Hard modes - Triggered vs. Toggled?

[nicsicsix]

Triggered meaning they work the way they did in ulduar, where its the same instance, but changes mechanics to make the fight harder


Toggled means you just click your portrait and switch to Heroic raid



personally, i think triggered is just generally better
blizzard cited communication being easier with toggled hard modes, where it can be sometimes hard to get all raiders doing hardmode mechanics
personally, I think that makes little sense, If your the kind of guild that's doing hard-modes, you wouldn't have the kind of raider who wouldn't understand changing mechanics. (and if hardmodes are tuned so you can get away with that, then blizzard is doing it wrong)

i really think the the Triggered in raid hardmodes are better, but I'm always open to hearing different



think of it like a petition, if blizzard realizes people prefered to trigger them, we'll get em back =D

[Nangz]

Triggered, has because it usually is harder to activate than toggled.

Examples: you can't do xt hardmode if you don't have the dps.

You CAN do herioc icc if you bring someone who killed LK

[Thetruth1400]

Triggered, has because it usually is harder to activate than toggled.

Examples: you can do xt hardmode if you don't have the dps.

You CAN do herioc icc if you bring someone who killed LK

I think you mean can't on XT, but yeah I agree 100%. I think triggered is a hell of a lot better then toggled. Not only is it nice to have to meet some requirement / do something different then just waltz into an instance you artificially made harder by hitting a button, but it's nice only having to do 2 raids (10 man and 25 man) instead of 4 (10 man regular, 25 man regular, 10 man hard mode, 25 man hard mode)

[Chimpzilla]

I preferred the triggered as you call it. It was fun to have the opportunity to just change little things around for some variety. For example I Choose You Steelbreaker in which just killing things in a different order increased the difficulty of the fight.

[Dark Side]

Triggered is more fun, the heart, the order of kills,the giant button, they were all excellent ways to start. Its much better than just clicking your portrait and them being more powerfull. It was what made ulduar fun and ultimatly the best raid of WOTLK, while the LK HM isnt down yet, it fails in comparison to the awesomeness that is Ulduar. naturaly im biased since Ulduaar was the prison of Yoggy

[Antenorra]

I'm pretty sure the general consensus is for triggered hard modes. As a casual player, however, I just don't frankly care.

[nicsicsix]

Triggered is more fun, the heart, the order of kills,the giant button, they were all excellent ways to start. Its much better than just clicking your portrait and them being more powerfull. It was what made ulduar fun and ultimatly the best raid of WOTLK, while the LK HM isnt down yet, it fails in comparison to the awesomeness that is Ulduar. naturaly im biased since Ulduaar was the prison of Yoggy

Yeah LK isn't down yet, but it also took Algalon a hell of a long time to down, im sure it won't take as long for the lich king.

[Shiira]

The only real problem with toggled hard modes is that they made blizzard lazy. Increasing health and damage by X% and adding one extra ability don't make a hard mode fun in the same way that firefighter or freya+3 were.

[Nangz]

The only real problem with toggled hard modes is that they made blizzard lazy. Increasing health and damage by X% and adding one extra ability don't make a hard mode fun in the same way that firefighter or freya+3 were.

This.

[Alexandrra2012]

Whats the difference between toggling a hardmode by right clicking your portrait before the fight starts or triggering a hardmode by clicking a big red button before the fight starts. In my opinion toggling is better because you dont have jump through stupid hoops to see the real difficulty of the fight (like running a little faster in Thorim).

You had to have the damage to be able to "run faster" as you say. Mimi is a poor example of triggering HMs when compared to others in Ulduar, because as you pointed out it is similar to just clicking your portrait. However XT, Iron Council, Vezax etc are better examples where you change mechanics to initiate a harder version of the fight. Hopefully in Cataclysm Blizz brings back triggered HMs, I definitely prefer them.

[nicsicsix]

Whats the difference between toggling a hardmode by right clicking your portrait before the fight starts or triggering a hardmode by clicking a big red button before the fight starts. In my opinion toggling is better because you dont have jump through stupid hoops to see the real difficulty of the fight (like running a little faster in Thorim).

well personally i like it better because it changes the fight a little bit, alters some mechanics, forces players to check their skills, and it means that I'll only have to run two raids 10/25 instead of four 10/25 10h/25h to achieve maximized progression.

[nicsicsix]

The biggest problem with triggering hard modes like xt and ic (vezax isnt the best example) is that you fight an easy mode encounter that becomes *hard*, versus a *hard* encounter from start to finish.
Limited attempts is different than this topic altogether.

but is there anything wrong with that necessarily?
no matter what it comes out being a hard mode, that will take a well oiled group to clear without overgearing

and if you DO consider that a setback (which I have to respectfully disagree and say is not) then its really a small price to pay for a much more interesting form of elite content

[Shiira]

Whats the difference between toggling a hardmode by right clicking your portrait before the fight starts or triggering a hardmode by clicking a big red button before the fight starts. In my opinion toggling is better because you dont have jump through stupid hoops to see the real difficulty of the fight (like running a little faster in Thorim).

There isn't a difference, how the hard mode is activated is irrelevant. But blizzard have adopted a lazy design philosophy for hard modes since they made everything toggled, this is the problem because it makes the hard modes less fun.

[sulfuric]

The biggest problem with triggering hard modes like xt and ic (vezax isnt the best example) is that you fight an easy mode encounter that becomes *hard*, versus a *hard* encounter from start to finish.
Limited attempts is different than this topic altogether.

This is actually a good point, because you nearly have to kill the boss twice at least when it is a dps triggered hardmode (like XT). Perhaps something quite badass would be something like pissing the boss off.. but in some sort of skill outlet. For instance kicking some extremely fast heal that is only preformed once a fight at some certain time, or spell reflecting something else or perhaps having the raid depress a large amount of floor triggers all at once before some sapphiron like room killing AoE goes off. That's just my opinion though, a skill outlet to activating them and then a secondary skill test defeating them.

Obviously I feel like the hardmode encounter of the boss should be viewed like the boss at his true form, perhaps different graphics different death animation, clearly better loot etc. There needs to be more than mounts and titles for hard modes, and a useless "more optimal" set of gear that the instance is not even designed to require. If you're good enough to be killing hardmodes, you'll be doing it when they come out (and you're in lesser gear) not doing it in heroic gear.

[Erutan]

XT-002; Getting to hardmode is hard itself, getting him down in hardmode is UBER..... now that's an achievement....

[Mudkiper]

XT-002; Getting to hardmode is hard itself, getting him down in hardmode is UBER..... now that's an achievement....

Hmmm xt was one of the easiest hardmodes in ulduar :X

[Nev12]

Triggered by a mile.

[Deleted]

The current way hard modes work is just gay :<. You pick heroic option in a menu, bosses then have higher hp, dmg, sometimes use more abilities with each other and thats it... Oh and you get the same loot like from normal version but it says Heroic in green colour! And has slightly higher stats. Ulduar was amazing, you had to pwn something in time to activate the hard mode, let some "adds" alive so they can help the boss later, get someplace in time so something doesnt leaeve or... just... you know... press the button! Not to mention that the loot from hard mode was better, original and often inscribed or named with some nice title. I'm telling you, Ulduar was "The Raid" of this expansion.

Voted triggered ofc, I dont understand people voting for toggled.

[Araun]

There isn't a difference, how the hard mode is activated is irrelevant. But blizzard have adopted a lazy design philosophy for hard modes since they made everything toggled, this is the problem because it makes the hard modes less fun.

you clearly haven't tried the ICC hardmodes. Yes ToGC was boring because so little change from normal to HM, but I think ICC is way better and more like the ulduar HMs.

[Keoren]

I was a bit surprised when Blizzard said they didn't like the "triggered" system. I always thought it was great and added an element of "being there".....

For once I agree with you without any "but"s. Triggering the different modes adds to the immersion of a raid. They all feel part of the raid instead of being something like toggling the difficulty before starting your new Random Game on Wii.