Page 1 of 2
1
2
LastLast
  1. #1

    Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    http://www.wowarmory.com/character-t...ncloth&group=1

    That's my armory.

    Basically here's the thing, I know my role is more of a support healer and I'm ok with that. I just cant shake the feeling that I should be performing better than I am right now. I know my gear doesn't completely fit into the spectrum of the ideal holy setup, but nonetheless I'm confident I'm pretty ridiculously geared. Some pieces are in place because of the occasional disc I would swap to on certain fights which is no longer needed. I recently replaced sp/int gems with sp/haste. Main reason, my crit is stupid high right now, somewhere around 32% give or take self buffed. My haste is a little low, around 12.5% self buffed. Thus why I gemmed haste. Dropped my mana pool by about 3k and yet I have absolutely ZERO mana issues. I couldn't run low on mana if I tried, and believe me I try. I am just over 4k sp raid buffed, so any amount more mixed with my crit and I'm feeling like it would be wasted on overheal.

    So here's the thing. Pulling 4-5k hps is common in icc if I step it up, but more frequently is 3.5-4k. For the record on fights like blood queen and fester I can push over 7k hps. I know part of that is the skill of my raid members avoiding damage and there just not being a need for me to heal. But overall and on most boss fights, two much less geared resto druids and one of our holy pally's(also less geared) can out heal the crap outta me. Even our less geared resto shaman can top me every once in awhile. In both hps and overall healing done. Yes I usually have less overhealing, but it isn't by much, especially with the somewhat sudden rise in my crit %. So I've come to the conclusion that I'm doing something wrong. Can you guys point me in the right direction of proper healing techniques or if anything, ease my mind on this whole thing? I am currently geared the 4th ranked holy priest on one of the most populated server's Mal'Ganis, but don't feel even close to the type of performer I feel I should be. I don't know it all, but I've done A LOT of research and dedicated a lot of time to trying different spec's, different healing styles and any other form of experimentation, not to mention successfully raided the past 6 months straight. So I'd like to say I have a handle on what I'm doing, at least to the point of not being a complete window licker. This is driving me nuts, please help!!!

    Thanks in advance.

  2. #2

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    first 2 things i noticed were

    1. you say u dont have any mana problems at all but u have a meta that gives u mana back, i would drop that for the 25 sp/2% int

    2. the glyph of prayer of healing. i personally hardly ever use it because of the mana cost but even then the glyph itself sucks, everybody will be topped off before those couple of ticks even get off, i use glyph of renew

    also i dont understand why people are getting serendipity, holy priests should never have to use greater heal at all , if they do then the holy pally(s) are failing hard. i grabbed mental agility in disc tree since circle, pom, and renews are all instant.

    when i first got rid of it and tested it out i lasted much much longer with my mana even though i wasnt having problems 2 begin with it, it made me pretty much never run out and if i got close i would pop my fiend during lust and its gg full mana.

    these are just suggestions on what i would try out and toy with.

  3. #3

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Your spec kinda sucks, first off. Empowered/Improved Healing are generally really bad talents. And 2 points in Surge of Light is generally not a wise investment, where one can suffice. You do get cool points for running with Body and Soul, though.

    I'd say start running something like this: Refined Spec
    The last glyph is open to debate between Prayer and Renew. I personally feel that the Prayer glyph is exceptionally weak, but that's my own opinion.


    Okay, now onto actual effectiveness output. You're right in the statement of the fact that lesser geared Druids can "outheal the crap out of" you. That's just the way they're designed on encounters. And Paladins have the single target that can't be touched by anyone else, plus their splash out, and Beacon. >.>

    And it's good to know that you can't touch that, but your output "limitations" have something that neither class brings, in multi-target burst. Druids can blanket a raid and have HoTs ticking each and every half-second, thus having inflated HPS numbers. But those don't bring people up to safe levels, they just keep them there.

    For a playstyle tip, I'd actually just like to suggest find more places to use Prayer, with or without Serendipity stacks. If you can even hit three people in the same group, it's worth using a Prayer first, Circle to clean up as second. Many Priests nowadays are pushing Prayer off their bar, but that's basically making you into a crappy Druid that has Wild Growth do 100% of its healing upfront. That's bad, and a waste of your spot.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  4. #4

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    TY for the advice so far, that's what I need. I guess I should touch on my playing style. I'm more of a reactive healer, as I feel I should be. Personally I'm a fan of POH and prefer it by far over renew. I find that I use it often with the COH clean up combo. I guess I just keep feeling that by adding renew to a target that already has or is soon to have everything our druids can throw at them is a waste, but maybe that's where I'm wrong. I also am an avid user of flash heal, maybe too much, but with the quick cast time, and the perfect amount of heal "size" it seems to fit in more often than other heals. Probably because I'm one of those nitpick healers that cant stand to see a raid member that isn't topped off, even if renew is ticking on them. But a 7-10k heal seems to fit where a 14-40k GH is too much and a renew just isn't quite fast enough. I also use POM often and when there's not a disc in the group bubble tanks and more frequently anyone in need now. Body and soul ROCKS and has saved many a raid member on countless fights. Not to mention get anyone within range back to the boss faster after a wipe :-)

  5. #5

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Quote Originally Posted by Oden
    TY for the advice so far, that's what I need. I guess I should touch on my playing style. I'm more of a reactive healer, as I feel I should be. Personally I'm a fan of POH and prefer it by far over renew. I find that I use it often with the COH clean up combo. I guess I just keep feeling that by adding renew to a target that already has or is soon to have everything our druids can throw at them is a waste, but maybe that's where I'm wrong. I also am an avid user of flash heal, maybe too much, but with the quick cast time, and the perfect amount of heal "size" it seems to fit in more often than other heals. Probably because I'm one of those nitpick healers that cant stand to see a raid member that isn't topped off, even if renew is ticking on them. But a 7-10k heal seems to fit where a 14-40k GH is too much and a renew just isn't quite fast enough. I also use POM often and when there's not a disc in the group bubble tanks and more frequently anyone in need now. Body and soul ROCKS and has saved many a raid member on countless fights. Not to mention get anyone within range back to the boss faster after a wipe :-)
    As much as I would like to say that "you can play how you want", you have to adjust to the content at hand. In ICC, Blizz wants to take the approach of steady damage (through auras) instead of spikes where people die in a GCD or 2 if they don't get a heal. Of course, holy priests being the best at burst healing, this is a huge detriment to our abilities. That is why you see many holy priests going to a renew build. Alot of priests don't like it either (self included), but it is the reality at hand.

    That isn't saying PoH or FH are bad, but rather they are more "go-to" spells than instinctual. Flash heal (usually a SoL proc) is my cleanup spell when someone needs that little push. PoH is a spell I use on a few fights but there is no reason to cast this spell often in any ICC fight. GH should be no where near your cast bar at all, especially in 25-man. If one person needs a 10k+ heal at any time, chances are they got hit by something they shouldn't have.

  6. #6

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Quote Originally Posted by Walkitout
    1. you say u dont have any mana problems at all but u have a meta that gives u mana back, i would drop that for the 25 sp/2% int

    also i dont understand why people are getting serendipity, holy priests should never have to use greater heal at all , if they do then the holy pally(s) are failing hard. i grabbed mental agility in disc tree since circle, pom, and renews are all instant.
    imo don't drop insightful meta until you have exhausted all other sources for dropping regen; regem everything else & try to drop spirit pieces for crit/haste prior to this as it's HEAVILY over budget compared to other meta gems.

    You shouldn't be speccing into mental agility if you dont have mana problems.... waste the points into empowered healing if you really dont want to get serendipity but you probably should just be replaced by a druid at that point.

  7. #7

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti
    Your spec kinda sucks, first off. Empowered/Improved Healing are generally really bad talents. And 2 points in Surge of Light is generally not a wise investment, where one can suffice. You do get cool points for running with Body and Soul, though.

    I'd say start running something like this: Refined Spec
    The last glyph is open to debate between Prayer and Renew. I personally feel that the Prayer glyph is exceptionally weak, but that's my own opinion.


    Okay, now onto actual effectiveness output. You're right in the statement of the fact that lesser geared Druids can "outheal the crap out of" you. That's just the way they're designed on encounters. And Paladins have the single target that can't be touched by anyone else, plus their splash out, and Beacon. >.>

    And it's good to know that you can't touch that, but your output "limitations" have something that neither class brings, in multi-target burst. Druids can blanket a raid and have HoTs ticking each and every half-second, thus having inflated HPS numbers. But those don't bring people up to safe levels, they just keep them there.

    For a playstyle tip, I'd actually just like to suggest find more places to use Prayer, with or without Serendipity stacks. If you can even hit three people in the same group, it's worth using a Prayer first, Circle to clean up as second. Many Priests nowadays are pushing Prayer off their bar, but that's basically making you into a crappy Druid that has Wild Growth do 100% of its healing upfront. That's bad, and a waste of your spot.
    I'm sorry but, that has to be some of the worst advice I've ever read. Aswell as the spec, honestly.

    To start with, PoH IS and SHOULD be one of the most used heal you have, in raids nowerdays, there's a ton of AoE healing going on, your rotation should be:

    3x Flash heal to get 3 stacks of Serendipity, ready for the AoE moment, then when the raid starts taking alot of damage, use PoH straight into CoH followed by your instant flash heal (which you will have, I don't think there's ever been a time I haven't had it after PoH+CoH) - repeat.

    PoM should be used on cooldown, same with CoH aswell. Renew's should be being put on the tanks at all times, and renew should really only be used on the DPS when there's not much raid damage going on. As soon as the raid damage happens, it's back to the above rotation again. Make sure you're always using 3 flash heals to get PoH to be a quick cast.

    To recap:

    Raid is taking alot of damage: PoH > CoH > Flash heal (Either two or three, if there's too much raid damage going on I usually do two so I can get back into PoH again) - repeat (With PoM being used on CD)

    Not much raid damage going on: PoM > Renew on anyone you like or taking damage > Flash heals (Keeping Serendipity at 3 stacks ready for the raid damage for quick PoH)

    To finish, I'd also like to say that the spec that was given by this user is wrong, very wrong. Reasons being:

    1. Divine Fury is VERY pointless, no Holy Priest should be using greater heal, it's too long of a cast, serendipity gives a buff, and you should be using your AoE heals. I use Greater heal a MAXIMUM of 3 times in some raids, sometimes not even using it at all.

    2. Surge of Light - This is a MUST 2/2, I don't understand why this person has even considered one point in it out of two. 25% is a big difference, it entitles you to almost always have that instant flash heal after that PoH+CoH cast.

    3. 3/3 Blessed Resilience is also a MUST. 2/3 just doesn't cut it, you're losing out on 1% healing, seeing that you're constantly healing, it's just a must, you're healing, so you want your heals to add up to more healing! HEALING!


    Apart from that, there's not much else wrong with the spec, I'll include a spec that I use, also followed by reasons. http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#bVcbuZfvzcbMqihhcuAo

    1. 4/5 Spell Warding (in place of Divine Fury) - Let's face it, most raid damage is caused by spells, why not mitigate it for yourself, keep yourself alive a bit more.

    2. No body and soul? - That's because you don't need it, if you ever have to move you have 3 instant cast spells you can use whilst moving, besides, most times you have to move a simple jump away from your normal spot, just press PoM in that current time, or renew, or CoH.

    I think...I've included everything, hopefully. Oh and, the glyph of PoH is indeed good, it's 20% of it's initial heal over 6 seconds, in almost any circumstance if the raid is taking damage it's going to be happening after you use PoM, so the heal adds to meters, and helps keep people up. It's not AMAZING, but it's definitely worth using in my opinion.

    I hope this helps! Using what I've said here usually enables me to be #1 on healing meters (when it doesn't count overhealing) with just Tier 9 gear, against healers with 3000+GS

  8. #8

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Looking at your gems, I wouldn't be going for Haste. Haste is a great stat, don't get me wrong, but as Holy you have two main spells that benefit 0% from haste, CoH and PoM. I would gem pure SP, with some SP/Int in there because if you're OOM, your HPS is hitting the floor; plus you only have 24k mana. SP effects every single one of your heals, whether it's PoH, CoH, PoM, or Renew. The one thing you have to watch out for is overhealing, because even if you have 3400 SP for example, if you're overhealing 500 per cast, that extra healing is useless. Either way though, I say dump gemming spirit anymore then you need to in order to meet Meta requirements and don't gem Haste.

    At the same time, unless you are doing hardmodes, Spell Warding is quite useless. I've personally favored having that GH cast time lowered in my back pocket then taking 8-10% less damage. It's a lot on you though, I personally don't suck and don't get hit by enough shit to warrant needing -8-10% damage done, it's never been the deciding factor in any death i've experienced in a raid nor will it ever be. The more healing I take, the less overhealing I'll do when I heal the raid. To me, both Divine Fury and Spell Warding are useless, up to you on how good your other healers are.

    Body and Soul is pretty useless for raiding imo. I can see where it "could" be useful, but it's just not necessary. Tell people to stop sucking and run when they have to run.

    Insightful is the only good meta gem for healers. I know people like to look at the other ones and think they're useful, but they just don't come close to the output granted by Insightful, don't change it.

    Holy Priests are generally the lowest HPS atm, it's just a fact, don't cry yourself to sleep because you arn't topping meters vs Shamans/Druids.

    As for the rotation, I generally like to find the peak in damage and get my PoHs in there. For example, Putricide, when you know everyone is about to eat the green slime explosion, get that PoH going as they eat it. FH around with CoH/PoM on CD and you'll always have Serendipity up for AoE damage spikes. PoM on CD is a must, everytime it's up, drop it like it's hot.

    As mentioned, I also like to keep renews rolling on the tanks at all times, it's wasted HPS if it's not up.

    One thing to take note of is that Healing Focus is essentially useless. Almost nothing unless it's direct damage will interrupt your casts, which unless your tanking the mob will never happen. I could go into details about why, but just google the topic or look it up on EJ., it's pretty useless for PvE.

    Bio's spec is pretty good, I would just lose Healing Focus for some other stuff.

  9. #9

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Please, for the love of all that is Holy, don't listen to Drizel. No pun intended.

    1. Haste works to lower your GCD and therefor works on CoH and PoM. Horrible advice.
    2. SW/DF is playstyle based, if you don't use GH don't take DF and SW is the best filler.
    3. Holy without Body and Soul is a wasted raid spot.
    4. Insightful is the easiest Meta to take, but is not the only viable meta as a healer.
    5. Healers don't have rotations.
    6. Holy does have the worst healing of the healers, but keeping Renews up on tanks isn't going to change anything.
    7. Healing Focus is required in ICC on several encounters.
    8. The spec mentioned as 'pretty good' is 'barely okay', but for completely different reasons than listed. 2/2 SoL is never a good idea and IF is a waste in ICC. Taking 2/2 Body and Soul is superior.

    At some point I'm just going to give up and stop caring that the Priest community is so unreliable.

  10. #10

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Quote Originally Posted by Walkitout
    also i dont understand why people are getting serendipity
    I stopped reading right there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Biohazard_4
    I'm sorry but, that has to be some of the worst advice I've ever read. Aswell as the spec, honestly.

    To start with, PoH IS and SHOULD be one of the most used heal you have, in raids nowerdays, there's a ton of AoE healing going on, your rotation should be:

    3x Flash heal to get 3 stacks of Serendipity, ready for the AoE moment, then when the raid starts taking alot of damage, use PoH straight into CoH followed by your instant flash heal (which you will have, I don't think there's ever been a time I haven't had it after PoH+CoH) - repeat.

    PoM should be used on cooldown, same with CoH aswell. Renew's should be being put on the tanks at all times, and renew should really only be used on the DPS when there's not much raid damage going on. As soon as the raid damage happens, it's back to the above rotation again. Make sure you're always using 3 flash heals to get PoH to be a quick cast.

    To recap:

    Raid is taking alot of damage: PoH > CoH > Flash heal (Either two or three, if there's too much raid damage going on I usually do two so I can get back into PoH again) - repeat (With PoM being used on CD)

    Not much raid damage going on: PoM > Renew on anyone you like or taking damage > Flash heals (Keeping Serendipity at 3 stacks ready for the raid damage for quick PoH)
    i dont see why you say Kelesti is wrong... you are both saying PoH is a good spell and should be used.
    anyway, you cant say this is wrong and that is right (to certain extend)
    for me atleast, the fun part about healing, it is that it's all depending on the situation, sometimes this is better, sometimes that. And a part of being a good healer is knowing when to do the right thing, and obviously it also depends on your healing setup.

    if you want a fixed rotation, if you want every fight to be the same, dont play a healer.

    and yes, its also possible that on the same boss you use a different approach the next raid (becouse it also depends on how good your friends are in avoiding the fire and nuking the right target etc etc)

    2. Surge of Light - This is a MUST 2/2, I don't understand why this person has even considered one point in it out of two. 25% is a big difference, it entitles you to almost always have that instant flash heal after that PoH+CoH cast.
    not really, PoH + CoH is 11 for SoL to proc, depending on your crit, the difference between 1/2 and 2/2 for a SoL proc after a 11heal combo is probably around a 5% difference for proc chance
    (not exact numbers, but if you want i can do them, but if you google they are probably out there)

    I think...I've included everything, hopefully. Oh and, the glyph of PoH is indeed good, it's 20% of it's initial heal over 6 seconds, in almost any circumstance if the raid is taking damage it's going to be happening after you use PoM, so the heal adds to meters, and helps keep people up. It's not AMAZING, but it's definitely worth using in my opinion.

    I hope this helps! Using what I've said here usually enables me to be #1 on healing meters (when it doesn't count overhealing) with just Tier 9 gear, against healers with 3000+GS
    the heal is PoH isnt that big and depending on what your doing, play style and raid setup i cant say its a must.

    and being #1 on healing doesnt mean much, again depends on raid setup, how good your other healers are, and how hard the content is.


    btw Biohazard, i'm not saying you are doing it all wrong, i just want to say - and this is for alot of ppl here - not everything is black and white
    ppl just want This is right and everything else is wrong

    thats something blizzard hates, thats also why they are changing all talents and how they work and thats also why blizzard tries to avoid homogenation.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreamless
    Heh, ahh the internet. Where the 'glass is half full' and 'glass is half empty' people are both shouted down by the heaving masses of "WAAAAH! I WANT A FULL GLASS! WAAAAAAAH!'

  11. #11

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Quote Originally Posted by harky
    4. Insightful is the easiest Meta to take, but is not the only viable meta as a healer.
    Now, do you mean easiest to find on the AH or the easiest one to activate?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rtwo
    not really, PoH + CoH is 11 for SoL to proc, depending on your crit, the difference between 1/2 and 2/2 for a SoL proc after a 11heal combo is probably around a 5% difference for proc chance
    (not exact numbers, but if you want i can do them, but if you google they are probably out there)
    Lets do some math for SoL, using the OP crit chance and glyphs.
    Proc = 1 - (1 - C/2)^n. - This is for 2/2 Surge of Light
    Proc = 1 - (1 - C/4)^n. - This is for 1/2 Surge of Light
    Proc = Chance of SoL proc
    C = Crit Percentage (where 1.0 = 100%)
    n = number of chances to proc (n = 2 for Binding Heal, n = 5 for CoH, n = 6 for glyphed COH, PoH with a group that has 2 hunters n = 7!)

    Proc = 1 - (1 - .3155/2)^(6 + 11) = 84.87% chance to proc SoL by doing a PoH + glyph CoH combo + 2/2 SoL

    Proc = 1 - (1 - .3155/4)^(6 + 11) = 59.50% chance to proc SoL by doing a PoH + glyph CoH combo + 1/2 SoL

    Also, you have to understand that using SoL is sometimes less useful than say tossing out a renew or something else. SoL is just a front loaded FH(as opposed to back loaded) that is free but can not crit.

  12. #12

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Quote Originally Posted by fabian
    Now, do you mean easiest to find on the AH or the easiest one to activate?
    Easiest to gear around. ESD is easier to activate, but also has high regen requirements before it's useful as Holy.

  13. #13

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    And harky, you missed telling him that at no point should you listen to this:
    Quote Originally Posted by Biohazard_4
    3x Flash heal to get 3 stacks of Serendipity [...]- repeat.
    [...]
    Make sure you're always using 3 flash heals to get PoH to be a quick cast.
    Really? So you like delaying your casts just to get one out "faster". Lemme know when 3.6 second set up suddenly lets you cast Prayer 2 seconds ago.

    the glyph of PoH is indeed good, it's 20% of it's initial heal over 6 seconds, in almost any circumstance if the raid is taking damage it's going to be happening after you use PoM
    I've given reasons why the Prayer glyph is your choice versus Renew.
    so the heal adds to meters
    And if you're making decisions off of that over effectiveness, then you're bad.
    and helps keep people up.
    If it even ticks, it's to weak to "keep people up". Bring a druid.
    It's not AMAZING, but it's definitely worth using in my opinion.
    If you had a fourth glyph slot, it would be worth using, but not your third.

    I hope this helps! Using what I've said here usually enables me to be #1 on healing meters (when it doesn't count overhealing)
    Because healing meters are skill right?
    with just Tier 9 gear, against healers with 3000+GS
    You must have really, really shitty druids.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  14. #14

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti
    And harky, you missed telling him that at no point should you listen to this[...]
    Yeah, well... now I want to stick my head in a microwave. Thanks.

  15. #15

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    harky

    1. Haste works to lower your GCD and therefor works on CoH and PoM. Horrible advice.
    True

    2. SW/DF is playstyle based, if you don't use GH don't take DF and SW is the best filler.
    True

    3. Holy without Body and Soul is a wasted raid spot.
    False. It's not needed. I don't need to explain again. Move out of the fire, use an instant spell. There's other classes for dispelling the poison, it's pointless. Just do your job like every other class, and move, stop wasting your talents because you want it slightly easier, and anyway, you have to cast PW:S to activate it, you could be moving and casting PoM/CoH/Renews on people in that time.

    5. Healers don't have rotations.
    They don't, but they have priorities, like the ones I listed, I said "rotation" because I was talking about stacking serendipity before PoH, which is a rotation.

    6. Holy does have the worst healing of the healers, but keeping Renews up on tanks isn't going to change anything.
    No. Just no. Renew must be kept up on tanks at all times. Even if it's overhealing the tank, it needs to be kept on, it's almost damage mitigation for the tank. If the tank takes a 30k damage hit, it'll be down to 20k when all the HoT's go.

    7. Healing Focus is required in ICC on several encounters.
    That's one of the reasons I spec into it, just because I won't lose casting time if it's needed. Another example is Mimiron Phase 2, when the raid is taking damage, Healing Focus is, in my opinion, a wise choice.

    8. The spec mentioned as 'pretty good' is 'barely okay', but for completely different reasons than listed. 2/2 SoL is never a good idea and IF is a waste in ICC. Taking 2/2 Body and Soul is superior.
    There were two specs mentioned, if you're refering to mine, I'd rethink your idea of a 'good spec', and stop kidding yourself about Body and Soul, whilst it is *useful* it's a waste of two talent points in terms of *need*

    You say 2/2 SoL is never a good idea, but don't backup your theory. 2/2 IS useful in terms of it scales with every single one of your heal crits including PoM bounces, thats a 50% chance and instant flash heals all the time, at no mana cost. Forgive me if I'm wrong but not speccing into it is a stupid idea.

    Inner Focus goes stupidly well with Divine Hymn, I don't understand how you can say moving quickly is better than ~80k-90k healing over 8 seconds free of charge.

    Rtwo

    i dont see why you say Kelesti is wrong... you are both saying PoH is a good spell and should be used.
    anyway, you cant say this is wrong and that is right (to certain extend)
    for me atleast, the fun part about healing, it is that it's all depending on the situation, sometimes this is better, sometimes that. And a part of being a good healer is knowing when to do the right thing, and obviously it also depends on your healing setup.

    if you want a fixed rotation, if you want every fight to be the same, dont play a healer.
    Of course I can say what is wrong and right, or to a greater extent, what is good and what is not so good. Simple mathematics predicts the usefullness of talents and skills; at the end of the day a healer's job is to simply heal, talents which increase the amount of healing done, the rate of healing or the ability to react to required healing quickly are talents which you should be taking, and this is a quantifiable amount. Maths doesn't lie.

    Okay I just want to clear this up, when I said rotation I meant serendipity & PoH, the rest of the list I put was priorities, for example PoM comes before PoH/CoH.

    not really, PoH + CoH is 11 for SoL to proc, depending on your crit, the difference between 1/2 and 2/2 for a SoL proc after a 11heal combo is probably around a 5% difference for proc chance
    (not exact numbers, but if you want i can do them, but if you google they are probably out there)
    That was an example (PoH&CoH) - Think about the all the other heals you're doing too, Prayer of Mending bounces can proc Surge of Light, that gives each bounce (crit) 50% instead of 25% - Think about the mana saving also with free flash heals. It's worth it.

    the heal is PoH isnt that big and depending on what your doing, play style and raid setup i cant say its a must.
    I REALLY hope you're talking about the glyph there, because PoH is definitely a must in terms of raid healing, you're a Holy Priest, if you don't want to use your AoE heals go be a Paladin or something..
    If you're talking about the glyph, I didn't say it was a must, I even said "It's not AMAZING" - I merely stated that in my opinion it's worth it to have that glyph, followed by my reason.

    Kelesti

    Really? So you like delaying your casts just to get one out "faster". Lemme know when 3.6 second set up suddenly lets you cast Prayer 2 seconds ago.
    If you bothered to read everything I put, I included that after a CoH&PoM if the raid is still taking damage you'll want to cast one or two flash heals instead of the actual three needed for it to cut time.

    I've given reasons why the Prayer glyph is your choice versus Renew.
    ..and I never favoured either of the two? o.O

    And if you're making decisions off of that over effectiveness, then you're bad.
    This is true, but it's nice of you to actually quote this to spite me when you didn't read the next bit "and helps keep people up", let's move on to that, shall we?

    If it even ticks, it's to weak to "keep people up". Bring a druid.
    Say you cast a 4500 PoH, that equals to 900 damage over 6 seconds, that x5 = 4500 healing, ontop of the heals you're currently casting, it's a nice thing to have, but it's not needed, but then again, I never said it was.

    If you had a fourth glyph slot, it would be worth using, but not your third.
    No, my third

    Because healing meters are skill right?
    Did I say it was? I'm not the one who was complaining I wasn't top of healing, it was the OP stating he wasn't anywhere near the other people on healing meters. Besides, if Healing Done doesn't scale with Overhealing Done, it does show you're effectively doing more healing to the raid than other people. It could also mean you might have been topping up some other person when someone else dies, but I wasn't saying it to say 'I'm pro', I was saying it to show that the AoE healing is infact effective.

    You must have really, really shitty druids.
    No, I just know how to conserve mana and be able to completely spam my AoE heals, and keep renews on everyone that's possibly taking damage.

  16. #16

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    You not understanding how to properly use Body and Soul is not going to help your case in the least. All it does is exposes your poor understanding of the Priest class. The talk of stacking Serendipity specifically to use PoH is further evidence that shows how detached your ideas are from proper play. Sorry, but you're so far off on so many things that I'm struggling to determine if you're an unfunny troll, or if you're really as bad as your posts imply. I'm leaning towards the latter.

  17. #17

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Quote Originally Posted by harky
    You not understanding how to properly use Body and Soul is not going to help your case in the least. All it does is exposes your poor understanding of the Priest class. The talk of stacking Serendipity specifically to use PoH is further evidence that shows how detached your ideas are from proper play. Sorry, but you're so far off on so many things that I'm struggling to determine if you're an unfunny troll, or if you're really as bad as your posts imply. I'm leaning towards the latter.
    Well, as you have simply stated how wrong I am, instead of giving any alternative suggestions, or your perhaps disillusioned 'correct way to play a priest', i can only assume that you are sore about being corrected. This topic was created in order to help a player, the previous posts have done so. Please add to the topic with corrections to what has been posted or don't bother posting at all. Your last post added nothing to this topic other than unecessary friction. Thankyou.

  18. #18

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    I have no interest rehashing the following:

    1. Why Body and Soul is a vital talent.
    - This has been the case since ToC and is even more helpful in ICC. This has nothing to do with only being useful if you play poorly and has a good use on every single boss in ICC which do not relate in any way to having poor reaction time.

    2. Why Flash Heal should not be cast specifically to stack Serendipity.
    - Been talked about in several hundred posts by now. Using Flash Heal specifically to stack Serendipity slows down your healing, rather than speeding it up. The cast time reduction does not offset the minimum GCD requirement to stack it. This is complicated further by precasting.

    3. Holy rolling Renew does not make Holy any more, or less viable.
    - Been talked about all over. Priests in general have worse heals than the other healing classes. They spend more mana for less healing, but can typically react a hair faster. Doing something which another class can do better in every way does not make up for any shortcomings.

    4. 2/2 SoL is bad.
    - Been talked about so many times my brain is going numb. 1/2 SoL is superior to 2/2 SoL for Renew specs because the instant crit-free FH produced by SoL is highly situational and 1/2 SoL provides enough up-time to make use of it. 0/2 SoL, or 1/2 SoL is superior to 2/2 SoL for Flash Heal specs. The reason here is because SoL reduces throughput when spamming Flash Heal on a tank, or the raid.

    5. Inner Focus is crappy.
    - The argument that it's great with Hymn is silly. There is one fight in ICC where Hymn is used and it is not used for its own healing. Spending a talent point on something which will rarely be used is silly and the effect even when used together is minimal. Inner Focus was good in a specific strategy on a single fight in ToGC25 and good before that due to mana gains. Neither are important to ICC content.


    Why should I 'debate' things which have been beaten to death? These are things people know and have known for a long time now. The fact that people do not know this, or can't be bothered to do the minimal amount of research needed to figure these things out is pathetic.

  19. #19

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    Thanks for all the advice, keep it coming. Currently I'm attempting a spec Kelesti recommended. Which is the one my armory link probably currently shows. I wish I had a way to lock the spec I previously had so people could make suggestions based on that. Nonetheless I have had no attempt to really try this spec with the exception of uld 10 hm's we did today for rusted proto. 2 healing with a paladin and we did just fine, but again, not a real test yet.

    To clarify one thing. With all the things that I've done that would reduce my overall mana pool or increase spell mana cost and even lower mana regen. I still have ZERO mana issues. Even our elite paladin is jealous of me. I don't mind standing and waiting for incoming damage, sometimes I'll even dps to be active, but I don't want that to be confused with my ability to madly spam spells at will throughout a chaotic encounter. I use the term madly in a loose sense, there is a method to the madness, but giving an example of the fact I can go all out for a 5 min fight and be at maybe 50% mana pool when done, my regen is insane to say the least. Hence why I no longer felt a 33k raid buffed mana pool was needed, and am even beginning to think that my low haste is keeping me from spamming as fast as I should be.

    One more thing. I'm right around 4k sp raid buffed, with my current 35-38% crit raid buffed. Can anyone touch on the effectiveness of gemming straight sp at this point? I'd like to see some info that would make me understand the extra sp would go straight to overhealing.

    Thanks again all.

  20. #20

    Re: Tell me what I'm doing wrong? Well geared holy

    One note on that spec is that unless your Paladin is specifically keeping up Conc, with Imp. Conc, 2/2 Healing Focus and 4/5 Holy Spec is superior than 1/2 and 5/5. If you do, then yeah, that's fine.

    In regards to the SP/Haste balance: Your Haste is extremely low. The higher your SP/Crit go the more you'll get out of Haste. At the point you're at you might actually consider moving to SP/Haste in red, straight Haste in yellow and either SP/Spi, or Haste/Spi for blue. It's not something I'd usually recommend, but it's also very rare to see a Holy Priest in T10 as low on haste as you are. You're back in T7/8 haste levels, which are workable, but I'd recommend working more towards around 20-25% haste.


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •