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  1. #1

    Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    I made this topic mostly because of one of the responses here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-pr...he-lol-meters/

    It is stated that Holy is vastly inferior to disc. That being holy is actually gimping yourself, and possibly the raid. Now, what utilities do we bring that are essential for raiding ICC 25? I've been holy for 5 years and how I currently heal is easily replacable. Coh? Say hello to chain heal. Renew? Say hello resto druids. Guardian Spirit is nice, of course, but if thats all we really bring whats the point?

    SO, the question is what utility to we bring to the raids that other classes don't, and what is your approach (as a holy priest) to each fight in ICC? I am curious to see the responses.

  2. #2
    High Overlord maxvdakker's Avatar
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    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    What we bring to raid? healing (and our saving angel)

  3. #3
    Warchief
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    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Heelies
    Quote Originally Posted by Negridoom
    No. After the Cataclysm there will be an expansion for the zerg, and then an expansion for the protoss.

  4. #4

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by maxvdakker
    What we bring to raid? healing (and our saving angel)
    Every healing class brings heals. :P What I am looking for is actual discussion for what we bring that other healers do not, and what we should/can be doing on a per fight basis that is best for the raid.

  5. #5

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aroll
    It is stated that Holy is vastly inferior to disc. That being holy is actually gimping yourself, and possibly the raid. Now, what utilities do we bring that are essential for raiding ICC 25? I've been holy for 5 years and how I currently heal is easily replacable. Coh? Say hello to chain heal. Renew? Say hello resto druids. Guardian Spirit is nice, of course, but if thats all we really bring whats the point?

    SO, the question is what utility to we bring to the raids that other classes don't [...]
    The politically correct response: Holy, like every other spec is perfectly raid viable, just learn how to "use its tools well" and L2P

    The closer to reality response: Not too far from the truth. Holy is facing so much scaling problems, obsolence and contrary to popular opinion, is the least versatile healer of all.

  6. #6

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Holy priests bring the best CD to the raid. Guardian Spirit glyphed is and will ever be overpowered. The next thing priests bring to the raid is great flexibility. You can perfectly heal any type of dmg (burst, dot, etc), imo. After all it was like this back when i quitted in ulduar. :

  7. #7

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    In a little bit of detail from what I personally think (mostly I spec disc right now - I hate it but then it's a change from healing as a resto druid);

    Guardian spirit is an amazing talent and I personally adore this one sosomeone asks whats so good about holy I'll say this. Its beautifully designed, re-triggers every minute with the glyph every time used - especially a raid healer with a mini lay on hands only without the boredom of being a holydin.

    You say resto druids are the HoTs spammers - also play a resto druid and yes I am a rejuv spammer. However - think of it this way; as a druid your two main heals are rejuv and an aoe hot heal on a 6 sec cooldown. That's only going to get you so far even if I completely love my tree druid. Renew I don't spec into as I don't single target heal I aoe heal as holy and single target heal as disc.

    So what do holy priests bring? Well, what don't they bring? they have the biggest variety of spells in addition to actually being fun. You've got your focus for single target, hot healing and aoe healing which no other class can match, buffs, bubble people and they get a momvement increase (yep if a dic doesn;t get there first) and you still heal after death.

    I adore holy, the variety of tools you get just make it extremely fun to play and at the end of the day - worst case scenario even if you spec disc it's changing a spec but the same class. If resto druids, shamans or holy pallies get screwed over then you're off to reroll a new spec.

    So yes - priests bring versatality. Aside from MT healing as holy and /ooming sure druids can hot up and shammies can chain heal - but my argument would purely be "great, so two classes can meet what one spec on a class with two healing trees can do".

    Best thing - dual spec disc and holy and you're essentially a MT, aoe and hot healing machine. That's what priests get over the other classes. Any healer is replaceable so why not bring the healer that can do it all

  8. #8

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    One of our biggest advantages is the glyphed Guardian Spirit. When used correctly, it is mega nice, and can even become the only reason needed, to bring a holy priest.
    Ofcourse, holy priests also have nice aoe heal's and targetted heals. Holy is pretty much a nice allround healer.

  9. #9

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Holy priests are don't excel in 1 field. Instead, they are a jack of all trades. They still have some really great moves though. Prayer of healing when there is aoe damage and the raid needs to be topped off fast, and guardian spirit is one of the best cds out there.

  10. #10

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    we can bring body and soul :P which is helpfull in some cases :P also as someone said we bring a good flexible class it also. also coh is a great heal and a instant cast. and god yes guardian spirit glyphed is just abit sexy :P specialy when the target dont die and its a 1 min cd. this is also great for dreamwalker as you can have it up on the dragon very often.

    also for noobs lightwell is a nice marker for them to see where to run if they got a debuff xD

    but yeah as said were a prety good all around healer. and a priest that knows ther stuff can pull some crazy high numbers on heavy aoe dmg fights =)

  11. #11

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aroll
    I made this topic mostly because of one of the responses here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-pr...he-lol-meters/

    It is stated that Holy is vastly inferior to disc. That being holy is actually gimping yourself, and possibly the raid. Now, what utilities do we bring that are essential for raiding ICC 25? I've been holy for 5 years and how I currently heal is easily replacable. Coh? Say hello to chain heal. Renew? Say hello resto druids. Guardian Spirit is nice, of course, but if thats all we really bring whats the point?

    SO, the question is what utility to we bring to the raids that other classes don't, and what is your approach (as a holy priest) to each fight in ICC? I am curious to see the responses.
    Have you ever done icc? i top the meters on my holy priest and i have the least overhealing done. and its been said thanks to me many times it wouldnt have been possible without me to down that boss.

  12. #12

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    ...raid healing?

    If you don't know what you bring to a raid, don't raid. Good players are highly effective at their spec, and you, apparently, are not.
    That's just between you, me, and my pal Captain Winky.

  13. #13

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dominate
    Best thing - dual spec disc and holy and you're essentially a MT, aoe and hot healing machine. That's what priests get over the other classes. Any healer is replaceable so why not bring the healer that can do it all
    Not really true

  14. #14
    Dreadlord
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    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    I disagree with the sentiment that Holy is vastly inferior to Discipline. In fact, with the exception of Infest, for which Discipline is certainly superior to all healers, Holy has an equal or better variety of tools for the damage patterns in all of the other ICC encounters. Hell, even in the Lich King encounter, Holy still does fine because we have sufficient burst healing to cover close to two groups of Infest, so we work very well with Discipline there without the toe-stepping problems of having a second Discipline Priest. Holy should have absolutely no problem performing respectably on the healing meters in every single encounter in ICC.

    But Holy brings more to the table than just decent healing. As others mentioned, the value of Guardian Spirit is difficult to overstate and can easily and repeatedly save raid-wipes. Not only is it the best cooldown, but it also generally has the shortest cooldown and be can used both proactively or reactively. Body and Soul is also a nice little trick that can easily save wipes on some encounters (eg, Putricide and LK) or at the very least save individual deaths on a number of other encounters (eg, Sindragosa).

    So we may not be the most versatile "healer" anymore, as we simply don't hold up for any significant length of time on single target throughput, we do just fine as raid healers and we bring some very useful other utility that no other class or spec can provide.

  15. #15

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aroll
    I made this topic mostly because of one of the responses here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-pr...he-lol-meters/

    It is stated that Holy is vastly inferior to disc. That being holy is actually gimping yourself, and possibly the raid. Now, what utilities do we bring that are essential for raiding ICC 25? I've been holy for 5 years and how I currently heal is easily replacable. Coh? Say hello to chain heal. Renew? Say hello resto druids. Guardian Spirit is nice, of course, but if thats all we really bring whats the point?
    Heh, because that statement is bullshit.

    You can top meters as Disc by blanket shielding when you have too many healers because you will show up very high on healing in all fights no matter what because meters read shields improperly and your effective shields will reduce others heals while giving you nearly 0% over-healing. It's a way to trick meters, not a way to be a good healer.

    Holy is an extremely good raid healer and brings Body and Soul and Guardian Spirit, which are both very strong. Holy also brings instant healing and HoTs in a better balance than Resto Druids. The issue a lot of Holy Priests are facing in not feeling worthwhile is that they're running low on haste, or under-using PoH, or both. Damage models in ICC have made up for many of Holy's throughput problems. Damage comes at a steady, low pace, or in predictable patterns. This allows Holy to do well despite lacking the raw power of Shaman, Paladins and Druids.

  16. #16

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    You don't have to bring some special utility to a raid to be useful. Be a good player, play good, heal your assigned targets. If they never die, you've done your job and you won't be replaced...
    Also where have you been all wotlk with it's "bring the player not the class(spec)" slogan?
    Correlation does not imply causation.

  17. #17
    Mechagnome funkyfloyd's Avatar
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    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    come cata it sure seems like priests will bring nothing to any raid or group makeup.

    nothing in any of the three trees.

    cant wait for the druid preview to find priests are being shunted even further in the background.
    'Let no man deceive himself. If any one among you seem to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.'
    Translation: you are not a fool.

  18. #18

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by zox
    You don't have to bring some special utility to a raid to be useful. Be a good player, play good, heal your assigned targets. If they never die, you've done your job and you won't be replaced...
    Also where have you been all wotlk with it's "bring the player not the class(spec)" slogan?
    I am a good player, at least so I have been told. The issue seems to always be "more hps aroll". I am like "I am not sure hps wise I am even suppose to touch druids..."


  19. #19

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aroll
    I am a good player, at least so I have been told. The issue seems to always be "more hps aroll". I am like "I am not sure hps wise I am even suppose to touch druids..."
    If no one dies, I don't see any problems. As holy you should be pretty close to druids in effective healing most of the time.
    Correlation does not imply causation.

  20. #20

    Re: Holy Priest: What do we bring to a raid?

    Quote Originally Posted by funkybug
    come cata it sure seems like priests will bring nothing to any raid or group makeup.
    Did you even read the rest of the thread? =/

    What other class gives:

    214 Stamina buff
    80 Spirit buff
    Tank-saving CD that works 100% of the time
    SPEED BUBBLES!
    Instant 6k heal to 6 people
    Nice +max mana cooldown to help other healers' mana
    "ZOMGWTF" healing cooldown to save raid from huge damage

    Quote Originally Posted by Precursor View Post
    "Fall of therzane....." ....um what? if that woman fell , god help us it will be the second cataclysm
    Words that lots of people don't seem to know the definition of:
    "Troll", "Rehash", "Casual", "Dead", "Dying", "Exploit".

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