[Cata] Agi vs AP

[Bealj001]

HI All,

Thought I read somewhere but I can't find it that 1Agi = 2 AP, I am not sure that this is active I was wondering whether it was planned for cataclysm and I may have misread it.

[Powerogue]

yes it's planned in cataclysm. i believe they said 1 agil will yield 2 attack power, and 1 strength will yield 2 attack power. they'll be exclusive in a way that plate wearers are discouraged from wearing leather, that i remember.

[Feiht]

It's Because Attack power as a stat is being removed from the game.

[OnlineSamantha]

Yup, right now it's 1 Agi = 1 AP - unfortunatly :'(

[Torture]

Yup, right now it's 1 Agi = 1 AP - unfortunatly :'(

Ah yes, but wait for that month (or however long) before Cata hits but the stats change. We'll all be running round with double attack power, and I can't think of another class that will see such an enormous boost, except maybe Ele shaman getting SP from Int. Shaman will be throttling meters at the end of the expansion

[Deleted]

It's Because Attack power as a stat is being removed from the game.

No AP as a stat is NOT being removed from the game. AP as a stat is being removed from GEAR!! ie: no gear with have Equip: Increases your Attack Power by 121. You will still have Attack Power just not explicitly on gear.

[Tellaria]

Ah yes, but wait for that month (or however long) before Cata hits but the stats change. We'll all be running round with double attack power, and I can't think of another class that will see such an enormous boost, except maybe Ele shaman getting SP from Int. Shaman will be throttling meters at the end of the expansion

Actually, the moment the Cataclysm changes hit live (patch 4.0?) not only the stat changes will be applied, but the current gear will also be modified simpultaneously to match those stat changes. So no, we won't be running around with double attack power... :

We will simply no longer have AP as a raw stat on the gear that currently has it, the same way that Elem shamans will no longer have SP on their gear since they will get it from INT instead. This will probably affect the stats we currently have... we might end up with a bit more (or a bit less) AP than we currently have once the changes are implemented for example. But it stops there, no free double AP for anyone. :P

[DarkAxius]

I do expect every dual-wield DPS DK to be royally screwed over though...
I expect almost every 1h sword to end up being agility/stam for Rogues.

[Tellaria]

I do expect every dual-wield DPS DK to be royally screwed over though...
I expect almost every 1h sword to end up being agility/stam for Rogues.

Excluding tanking 1h swords, isn't this allready the case? I've yet to see a DPS 1h sword with Strength.

But I suppose you refer to the fact that DKs won't get much AP from agility come 4.0, and with the absence of AP as a stat on gear, these agi 1h weapons will not be as attractive...

Its a worthy point, I wonder if that might affect the way they design 1hs in the future (maybe 1h weapons with an AP budget spread into both STR and AGI stats so that everyone find its share of AP?), else we could indeed be looking at a nasty down-side to DK dual-wield...

[Torture]

Actually, the moment the Cataclysm changes hit live (patch 4.0?) not only the stat changes will be applied, but the current gear will also be modified simpultaneously to match those stat changes. So no, we won't be running around with double attack power... :

We will simply no longer have AP as a raw stat on the gear that currently has it, the same way that Elem shamans will no longer have SP on their gear since they will get it from INT instead. This will probably affect the stats we currently have... we might end up with a bit more (or a bit less) AP than we currently have once the changes are implemented for example. But it stops there, no free double AP for anyone. :P

You make a good point actually. I was asuming that iem budgets would remain the same and because hunters already benefit from 2AP they would balance around that. So if an item currently gives 50AP and 50AGI, it would become 75AGI in the expansion because the 1X = 2AP is the most common DPS model and would therefore form the baseline. Agi is reportedly going to be responsible for less crit obviously to compensate, but if the above translation does prove accurate then we'd go from 100AP to 150AP. Which basically means I just proved my initial point is a load of old nonsense and should be entirely ignored!!

Let me replace it then with, we should expect to see an overall AP increase when the changes go live

[Ashecroft]

I do expect every dual-wield DPS DK to be royally screwed over though...
I expect almost every 1h sword to end up being agility/stam for Rogues.

Blizzard have stated recently that they're going to be making 1 handed weapons with Strength on them for people who play DW Death Knights

[Asgard]

Ah yes, but wait for that month (or however long) before Cata hits but the stats change. We'll all be running round with double attack power, and I can't think of another class that will see such an enormous boost, except maybe Ele shaman getting SP from Int. Shaman will be throttling meters at the end of the expansion

That was the most stupid thing I read today.
- "We'll all be running round with double attack power" -> No. Double "ap from agi", but 0 "raw ap" = same ap approx
- "I can't think of another class that will see such an enormous boost" -> the "1agi=2ap/1str=2ap" change and "int=sp" change apply to all classes, not just shamans.

[Umon]

- "I can't think of another class that will see such an enormous boost" -> the "1agi=2ap/1str=2ap" change and "int=sp" change apply to all classes, not just shamans.

Think b4 u say something...Shamans got talents that increese their Int by xx % and as resto u have a talent that gives u a % of ur int into moar SP

Just like arcane mages...holy pallys etc...they get bonus int and bonus SP from int....Not like the other classes that will just have int from gear and no other bonuses...

[Omanley]

from what i know, it´s gonna be for us ( and hunters as well ) how hunters had it in vanilla.

hunters got 2ap for each point of agility, but only a veeeery small amount of crit ( which blizzard confirmed just recently )

so expect something along the lines 200 agility = 1% melee crit with lvl 85

makes crit rating more of an interesting stat in high end gear.

we´re most likely going to stack agility know, looking at how it´s scaling with kings, but also gives (although only very few) melee crit chance as well.

well, after we´re spellhit-capped/exp-capped ofc.

there´s also the matter how good haste will become. it´s pretty much awesome allready, but blizzard wants to make haste more interesting for enh/ret as well ( which wouldn´t get anything out of faster runepower/rage/energy/focus-generation ). my guess would be reduced ability cooldowns, or ( for enh specifically ) reduced wf cooldown for example.

there´s also the thing that int vanishes from our gear. assuming mental quickness stays as is, we´d still have our 30% of our attackpower => spellpower, but what will happen with mental dexterty?

i´d say make it give 13%/26%/40% of our agility ( rough numbers ) intellect. would keep our manapool at a reasonable amount, and also give us spellpower... and change improved stormstrike to improved shocks, i´d rather be able to regenerate mana with shocks than with a melee ability. but im drifting away from the topic... ;D

[Feiht]

No AP as a stat is NOT being removed from the game. AP as a stat is being removed from GEAR!! ie: no gear with have Equip: Increases your Attack Power by 121. You will still have Attack Power just not explicitly on gear.

Sorry for not clarifying that, I was meaning as a stat you could stack. i.e. Gear/Gems etc. I am aware that Attack Power itself will remain in the game through stat conversions and the like (1Agi => 2AP). I just wasn't clear on that, and in fact having left that vital tidbit out made my statement completely wrong :P

Its the same with Spellpower, except that it will show up on caster weapons.

[Oneleg]

HI All,

Thought I read somewhere but I can't find it that 1Agi = 2 AP, I am not sure that this is active I was wondering whether it was planned for cataclysm and I may have misread it.

Have to wait and see what they really do with the stats. WAY WAY too early to start theory crafting and trying to guess wth they are going to do. Biggest problem is we have no idea what talent changes are coming, new spells, abilities, raid buffs, dynamics with other class's.

[Torture]

- "I can't think of another class that will see such an enormous boost" -> the "1agi=2ap/1str=2ap" change and "int=sp" change apply to all classes, not just shamans.

I think you entirely missed the point. The current state of play for DPS classes is;

Warrior - 1str = 2AP
Paladin - 1str = 2AP
Deathknight - 1str = 2AP
Rogue - 1agi = 2AP
Hunter - 1agi = 2AP
Shaman - 1agi = 1AP

So, now imagine when Shaman change to 1agi = 2AP we'll be the only physical DPS class having our X stat = Y AP system changed. That is where the conversation started.

I left casters alone as I think they'll all scale fairly exponentially, except Ele shaman who have never benefitted from Intel until the cata changes.

[Deleted]

I think you entirely missed the point. The current state of play for DPS classes is;

Warrior - 1str = 2AP
Paladin - 1str = 2AP
Deathknight - 1str = 2AP
Rogue - 1agi = 2AP
Hunter - 1agi = 2AP
Shaman - 1agi = 1AP

So, now imagine when Shaman change to 1agi = 2AP we'll be the only physical DPS class having our X stat = Y AP system changed. That is where the conversation started.

I left casters alone as I think they'll all scale fairly exponentially, except Ele shaman who have never benefitted from Intel until the cata changes.

Well, sorry, but you're not informed.
Rogue and Hunter get 1 AP from each point of Agi.
http://www.wowwiki.com/Agility#Agility

Warriors, hunters[1] and rogues gain 1 ranged attack power for each point of agility.
Hunters,[2] rogues, shamans (as of 3.0.2) and druids in Cat Form[3] gain 1 melee attack power per point of agility.

[Torture]

I stand entirely corrected *puts on dunce cap and goes to sit in the corner*

[Barky]

Blizzard have stated recently that they're going to be making 1 handed weapons with Strength on them for people who play DW Death Knights

not to mention the stat reforging system, who's to say you can't do a 'Swap agility to Str' ability?