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  1. #21
    Field Marshal
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    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Try Dot. Dot . Dot. and then heal heal heal heal until he dies !
    Me and my 2vs2 partner ran agaisnt some rogue's where I died and the Rogue's Partner Died
    he just dotted the Rogue and kept healing and we Won

  2. #22

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    get more resi, spec reflective shield, pop shadow fiend if you feel over pressured.

    unless they sap off your shield for the opener, really a rogue should have no chance at all.

  3. #23

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Inner fire is on of the biggest liabilities as a pvp priest. I can't count the times when it wore of and i just died seconds after.... wtb something like mage armor. :-)

    the problems with rogues is that they are always going for the weak... like if you are already fighting somebody else they jump you, or when they can see they don't have an advantage they just run away. Fecking chickens.



  4. #24

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    The key really is to put pressure on the rouge as soon as he opens.

    Early Dots, fear and holy nova can cause him to use his CoS early so you can safely fear after the 2. kidney to redot+reheal+smite. By that time he should be under 40% in range of a MB/Smite + HF+ SwD kombo (try to do this right after a shield for a fast MD).

    if you are not putting out dmg you will go down eventually when his CDs start coming up again

  5. #25

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    I just wanted to post from a different perspective, as the rogue.

    My best friend plays a priest on 2300-ish rating in 3's and 5's, and he has very good gear (full wrathful offsets+three wrathful pieces+t2weapon).

    I don't have a chance to win against him while he is disc, maily because he lives to the second fear, as many of you have said. The key to surviving against good rogues is mainly three things as I see it:
    • Fakecasting
    • High resilience
    • Inner Fire

    Now, fakecasting is NOT casting something from a different school (eg. MC) but casting a heal, interrupting it by moving or a /stopcasting macro. Hopefully the rogue will kick nothing, and you can heal for eight seconds if he hasn't got Kidney Shot/gouge ready. If he kidneys, he can't burst you that much, kick costs 25 energy (-10 with the pvp gloves) and Kidney Shot costs 25 energy. He won't have that much energy left to burst you with.

    DoT the rogue when you've got a spare GCD, get good at fakecasting, use shadowfiend on his Cloak (it might break vanish aswell, because.. well, it's broken) and survive to the second fear.

    Someone said rShamans are good against rogues. That's not true, a disc priest is 5x harder to beat 1v1.

    Someone said don't trinket Kidney, cause he'll blind you, bandage, restealth and lolown you.
    Kidney shot has a 20 second CD. Blind is 8 seconds. If you DoT him, he can't bandage/restealth unless he cloaks. Most rogues are Preparation/Envenom-specced in pvp, and using Wound&Deadly Poison. If he blinds you with deadly poison up, then it'll tick and break Blind.

    Trinket Kidney Shot.

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  6. #26

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Fake casting is weak. If you're having your ass handed to you I don't see why you'd want to waste your time pretending to heal to bait his kick when you're down to 1/2 Health with a 50% healing penalty. By the time you've baited his kick you're about dead anyway, few more combo's he's nailed you and your healing is too low to bring you back up.

  7. #27

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Reflective shield and dots alone should be able to kill him for sure.Shield and penance yourself if he kicks it you just w8 5secs and then its freecast.During that time you should A)reapply dots B)top yourself C)fear->holyfire->smite spam.PS the first kidney, trinket the blind, force cloak in the first fear (if its not trinketed) or mindcontroll and let the dots dmg him.

  8. #28

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Malania
    Fake casting is weak. If you're having your ass handed to you I don't see why you'd want to waste your time pretending to heal to bait his kick when you're down to 1/2 Health with a 50% healing penalty. By the time you've baited his kick you're about dead anyway, few more combo's he's nailed you and your healing is too low to bring you back up.
    Fakecasting wins arena games.

    Since this is a 1v1 topic though, I'd say fakecasting gets more useful when your resilience gets higher.

    The priests who doesn't fakecast are the ones who are easy to kill. Then again, if that's not your piece of cake, don't do it.

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  9. #29

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Malania
    Fake casting is weak. If you're having your ass handed to you I don't see why you'd want to waste your time pretending to heal to bait his kick when you're down to 1/2 Health with a 50% healing penalty. By the time you've baited his kick you're about dead anyway, few more combo's he's nailed you and your healing is too low to bring you back up.
    well if you're that low, if you don't fake cast, he interrupts it, and you're dead before you can cast again, if you do manage to fake cast a kick, you may actually be able to get a direct heal off.

  10. #30

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Longview
    Now, fakecasting is NOT casting something from a different school (eg. MC) but casting a heal, interrupting it by moving or a /stopcasting macro.
    Like other people have said, fakecasting sucks. I'm not going to let him kick my ass while trying to bait his kick. I'd be down to 50% already with -50% healing. Not good.

    And all rogues, ALL ROGUES open up with CS-Kidney. I've yet to meet a rogue that doesn't CS-Kidney. Serious.

    And casting MC is bad, eh? If I cast MC, one of two things will happen:


    A. He'll blow his Kick on it, letting me free heal

    B. He'll get MC'd and his trinket will be off CD because I usually fear right away. Free 10 seconds of no damage, and also letting me move him 20yds away.

    Try Dot. Dot . Dot. and then heal heal heal heal until he dies !
    Oh yes, perfect strategy! It's the same one that Paragon used for LK 25H. Tank tank tank, Heal heal heal, DPS dps dps, and he's dead! So easy! :-\
    Quote Originally Posted by Precursor View Post
    "Fall of therzane....." ....um what? if that woman fell , god help us it will be the second cataclysm
    Words that lots of people don't seem to know the definition of:
    "Troll", "Rehash", "Casual", "Dead", "Dying", "Exploit".

  11. #31

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    personally i have no issues with rogues when im disc...

    PW:S myself every time i can

    trinket out of kidney shot

    fear him make him waste his trink

    holy fire SW:P DP SF norm will hurt him pretty bad

    keep IF and PW:S and PoM on myself and heal myself till i can re fear him

    reapply dots and watch him die/reset the fight

    if he resets the fight (which really chicken s**t rogues do cuz they dont like to lose to a priest)

    i just repeat the above

    o if he gets u low and has blown his kick already inner focus +DP or pen for big heals when ur low health thats norm my first "o crap" button

    my second one is PS followed by PI for quick heals on myself

    if hes low on health then SW and using pen on him to hurt him is also the way to go

    only very good rogues ever beat me i can kill/beat rogues 1v1 that are equally geared/skilled

    iv gotta round 1k resil and 28k health in my pvp gear spell pen capped and hit capped for pvp so i dont miss or get resisted

  12. #32

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    As others have said, PvP is not balanced around 1v1 so /topic.

    Having a rogue partner for 2v2 arena, I love going up against another rogue/priest group. Again, the key is surviving the initial onslaught from the rogue. Having glyph of pain supression is key for arena. Once you can get through the stuns, the rogue is basically an annoying bug. Just make sure to never turn your back to them.

    FYI, Mind vision is an excellent tool for rogues. If they repop into stealth, you can still keep track of them if you are watching them before they go stealth.

  13. #33

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    You have a real hard problem with rogues and ask for help. People who have minimal problems with rogues respond that properly utilizing fakecasting helps tremendously in surviving them, yet you're saying you don't have time for it? Instead you spam flash heal until it gets kicked and lock yourself out of your healing school for 5s, which costs more time than 1gcd to fakecast? Or you cast Mind Control which takes 4 seconds to cast, yet you don't have time to fakecast one spell?

    Let penance tick twice, then move before the 3rd cast hits - 75% of rogues will attempt to kick that third tick and whiff, giving you 8 seconds to cast whatever you want - spam flash, hell I even have spammed Greater Heal in that timeframe, topping myself - you're gonna have deadly poison on you, so the most they can do is gouge 1 heal before deadly ticks, then they have 0 interrupts for 6 seconds, leaving you at least 2 greater heals which are uninterruptable.

    at least 4-5 people in this thread have told you that surviving to the 2nd fear is the key to killing a rogue. The best trick to get you to that 2nd fear is to pump fake a kick. Reflective Shield also goes a really, really long way.

    When this Arena Season started my Priest had full Relentless Gear, with full Wrathful offsets and crappy (non-1800) weapons. IE my gear was about the same as yours I just gemmed differently and had a little more (1200) resil. All season I've murdered rogues 1v1. The only time I recall losing to a rogue this season is against a PvE hero Combat rogue who 100%-0d me within a killing spree.

    If you refuse to pump fake heals, then have fun losing to rogues in a 1v1 situation, but don't ask for help if you're just going to refuse it when plenty of people are telling you how to beat them. As I said before, plenty of Disc Priests (and a rogue) in this thread are stating you should be killing rogues in a 1v1 situation provided you survive to the 2nd fear, pump fake heals, and have Reflective Shield. Those 3 things are basically what you need to win. Shadowfiend isn't even necessary if you play well. If you don't believe us, take a stroll over to arenajunkies and have them tell you the same exact thing the other people in this thread have said.

  14. #34

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Rookx ZG
    If you refuse to pump fake heals, then have fun losing to rogues in a 1v1 situation, but don't ask for help if you're just going to refuse it when plenty of people are telling you how to beat them. As I said before, plenty of Disc Priests (and a rogue) in this thread are stating you should be killing rogues in a 1v1 situation provided you survive to the 2nd fear, pump fake heals, and have Reflective Shield. Those 3 things are basically what you need to win. Shadowfiend isn't even necessary if you play well. If you don't believe us, take a stroll over to arenajunkies and have them tell you the same exact thing the other people in this thread have said.
    Well said.

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  15. #35

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Rookx ZG
    Instead you spam flash heal until it gets kicked and lock yourself out of your healing school for 5s
    Please, point out where I said this. I think I've missed it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rookx ZG
    Mind Control which takes 2.5 seconds to cast
    Fixed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rookx ZG
    don't ask for help if you're just going to refuse it
    Nowhere did I refuse help. Just because I prefer to do something else doesn't mean I'm refusing help. Just because you prefer to do things one way doesn't mean that's right and my way is wrong, so you assume I'm refusing the "right" way. And really, I never asked for help in the first place. I asked for tips/tricks, IE, asking how other people do it.

    I do like how you're twisting it around like I'm asking for help and refusing it, though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Precursor View Post
    "Fall of therzane....." ....um what? if that woman fell , god help us it will be the second cataclysm
    Words that lots of people don't seem to know the definition of:
    "Troll", "Rehash", "Casual", "Dead", "Dying", "Exploit".

  16. #36

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Dace
    u fail
    That's not really constructive.

    @Vook: I don't want to seem like an asshat, but I think you under estimate fake-casting, and how it wins games. Find a good pvp priest and ask him (they're usually friendly if you are).

    If you don't want to fake cast, then take advantage of all the other tricks/tips posted.

    Regular Dota

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  17. #37

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Longview
    If you don't want to fake cast, then take advantage of all the other tricks/tips posted.
    This is what I was going to do. Is that so bad? :-\

    I mean, what's WRONG with casting Mind Control? IMO it's much easier than trying to bait a kick as it works on the first cast. I posted those two points about it and nobody seemed to care.
    Quote Originally Posted by Precursor View Post
    "Fall of therzane....." ....um what? if that woman fell , god help us it will be the second cataclysm
    Words that lots of people don't seem to know the definition of:
    "Troll", "Rehash", "Casual", "Dead", "Dying", "Exploit".

  18. #38

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Vook
    I mean, what's WRONG with casting Mind Control? IMO it's much easier than trying to bait a kick as it works on the first cast. I posted those two points about it and nobody seemed to care.
    Casting MC is original, I'll give you that (I have never seen a priest MC me whilst I attack him). I would never kick a MC targetted at myself, but that's just me.

    I don't think it's a good thing to do though, because of several reasons:
    • You could heal/shield with instants instead
    • A decent rogue could vanish before your cast is through
    • Kidney shot
    • Gouge

    If they decide to say, gouge it, then you've just wasted ~2 seconds that you could've spent healing/dotting/shielding.

    That in addition to it being dispellable in arenas, breaks on damage (if you have DoTs/shadowfiend on him).

    But hey, if you want to MC, go wild!

    EDIT: Sure, it's easier to MC compared to perform good fake casting, but the latter is more efficient.

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  19. #39

    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    Quote Originally Posted by Longview
    breaks on damage (if you have DoTs/shadowfiend on him).
    Not true. I've DoT'd things and MC'd them before, and I've MC'd dotted people in BG's. Also if MC broke on Damage, then Instructor Razuvius 25man would be impossible.

    If anything about breaking on damage in PvP situations, it would probably work like Fear or something, breaking after a certain amount of damage. Having the Rogue MC'd would just buy me an extra 12 seconds or so (10 seconds of MC, 2 or so seconds for him to get back to me from 20yds) to let me easily get a 2nd Fear.
    Quote Originally Posted by Precursor View Post
    "Fall of therzane....." ....um what? if that woman fell , god help us it will be the second cataclysm
    Words that lots of people don't seem to know the definition of:
    "Troll", "Rehash", "Casual", "Dead", "Dying", "Exploit".

  20. #40
    Herald of the Titans -Ethos-'s Avatar
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    Re: Rogue vs. Priest = No Contest

    It breaks/shortens in duration if the caster takes damage.

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