What 3.2 should have been?

[Gron]

Although you guys say it's a bad raid, I think it's probably one of the most popular ones ever,

If it is easy, or run many times to get free loot, does not mean its good.
Heck, billions of people eat in MacDonalds everyday, but I would not say that "crap" is better than a proper restaurant food.
Yet, may eat there.

Does not equal quality.
Fat.

If WOW is run by accountants rather than fun game designers, it already started to go downhill...

[Ijanaak]

For whatever it's worth, I didn't totally hate ToGC... Twins and Anub granted were really the only remotely challenging fights and as a hunter my role on Val'kyr Twins was pretty annoying, but overall I liked the idea of it... but yeah at the end of the day, the only thing that fits lore wise woulda been an Azjol'nerub instance.

One thing that I think would have been REALLY cool. Trial of the Grand Crusader, you start with the tournament, first 4 bosses are like the typical wrath "entry" bosses. Lich King comes and crashes you down into Anub's room. You fight him, but now must find a way out of the cavern, and you end up fighting a variety of different spider bosses, but as you go deeper you see some kind of odd goings on down there of some kind. Maybe a lead in to Professor Putricide, maybe you dont fight him, but he's down there doing expiriments on nerubians and creating modified nerubian bosses that are harder than Anub'arak.

[Deleted]

"Setback" referring to the reuse of a boss, has now been used twice, total, out of hundreds of raid bosses so far.

Kael'thas, Kael'thas, Anub'arak and Blood Princes? :P

[obc]

ToC should have more bosses, if they only designed two rooms than atleast put a few more bosses.

but the 5 fights that are in ToC are really fun. and on heroic they are somewhat challenging.

[bahumut5]

Well, I kinda hoped for those planned raids that were leaked when WotLK was in Beta.

Back then, there were area's called "Utgarde Raid" & "Nerubian Raid".
The stuff was present, yet they never used any of it.

Could be that they will add these in another Patch in Cataclysm, but it was still a shame that we didn't go to Utgarde to raid it with its possibilities :S

[Iacom]

Yeah, ToC was a real letdown, it's too small to be the center of a major patch.

[Condemner]

Kael'thas, Kael'thas, Anub'arak and Blood Princes? :P

add black knight

[Deleted]

Kael'thas, Kael'thas, Anub'arak and Blood Princes? :P

Yeah, three, however still not that many :P (Kael'thas setbacked once, not twice, so not sure why you say his name twice while counting the amount of setbacks :S)

And personally I consider the entire Blood Princes setback to be a direct joke reference to the good man. Pretty sure they'd take some other boss if they hadn't intended to joke about setbacks

add black knight

Fair enough. However, he was reanimated in the same way as most other scourged undead, so it's not the same kind of setback. Might as well say every scourged soldier out there is as setback in itself by those standards

[Shyardik]

considering the nerubians and arthas have such huge ties, it's kind of surprising that blizz didn't add a nerubian kingdom raid. for something that is rather huge to the story of arthas, its rather disappointing that they only had 2 instances, with one of them being merely a setback.

[Sauerkraud]

Yeah, ToC was a real letdown, it's too small to be the center of a major patch.

it wasnt the center of the patch the new bg and alts changes (heirloom, mounts etc) was.

[dr2022]

troll raid

[Condemner]

Yeah, three, however still not that many :P (Kael'thas setbacked once, not twice, so not sure why you say his name twice while counting the amount of setbacks :S)

And personally I consider the entire Blood Princes setback to be a direct joke reference to the good man. Pretty sure they'd take some other boss if they hadn't intended to joke about setbacks
Fair enough. However, he was reanimated in the same way as most other scourged undead, so it's not the same kind of setback. Might as well say every scourged soldier out there is as setback in itself by those standards

Hehe well, it's more cause of what he say's when you fase him. blabla do you honestly think an agent of the lich king could be bested by the field of your tournament ... crap. Souds like setback stuff

[LeperHerring]

Without a doubt, nearly everyone disliked TOC. It went against lore, was relatively easy, gave out free loot to casuals, and was pretty boring(___was a setback! gets old...). So if you could have chosen a raid other than TOC, what would you have wanted?

Actually I don't really dislike TOC. It was something new and different, especially after Ulduar. Had they also released another more traditional raid at the same time (à la MH+BT) it would've been a very nice tier overall. Maybe it's just me, but I dislike the huge indoor tiers like Ulduar and ICC and much prefer the split up SSC/TK and MH/BT style tiers.

[totallyTross]

TOC was kinda like a breath of fresh air in a dead game. But thats just me. I know for some people it was the opposite. Ulduar just never really captured my imagination. ICC is a blast though. TOC came and went /shrug.

I really like the idea of a Nerubian kingdom Raid. But in my opinion it should have came after Naxx.

I just hope if they put another instance in WotLK its soooooo hard that only the Top raiding guilds in the world can down it. Like item lvl 277 gear requirment to even have any chance at downing the boss. I know ICC has heroic modes. But knowing that guilds have cleared like 8/12 heroic 25m or further already. Kinda makes me frown. There are enough ez gear up instances.

[ieatcakelol]

Well apparently the original plan was to have Yogg-Saron the final boss of the nerubian raid. Not to mention their claims of there being a "nerubian faction" & an entire underground azjol-nerub zone. Unfortunately, blizzards lack of forethought and planning has cost us all amazing possibilities in regard to that, as it wouldn't really make that much sense to revisit it in a future expansion.

Utgarde raid, Troll raid, Azjol Nerub raid. Utgarde & Troll raids could have been a "joined" tier to replace TOC (although, toc wasn't too bad, it definitely could have fitted in somewhere) and the AN raid could have either been run in conjunction with Icecrown Citadel OR it could have been a entire wing of icecrown, used to sort of "break into" icecrown citadel from underneath. Black temple stylez.

So much potential in northrend, and most of the stories were centered around the lich king.. the vrykul pledging to the lich king, the scourge invasion of zul'drak which then caused the rebellion against their animal gods, corruption of the nerubians by both yogg-saron and the lich king of which are both "ended" now..

Naxxramas, Malygos, Sartharion

Ulduar (Loken being the "Final Boss"), TOC (? possibly moved to 3rd tier, three "mini-raids"?)

Utgarde Raid, Gundrak Raid

Icecrown Citadel, AN Raid (Yogg being the final boss here), Ruby Sanctum


Fucking DICKLOAD of content, they definitely could've drawn this expansion out much longer and satisfied players.

[lozzer]

Well an interesting fact was that Yogg saron was initially meant to be under azol nerub but was changed last minute to be the boss of uldaur. As since all the quests had already been written thats why we have faceless ones in old kingdom as well as that orc shadowsong blathering on about how close they are to yogg saron. Watcher Tyr was supposed to be the last boss of uldaur and it is why he is missing watcher whereas all others are present.

Ot I would have liked a gundrak raid as theres that huge building not even being used as where the rhino god is being chained up you can see gundrak underneath. I always though theyd bring in a za like place to gear up people as a alternate to naxx or uldaur.

[Sozeles]

Watcher Tyr was supposed to be the last boss of uldaur and it is why he is missing watcher whereas all others are present.

Wrong.

[vesseblah]

Well apparently the original plan was

<blahblahblah>

Fucking DICKLOAD of content, they definitely could've drawn this expansion out much longer and satisfied players.

Whiners need to understand something very important. It's very common that in all creative work stuff gets cut out in the editing room to make things smoother and more polished. I'm pretty sure all are familiar with the so-called 'directors' cut' movies which tend to be inferior to the originally released versions with very few exceptions.

WLK has very narrow theme revolving around Lich King, bloating the storyline with nerubians and vrykul and whatnot wouldn't have made it any better, just a jumbled mess like vanilla WoW was. A string of unconnected instances. Also Blizzard announced they want to make smaller expansions but more often, and in that light adding more stuff to one expansion would've been counterproductive.

[Revitalize]

TOC was kinda like a breath of fresh air in a dead game. But thats just me. I know for some people it was the opposite. Ulduar just never really captured my imagination. ICC is a blast though. TOC came and went /shrug.

I really like the idea of a Nerubian kingdom Raid. But in my opinion it should have came after Naxx.

I just hope if they put another instance in WotLK its soooooo hard that only the Top raiding guilds in the world can down it. Like item lvl 277 gear requirment to even have any chance at downing the boss. I know ICC has heroic modes. But knowing that guilds have cleared like 8/12 heroic 25m or further already. Kinda makes me frown. There are enough ez gear up instances.

How did you like ToC, but not ulduar?
Ulduar was probably the best raid in the times of wrath of the lich king.

[LeperHerring]

Whiners need to understand something very important. It's very common that in all creative work stuff gets cut out in the editing room to make things smoother and more polished. I'm pretty sure all are familiar with the so-called 'directors' cut' movies which tend to be inferior to the originally released versions with very few exceptions.

"Smoother and more polished" are hardly adjectives that fit WotLK. If anything the whole expansion can be characterized by cutting corners and cutting costs while trying to suck as much money out the the players with as little effort as possible.

Also Blizzard announced they want to make smaller expansions but more often, and in that light adding more stuff to one expansion would've been counterproductive.

Blizzard wants to push out more expansions with less content to suck more money out of players. The players want more content in the existing game. IMO, there should be no paid expansions ever and new content being added to the game should be covered in the monthly fee.