ret paladins and spell penetration

[charliew]

im not gunna bother to do spreadsheets or w/e but i was just about to gem my t10 legs ive just bought, and to my shock and horror i have a blue socket =S makes no sense to me why i should have one. but scrolling through all of the diffrent gems i could stick in it i thought to myself there all rather crappy, but then i came across a sell penetration gem n thought hmm we don't get armor penetration because are attacks are spells, so would it be an idea to put spell penetration gems in any stray blue slots we get?

just a retarded idea, be gentle.

[Crusader Strike]

Oh. My. Science.

Registering an account to say this was necessary:
I think you answered your own question. It is a retarded idea.

You understand that a blue gem doesn't have to go in a blue socket, yes? Put a Nightmare Tear or Bold Cardinal Ruby.

[Deleted]

Spell penetration is never used by any class in PvE(yes, including casters). Use the nightmare tear for meta.

[charliew]

thats what i usualy do buy i already have a nightmare tear in my chestpeice because i had a blue socket in there, so im rather stuck with what to do. and oh right thanks never had a idea about spell penetration before i just looked at it on my character stats window and it said reduces magical resistances so i thought hmm does that work?(in pve mind you) didn't know it was a pvp stat, never would since i can't stand pvp since resilience

[Aewyn89]

Holy does not have a resistance tree, and you never use -any- penetration, no matter the class, in PVE.

The only reason people use it in PVP, is because of buffs like Mark of the Wild and Shadow Prot which give resistance.

/thread

[Azyoulike]

Blue sockets are just red sockets with a +0 socket bonus

[Daez]

According to Sarah Palin, the R word is a slur.

Anyways, you have the wrong idea of what spell penetration does. It actually lowers resists of a mob/player. Its a pointless stat. You can argue it would be worthwhile in PvP if someone actually stacked resist, but when is the last time someone actually stacked resist gear in PvP? Mobs don't have very high resist to begin with. Oh, and holy has no resistance what-so-ever.

Throw a nightmare's tear in that slot if you don't have one in your gear and want to keep the socket bonus. You are better off going with strength/stamina than spell penetration.

[Daez]

The only reason people use it in PVP, is because of buffs like Mark of the Wild and Shadow Prot which give resistance.

The vast majority of people don't go near it in PvP either because its better to just buff your damage then get part of it resisted then not buff it and get rid of the resist. Its a pointless stat that will hopefully disappear in Cataclysm.

[charliew]

thanks all fore the realisation xD, never even looked at spell penetration before and who the hell is sarah palin?, and i have a nightmare tear in my gear already so ill just stick a stength gem in it most probs.

[Daez]

Blue sockets are just red sockets with a +0 socket bonus

This poster has a great point. The only socket bonuses you should worry about keeping are +5 strength or over. Other than that, you should be throwing in one nightmare's tear to activate your meta and gemming EVERY other socket with +20 strength (or +34 strength in 3 of them if you are a JC).

[Daez]

who the hell is sarah palin

Its probably better that you don't know!

[blackraptor]

I want to stab a kitten. There is no Holy resistance.

[Nillo]

1) Mobs don't have very high resist to begin with.

1) I'm pretty sure they have exactly 0 resistance, that's why noone gets spellpen (it would be good if they did have resistance)

This poster has a great point. The only socket bonuses you should worry about keeping are +5 strength or over. Other than that, you should be throwing in one nightmare's tear to activate your meta and gemming EVERY other socket with +20 strength (or +34 strength in 3 of them if you are a JC).

Where did you get that +5 from ? Isn't it more like +2-3 Str with t9 2p and +3-4 Str with t10 4p?




And one thing, that made me worried about this thread: The legs also have a YELLOW slot => you should never get the bonus unless this is the only blue slot in your gear (even a single +4 blue slot like in that 1 neck would be better and most chests/weapons have a + 6 Red/Blue )

[Horn]

Blue sockets are just red sockets with a +0 socket bonus

[MrWiggles]

1) I'm pretty sure they have exactly 0 resistance, that's why noone gets spellpen (it would be good if they did have resistance)

Boss mobs resist about 4-6% spell damage, but you can't lower it with spell pen, it's the glancing blows of casters

[Deleted]

The vast majority of people don't go near it in PvP either because its better to just buff your damage then get part of it resisted then not buff it and get rid of the resist. Its a pointless stat that will hopefully disappear in Cataclysm.

This is as incorrect as can be.

The most important stat for a caster in pvp is spell penetration, right after getting the necessary hit rating.

You will need to reduce your target's spell resistance to 0 in order to never miss crucial spells such as silences, fears, counterspells, cyclones, etc as well as not getin 25% of your damaging spells mitigated.

Mark of the wild is 75
Mages using mage armor 120
Priests shadowprotection 130
Paladins elemental resist auras 130
Mages (w. mage armor) and with either shadowprot or aura is 250, and is the only common case where resistances stack.

Since spell penetration is a faily cheap stat in terms of item budget, you will want to stack it up to 130 if you play a class that relies on landing gamebreaking spells without encountering partial or full resists. (Mages, Warlocks, Shadowpriests in particular).

However since there is no Nature or Arcane resist aura, boomkins, shamans and arcane mages may want to only go for 75 spell penetration, since Nature resist totems and Aspect of the wild (130 nature res) is rarely - if ever - used in pvp, and there is no arcane resistance that stacks higher than 75.

With that said, there is currently no Holy Resistance mechanic in the game, so spell penetration is entirely useless for paladins in pvp.

In PvE its useless for everybody, because there is no monsters in wrath of the lich king that has higher than 0 resistance.

So it's an outdated and quite inconsistent mechanic, but for me it makes PvP gearing a bit more interesting and thoughtful, rather than just "stack your mainstat in all sockets no exception"- type of choice that is true for some specs.

To answer your initial question about socketing; always ignore blue sockets (except 1 for nightmare tear) as a retpaladin in pve. Throw in a +20 strenght gem, it will always be a DPS increase.

[Sariella]

its better to just buff your damage then get part of it resisted then not buff it and get rid of the resist

Untrue for most casters. Debuffs can be resisted if the target has shadow resistance/MotW/Aura/Ect, and spell penetration reduces the chance this will happen as well as the other damage-affiliated boosts.