Cataclysm Stat & System Changes

[Ciarán]

It all sounds pretty decent to me, but we'll have to see how it ends up.

As for simplification, do keep in mind that Blizz said we'll be getting more procs on weapons, so that also will be something to take into account

[Grimraven]

you fed the troll! :-X

how is that trolling?

I am not trying to pull the readers into some kind of off-topic. I am discussing the changes they are making in cataclysm.

[Adrena]

It all sounds pretty decent to me, but we'll have to see how it ends up.

As for simplification, do keep in mind that Blizz said we'll be getting more procs on weapons, so that also will be something to take into account

Also bear in mind that Vanilla(the apparent bastion of "good" that people most qq'rers never played) didn't have the multitude of stats that they are getting rid off.

[Shamslam]

will tank weapons be less..."tank" weaponish? what with the lack of defense you can just reforge the avoidance stats to something better.

Thinking about it, there will probably be tank weapons still (tons of stam/dodge/avoidance/block), but I feel like tanks wouldn't have to wait for that 1 or 2 tank weapons in an instance, and could just go with a DPS weapon, like Dk/druid's of now, but for warriors/pally's too. Just change the DPS stat to whichever defensive stat you want.

[Quesly]

When the answer to pretty much any gear question is "plug it into rawr and sim it", that's too complicated.
There's a HUGE difference between 'look at gear for 2 seconds' and 'so complicated that you need to go get a 3rd party program (such as rawr) and plug numbers in there' and I suspect blizzard will put it somewhere in between.

how is plugging something into rawr or other spreadsheet w/e and actually spending time on managing your character extremely complicated ???

[Grimraven]

Noone's forcing you to do anything, you can still take as much leather gear as you like come Cata. The only thing that's changing is that discrepancy of plate wearing dps classes being forced to use leather dps gear rather than plate will have been resolved. Or do you really think that forcing plate wearers to pick up leather gear because of bad stat itemization is really a better solution?

Errr because it's their game? And because they decide the itemization of gear? I fail to see how your argument that they'll be "forcing" you to wear plate items is any different from the current situation where you're "forced" to wear leather gear.

Making your own armour class more appealing to you doesn't mean you have fewer gearing options. If you're picking up leather gear now then you're obviously passing over plate gear that you have decided is sub-optimal for your class/spec so in reality you don't have any more gearing options now. Sure you can pick up plate gear to bide you over until you can get your hands on the leather gear you want but that doesn't mean you've had more choice, and there's nothing in Cata that will stop you doing similar until you get the gear you do want (which then just be plate rather than leather).

Noone is saying that everyone will be able to look at gear for 2 seconds and be able to say without a doubt whether or not it's a definite upgrade, but Blizz want it to be the case that you can look at an item and decide that without having to go and plug all the details into a simulator or spreadsheet to get the answer. And to be honest for all the talk about the fun and decisions to be made about what gear to get the vast majority of people just go places like here or elitistjerks and either get a list of gear to aim for or ask people what they should get (who then usually answer from a list they got from a website/forum).

did blizzard pay you to say that, because it does not make any sense, or maybe you are blizzard employee?

[Cerin]

how is plugging something into rawr or other spreadsheet w/e and actually spending time on managing your character extremely complicated ???

Do it without the 3rd party programs and/or spreadsheets and ask me that. Blizzard does not want you to have to rely on external sources to find a gear upgrade.

[DSRilk]

And how is that up to blizzard to decide what am I supposed to wear and what not?

Yes, yes, Blizzard has no right to tell me that my priest can't wear plate!

[Kalx]

For example, Hit is likely to be blue instead of yellow.

best thing ever, no discussion

[Linuilas]

did blizzard pay you to say that, because it does not make any sense, or maybe you are blizzard employee?

What exactly is it you're finding difficult to grasp?

[Shamslam]

God, it's like everyone just reads to the part about their class and comes fucking QQing their lil heads off w/o finishing the whole story. This thread would be like 5 pages long if you took out trolls/idiots/braindeads.

My favorite part of all of this might be haste...Depending on what % haste takes off what % refreshing moves, the haste cap is seeming to be one of the big marks to reach in Cata. That and the gem color changes. We might be able to stack haste and hit at the same time... /drool

[Grimraven]

Yes, yes, Blizzard has no right to tell me that my priest can't wear plate!

because that is in your class description,

warriors CAN wear any type of armor but since they don't want this to happen anymore they will make leather and mail as shitty as possible

[Grimraven]

What exactly is it you're finding difficult to grasp?

nothing, go get your paycheck

[Jeefus]

Thanks Boubouille for putting that together.


I think some of the changes look good....however I can see doom written all over everything simply because nothing ever works as it should. For example, with the new Defense, I wonder how the "uncritable" tank classes will effect PvP???

[stevorino]

spirit as a holy pally is like... *shrug*
cant find words... like seeing rets with sp sockets

i dont like it although it's overall a good balancing change :/

[VanishO2]

Current system is just plain retarded. Right now the difference in health between melee dps warrior and melee dps shaman can be nearly 10k with same gearscore. Cataclysm stamina equalizing means that regardless of class, everybody in same raid role has similar health. All dps from cloth to plate has pretty much same health, difference is that plate offers slightly more damage mitigation from armor.

So the skinny rogue and shamman are as tough and strong as a warrior/dk? And that's is not retarded? So they just use leather because of preference now, not because plate is very heavy...

For real... kinda retarded that they'll just keep doing it wrong with plate dps classes... guess they never got and will never get why they use leather/mail instead of plate... reading all the stuff, you'll just see plate dps classes loosing stuff without any compensation (at least on gear, maybe on talents?) while leather/mail dpsers are just breaking equal if not better (thanks to atk power to more agi AND sta conversion) than they're currently. Strength will never be the same as Agility as long as Agi give more to their classes than Strength gives to the DPS portion of plate classes. That's why Agi rings (agi+sta+crit+atk power+other useful stat combos like hit+exp or hit+haste or arp+exp, etc...) are always better than Str rings (str+sta+SAME crit as the crit from Agi ring+exp OR hit OR haste OR arp...).

And they said once that they think that plate users should have more sta than any other dps class... lol looks like not...

But no compensation? Retarded... and still saying that most of their gear will still be loaded with stamina instead of useful dps stats...

Only good thing for now is for DPS DKs using haste in their gear for rune regen... other than that...

[Brookes]

nothing, go get your paycheck

weren't you the guy claiming to not be a troll?

[Linuilas]

nothing, go get your paycheck

If my post makes no sense, as you claim, then clearly there must be something about it that you don't grasp. Or is it actually the case that you don't actually have a real basis for your argument and you're hoping that claiming that I'm a blizz employee or somehow don't make sense will substitute for reasoned debate?

[Teneal]

I like how some people are complaining that this will make WoW so much easier... Was picking which gear you liked over others really that hard? Look at a sticky on the forums and most will say "This stat > This stat > This stat (Til This stat = #)"

Doesn't seem much different too me except maybe you will lose a few choices and gain some. Now you can't look for gear with high SP but you have to look for gear with more Int instead, as a lock I never really went off Int so... one stat for another...

Picking what gear is better than your current is not hard peeps. Not now and not when Cata comes out.

[DSRilk]

because that is in your class description,

warriors CAN wear any type of armor but since they don't want this to happen anymore they will make leather and mail as shitty as possible

So Blizzard can tell me I can't wear plate because they decided a while ago that I couldn't? Hmm... okay. Wait, hey! Where does Blizzard get off telling me I can't effectively wear spell power cloth when I DPS with my rogue! It says I can wear cloth... guess they're trying to FORCE me to wear leather. That just ain't right. I mean where do they get off telling me what armor I can wear? And while we're at it, it should be noted that this game totally sucked before Arp became a stat, which is why it'll suck when it's now only available as a talent. Except for the mastery stat, which improves your Arp if you get it from talents. But mastery is a totally stupid stat anyway. I mean, having a stat that's value and effect depends upon your talent point expenditure just dumbs down the game for all those casual players...