Fury - ArPen or Str?

[Gurkalicious]

Okay the title kinda says it all. I'm gearing my off spec for fights like saurfang where I go dps and the other 2 tanks well, tank! Okay so I've gotten 2 TBHs and I went fury but I stacked arpen as arms (I switched from arms cause I hated playing whack-a-mole with my action bars) so should I keep those arpen gems or should I regem str?

[Hakto]

sigh

[Gurkalicious]

sigh

I've looked at stickies and they say for 3.2 and it says gem str. But I don't really know if they're updated or old. I'm NEVER Dps until now. So I'm a little lost.

[Rurozan]

The fury warrior in my guild doing mad deeps is gemmed ArPen. Gotta have enough to hit 100% though, as far as I know. (Deathbringer's Will)

[Torrian]

I've looked at stickies and they say for 3.2 and it says gem str. But I don't really know if they're updated or old.

Check again: http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-warrior/*guide*-armor-penetration-for-dummies!/

It has been updated for 3.3

***HEELP STR OR ARP?!?!***

That depends on your gearlevel, do you have a Grim toll, Molnir runestone or Needle-Encrusted Scorpion? If you do, it would be your best interest to gem for arp until you reach the soft cap(read above).

No Molnir runestone, grim toll or Needle-Encrusted Scorpion? Can you reach more then ~75% passive arp(*This is a rough estimate and depends a lot on your current gear! Consult your spreadsheet to be certain*) without dropping your hit and expertise far below caps? If you can, then you should.

Dont have a either GT, MJ or NES(Lulz, funny abbreviation) and can't get that high passive ArP? Stack strength.

OBS: These are rough way lines, for the most precise answer, head over to Elitist jerks -> warrior forum -> Landsoul's spreadsheet.

[Shorteh]

The thing with ARp comes down to: if you can go full-out on it, do it - if you can't (for example, don't have the right trinket(s)) -> gem STR.

Ofcourse this isn't set in stone, and being smart when you gem can also increase your dps. (for example gemming to get a +8str bonus might not be a bad idea -> as long as the gem you put into the socket combined with the socket bonus is greater than the dps increase per point from 1 x20str)

[xxdrew]

short answer - If you can get to at least 75%+ passive arp with gear and gems alone and no procs, yes.

[Vanquisho]

short answer - If you can get to at least 75%+ passive arp with gear and gems alone and no procs, yes.

true

[Lotena]

As a fury warrior that recently went from a pure STR build to an ARP focused build, I can tell you without a doubt that in 90% of situations that dps really matters, armor penetration is indeed better. Even if you don't hit 75%, but the higher the percentage the better. You have to have the gear to support the plunge though, keeping hit/expertise/crit/etc at decent levels.

Armor penetration is awesome because it makes all of your other dps stats way more valuable. So if you put armor penetration as your primary focus while strength takes secondary stat slot, the benefits you do get from STR skyrocket. On a fairly static fight like Saurfang (10-man) after re-gemming to ARP (52% passive, 100% with NES proc at that time) I gained about 800-1k DPS over a plain STR build. It worked out extremely well for me personally, though I did notice a bit of a drop in 5-man instances but I think it was more due to things dying faster than an actual drop in output. If you have a set well balanced for the application, again, yeah. Definitely do it.

Though it was nice being at around 2400 str while it lasted.. *sigh*

[viau]

The poster above me talked about it a little. To start off, I would farm for NES in forge of soul. You can then gem to obtain 722 ArP. On trinket proc, you will be at 100%. If your dps gear is very good and has a lot of ArP, gemming even more for it will be even more beneficial for you. Until you can reach that 75 - 80% of ArP, I would farm NES and roll with that

[quez]

81% to be exact.

According to Landsouls thats the point when ARP will outweigh STR.

There is no exact sum of ArP where it outweighs strength that applies to everyone, it depends on a lot of factors.

That's why i emphasized on the "this is a rough estimate, check the spreadsheet" in my ArP-guide.

[Bathazar]

If you're going for the 75% that's about 1050 arp with just gear and gems aka no procs

[Racetrack]

As a fury warrior that recently went from a pure STR build to an ARP focused build, I can tell you without a doubt that in 90% of situations that dps really matters, armor penetration is indeed better. Even if you don't hit 75%, but the higher the percentage the better. You have to have the gear to support the plunge though, keeping hit/expertise/crit/etc at decent levels.

Armor penetration is awesome because it makes all of your other dps stats way more valuable. So if you put armor penetration as your primary focus while strength takes secondary stat slot, the benefits you do get from STR skyrocket. On a fairly static fight like Saurfang (10-man) after re-gemming to ARP (52% passive, 100% with NES proc at that time) I gained about 800-1k DPS over a plain STR build. It worked out extremely well for me personally, though I did notice a bit of a drop in 5-man instances but I think it was more due to things dying faster than an actual drop in output. If you have a set well balanced for the application, again, yeah. Definitely do it.

Though it was nice being at around 2400 str while it lasted.. *sigh*

I'm interested what your passive ArP was when you regemmed to gain around 1k DPS.

[Astray]

Hi! I'm going to board this ship topic and take for myself, since its about arp.^.^

My situation:
I have Needle-Encrusted Scorpion as trinket number one and WFS as the second. Right now i'm at the arp softcap as arms, and slightly away from it as fury. I though a lot about how to spend my badges and if it was worth getting the T10pc4 bonus and since i plan to use my equipment for both fury and arms, i think its not. The exact choice is T10.251 VS Gatecrasher's and Castle Breakers. I'm gemming for STR right now.

The Question is:
Without gemming for arp, i may soon reach the point where i will be over the softcap with NES.
The consequence would be: get a replacement for NES and stack arp.

Since i don't raid 25 mans at all DBW and Deaths Verdict will never fall into my hands. The only replacements are Mirror of Truth and Banner of Victory.

What would you do?
- use weaker trinket, hardcap arp
- accept to be a bit oversoftcapped
- use gear without arp to stay under softcap

[Kazilius]

81% to be exact.

According to Landsouls thats the point when ARP will outweigh STR.

81% may Be the point at which it outweighs, but he's saying it starts stacking better once you reach 75%. Anything before that and your not really going to notice a difference. this arp vs str is not hard to figure out. if you can reach 75% (which is not hard with a couple pieces of icc 25, then do it.. this is why you see people gem arp. if you reach your soft cap and your satisfied with the results then gem str.. this is why you see people gem partially str. this all assuming you meet your caps.

[RPZip]

81% may Be the point at which it outweighs, but he's saying it starts stacking better once you reach 75%. Anything before that and your not really going to notice a difference. this arp vs str is not hard to figure out.

Other than that being a number he pulled directly out of his ass, it's a well-reasoned and thought out post.

Wait, what?

[jarbulldog]

I would say once you are mainly icc gear and 245 gear and above goto arp, I am 955 arp from gear alone, i use a 1360 as hard cap because I use arp food, spreads say that food gives most dps

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...&cn=Jarbulldog

my issue is now, i am over crit cap and switching my cloak to the str one

[Kazilius]

Other than that being a number he pulled directly out of his ass, it's a well-reasoned and thought out post.

Wait, what?

which number? 75 or 81%? I'm just referencing what I saw on the scale charts. Point is: ArP doesn't stack well until you get high amounts and people seem to be having an issue deciding when to go one way or the other. there are countless numbers of these posts.

[Lotena]

I'm interested what your passive ArP was when you regemmed to gain around 1k DPS.

I went from around 28% armor penetration to 53% (I may have had a few gear changes to help bring it up, I can't recall), and got the needle encrusted scorpion to make soft cap if I'm not mistaken. I'm not trying to sound like I am speaking authoratively or anything, I've had an awful lot of gear changes that have impacted my DPS single target heavily, but I am certain that the ArP change was definitely the biggest jump up, given a competent 10 man raid. I could totally be wrong about that 800-1k figure though.

[Deleted]

There is no real percentage where ArP is better then Str. It is individual.
For example, with my current gear, ArP starts to give more dps then Str on 60% (without any procctrinket).