit the raid a great deal. Demonology's buff is sometimes worth switching for, but your personal dps would be lower so that's something you'd definitely want to talk to your guild/class leader about before doing it.

  4. #4
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    CoE is the highest priority due to duration - Earth and Moon and Ebon Plague do not overwrite it. Chances are you were casting more than one curse or another lock was overwriting it.

    Choose the spec you enjoy playing. They're all about equal dps (equal enough as to not make a significant difference in the end)

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  5. #5

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    Not strictly true. Demonology does provide considerably lower DPS, but provide Demonic Pact, a buff significantly superior to its Elemental Shaman counterpart. That said, I would not spec Demonology if there was already one in your standard raid.

    (I consider that rule to be as hard and fast as only bringing one Disc Priest, tbh.)
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  6. #6

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    Of course having different specs is important for a raid.

    On a side note since I'm not much of a warlock player, different hunter specs bring better buffs and such to the raid. Survival brings replenishment, Marksman brings attack power, and Beast Mastery brings a damage increase.

  7. #7

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    i wouldn't say demo is "considerably" lower. lower. yes, but by marginal if you timing is right, and you are good with your rotations and incinerate/soul fire weaving. ur comparing apples to oranges when trying to compare a marksman attack power buff with a demo spell power buff

  8. #8

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    If the other locks are destro they won't be providing the shadow mastery debuff, which you can do passively with shadowbolt, thus saving your mages having to scorch at no dps loss to you. So your changing specs could give 5% crit to the casters.
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  9. #9

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    I would say demo is on par with destro. I my self am demo afflcition dual specced and I go in 25 mans for the buff and afflic in 10 mans for the dps. I always tie or just ahead the the destro lock and we are almost exactly geared the same.
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  10. #10

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    Affliction doesn't really bring any thing that Detruction does not, so you won't get a big boost to the raid from going Affliction. Now if your raid does not have a Demo lock, that would be a useful spec to swap into.

  11. #11

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    This will give you an idea of the simulated dps for the BiS gear etc. Lots of other factors like movement, latency, skill or even just being more comfortable with one spec over another will change the numbers. They all seem fairly close, so it might be worth trying out another spec.
    http://elitistjerks.com/f80/t87413-3_3_compendium/

    Just in case you don't know other classes or even what other specs of your own class bring, use this tool. I'd say if you have all the buffs/debuffs covered already, go with what you are most comfortable with.
    http://raidcomp.mmo-champion.com/

  12. #12
    Epic! Tearor's Avatar
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    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Garil
    Affliction doesn't really bring any thing that Detruction does not, so you won't get a big boost to the raid from going Affliction. Now if your raid does not have a Demo lock, that would be a useful spec to swap into.
    2nd sentence is true, first is not.
    Affliction brings 5% spellcrit on the target (impSB) for free, which a poster stated 2 posts above you.
    Also, in most of the fights, you would bring a "significant" boost to the raid as affliction because you do more dps.
    Although, I have to mention that Destruction CAN bring replenishment, but that comes with a further loss of personal dps.
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  13. #13

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    13/58 vs 18/53 is not a noticeable DPS difference in game, despite 18/53 being higher DPS on paper. The choice primarily boils down to survivability vs other utility. The main thing to look at right now is Affliction, which is pure DPS with little to no utility versus Demo/Destro which can bring a lot of utility and survivability tools. Loose advise: If you're in a casual guild, or PUG a lot, then go Afflic. If you're in a middle-of-the-road guild consider Demo if you don't already have one, otherwise go Afflic. If you're in a progression guild go Destro, or pDPS Demo, they'll already have a rDPS Demo Lock.

  14. #14
    The Patient Slotter's Avatar
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    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    If you go affliction your raid will thank you a little bit for the ISB buff, and the destro lock in your raid will be pissed when you beat him in DPS with his better gear. I completely raped a destro lock last night on Deathwhisper and he has better gear. http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/f...e/?s=702&e=904. Over 10k dps with no bloodlust. Rolling crits on NIC = win. 102 ticks and 74 were crits.

    Any lock in a progression guild still clinging to destro is an idiot. It provides no raid benefits because other classes have replenishment (if you go that route) and it's less dps.

    If you really want to help your raid, go Demo. The DPS is on par or slightly ahead of destro on most fights but more importantly you help the raid out a ton so overall raid dps will be much higher. Stack up on spell power wherever you can and prepare for some huge numbers when MC procs in demon form while spamming soul fire 68k crits on Lana'thel after getting bit ftw.

  15. #15

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slotter
    Any lock in a progression guild still clinging to destro is an idiot. It provides no raid benefits because other classes have replenishment (if you go that route) and it's less dps.
    Check top locks in world ranked guilds. Hope you enjoy the taste of feet. Progression and DPS rankings are not the same thing.

  16. #16
    The Patient Slotter's Avatar
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    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    I have, and 99% of them are demo or affliction. Once you get the gear, destro should go the way of the dodo.

  17. #17

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    @Slotter
    Different fights have diverse variables of survivability and different needs for types of DPS. To say someone is an idiot for going one of the specs over the other (which by the way, some values of survivability rank much higher in destro) is a little rash and somewhat ignorantly stated.

    As stated by harky, progression and DPS don't always go hand-in-hand. Many locks change specs in progression guilds depending on certain mechanics...


  18. #18

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slotter
    I have, and 99% of them are demo or affliction. Once you get the gear, destro should go the way of the dodo.
    Didn't check very well then. They'll all have a Demo Lock, that's for sure. Destro is currently more popular among guilds doing hard modes. Afflic is great for DPS races and farm content and weak content in general, but Destro has been proving itself quite well in harder content.

  19. #19

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    Judging from the comments I see them really as the following.
    Destro - Superior burst which is useful when you need to take something down quickly, adds based fights particularly and replenishment which can be potentially provided by others. Provides nice stamina buff from Imp.
    Affliction - Superior dps over longer fights, but due to ramp up time does lack burst. Better on stand still, or minimal movement fights. Tougher on non-pet friendly fights.
    Demonology - Less burst than destro but offering a buff through demonic pact, the more caster heavy a raid is the better the benefit. Tougher on non-pet friendly fights.

    Which you use will largely come down to which you are more comfortable playing since it does not matter what the benefit of one spec is if you are playing it badly.
    Yes you can learn and get better but unless you are really being forced into one spec for purposes of progression then concentrate on what you enjoy.
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  20. #20

    Re: Do the different specs bring a lot to a raid?

    It's more like this.

    Destro - Decent burst, good access to utility talents and survivability talents, can offer replenishment for 10 mans. Best on fights with extremely low health adds and fights that require nearly no movement. Poor on fights with medium health adds, or lots of movement.
    Demo - High burst, very strong raid buff, very high survivability, strong cooldown. Best on fights with adds, AOE, or bosses with abnormally long execute phases. Bad personal DPS on fights with damage modifiers that do not apply to pets.
    Affliction - Very high single target damage, no utility, low survivability, low burst. Best on fights that do not have breaks in combat, or fights with few high health adds. Bad on fights with many phases, or require rapid target switching.

    Destro has the largest issue with movement, Affliction has the smallest. Demo has the most reliance on their pet, Affliction has the least. Demo has better burst than Destro if targets live more than 4 seconds, or targets can be chained together (Soul Fire). Etc, etc. Destro is the 'survival/utility' spec now, while Affliction is the 'farm' spec and Demo is the massive raid buff that you shouldn't leave home without, ever.

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