Shadowstep needs to be a core ability.

[Wanky]

Shadowstep is by far the most fun Rogue ability in the game. I remember back in the BC days when Subtlety was viable for PvP, and Shadowsteps made heads roll. Sadly, those days are gone, along with Subtlety's viability in PvP, much less PvE.

That's why Shadowstep should be a core ability. It's not just because it's a fun ability that any Rogue, regardless of spec, will find useful in PvP (and in some cases, PvE); it's because it just fits the whole overall mindset of a Rogue. Shadowstep is currently in the "Subtlety" tree, a tree with talents that are silent and deadly, and thus ninja-like. Yet Shadowstep can also fit the "Assassination" and "Combat" trees: appearing spontaneously behind the enemy can lead to a quick and efficient takedown, emblematic of the assassin; and in the heat of combat, teleporting to an enemy's back can give you the upper hand immediately through the element of surprise. In game, Shadowstep is used in all of these ways due to its low cooldown and ability to get a Rogue out of a sticky situation, like a snare from a Druid or Mage (along with CoS), and turn the tables.

Blizzard, if you do anything to drastically change Rogue talents for Cataclysm, make this at the top of your list. Shadowstep is the most fun Rogue ability ever, and was the envy and despair of all classes in PvP. Let all Rogues use it...

[Voij]

Would be nice, but I guess pretty OP. It also defines the Sub-Tree somewhat, similar to Mutilate for Assassination, so I don't think it'd be a good idea to make it trainable.

So yeah, it's part of Sub's identity, putting it elsewhere is kinda... like, taking away Sub's essence.

Oh, and just because you can use it to assassinate someone wouldn't be enough of a reason to say it fits Assassination. You can use a pillow to assassinate people, totally silent and noone will suspect anything.

Are we gonna see a "Shadowy Pillow" as the new skill in Cata because of this? Don't think so...

[Athael]

I'm gonna go ahead and just put this out there:

Rogues have a lot of baseline cooldowns and abilities in their PvP bag of tricks already. More than any other class.

Would it really be balancing to give them yet another?

[failrogue]

From a PvE point of view, if all it did was drop me behind the boss, i'd be fine, i don't look at the balancing of things for PvP too much.

[zcks]

I'm gonna go ahead and just put this out there:

Rogues have a lot of baseline cooldowns and abilities in their PvP bag of tricks already. More than any other class.

Would it really be balancing to give them yet another?

This, rouges already have so many more base line trainable abilities then almost every other class out there. heck they even have double the amount of abilities at base lvl then some other classes have when fully talented in any of their specs.

There is also the fact it would make specs like mutilate completely op in pvp. Rouges really don't need any pvp buffs as they always have been & will continue to be one of the most all time represented classes in arena and high end pvp.

[Gilian]

They should make riptide a trainable skill instead of 51 point talent.

[Drunkenfinn]

Only way to make this not-over-the-top would be giving the baseline ShS a cooldown much higher than it currently has as a talent in the Subtetly tree. I'd say something like 1 minute would be sufficient. They oughta also remove the +X% damage on your next attack component from the baseline ShS.

Then they could just replace the talent spot in the Sub tree with a talent that lowers the cooldown of ShS by 40/30 seconds or so and also making it able to break roots and increasing the damage of your next 1/2 abilities by X%.

[KresnikHellfire]

They should make riptide a trainable skill instead of 51 point talent.

Meh, beat me to it, but I'm sure I could have thought of a better example with justifcation than that !

[psyquest]

some guys really dont know what they are asking for.

Shadowstep = impossible to kite rogue.

Unless you lived under a rogue, you should know that being able to kite a rogue is for some classes the only way to survive.

imagine a mutilate rogue with preparation and shadowstep.
imagine a combat rogue with shadowstep.

One word. OVERPOWERED.

Stop asking for noobish things.

[ardoRic]

Cool talents like this are the reason people spec into trees. If you want it, you should spec into it, imo. If you cba, you don't want it enough.

If i ever get to work on my rogue, she'll be sub for life.

[Fugg]

I totally disagree.

Remove Shadowstep, Killing Spree and Mutilate and push Backstab and Ambush. Rogues do it from behind!

[Aelith]

yea... beacuse rogues need to be buffed.....

[wannaspoon]

only way that it would even be possible to be a core ability would be to remove the 20% additional damage to your next ability, to big of envenom crits...

Edit: also sub tree isn't completely dead, mahiko does quite well as sub daggers, just isn't as faceroll as mutilate

[Dorph]

some guys really dont know what they are asking for.

Shadowstep = impossible to kite rogue.

Unless you lived under a rogue, you should know that being able to kite a rogue is for some classes the only way to survive.

imagine a mutilate rogue with preparation and shadowstep.
imagine a combat rogue with shadowstep.

One word. OVERPOWERED.

Stop asking for noobish things.

Imagine the 3-role class, Druids, with Innervate in all specs.

One word. OVERPO- wait

Couldn't help it (Innervate used to be a Resto talent :P)

[Saangi]

titan's grip should be trainable instead of a 51pt talent, or lawlstorm.

[K4ge]

While I agree, that our mobility is severly lacking, I don't really like this idea all too much. Because a trainable shadowstep makes sub even more useless than it is now.

[Merlinsback]

Ok... but you have to trade CoS as the 41pt sub. talent!

And what class WOULDN'T want one of their 41 pt talents as a trainable talent? lawl

[Cloral300]

Well if they made it a core ability, rogues would pretty have nothing in the subtlety tree left. I mean, whenever I think of subtlety, I think of shadowstep and big crits.

[ModZs]

Shadowstep is by far the most fun Rogue ability in the game. I remember back in the BC days when Subtlety was viable for PvP, and Shadowsteps made heads roll. Sadly, those days are gone, along with Subtlety's viability in PvP, much less PvE.

That's why Shadowstep should be a core ability. It's not just because it's a fun ability that any Rogue, regardless of spec, will find useful in PvP (and in some cases, PvE); it's because it just fits the whole overall mindset of a Rogue. Shadowstep is currently in the "Subtlety" tree, a tree with talents that are silent and deadly, and thus ninja-like. Yet Shadowstep can also fit the "Assassination" and "Combat" trees: appearing spontaneously behind the enemy can lead to a quick and efficient takedown, emblematic of the assassin; and in the heat of combat, teleporting to an enemy's back can give you the upper hand immediately through the element of surprise. In game, Shadowstep is used in all of these ways due to its low cooldown and ability to get a Rogue out of a sticky situation, like a snare from a Druid or Mage (along with CoS), and turn the tables.

Blizzard, if you do anything to drastically change Rogue talents for Cataclysm, make this at the top of your list. Shadowstep is the most fun Rogue ability ever, and was the envy and despair of all classes in PvP. Let all Rogues use it...

This is insanely idiotic. Envenom spec with the mobility of subtlety = more OP than the warrior's meatspin.