A Slight Fear for Things to Come..

[Lionhearte0]

Hello fellow snowflakes, I am not sure if a topic has sprung up on this already, so I apologize if it has.

After reading the <a href="http://www.mmo-champion.com/class-mage/mages-its-here!!/">Mage Cataclysm Preview</a> awhile ago, it hit me how seriously Blizzard is trying to homogenize classes in Cata, with the new Time Warp ability acting like a slightly buffed up version (atleast for the mage) of Heroism/Bloodlust, all in accordance to their, "bring the player, not the class" motto.

This got me a little worried, so to speak. The thought began lingering in my head: What if Blizzard gave a battle-rez type spell to another class (Death Knight's <a href="http://www.wowhead.com/spell=61999">Raise Ally</a> doesn't count )? How would this impact the game? Of course, it isn't necessarily a bad thing, infact it may be a welcome change, especially for those 10-Man raids who don't bring a Druid.

I really just want to know how the Druid community would feel if one of their spells (or a cheap, or better, knockoff) was given to another class. Serious thread wants serious discussion.

[Uffman]

Bring the player not the class is a nice concept. But we still play different classes, and I think they really stretched the homogenizationwith Cataclysm to come. I really hope the 85 spells of each class can be used in some gimmick way in upcoming bossfights.

[Thetruth1400]

Bring the player not the class is a nice concept. But we still play different classes, and I think they really stretched the homogenizationwith Cataclysm to come. I really hope the 85 spells of each class can be used in some gimmick way in upcoming bossfights.

I agree for the most part, but I don't think they should use the spells for gimmicks on fights. That only leads to things like Naxx where you HAD to bring two priests to MC mobs.

I think Blizzard is pushing for too much homogenization, especially for healers.

The way Blizzard is making it is like a group of 10 Paladin friends should be able to group together and succeed, because "bring the player not the class" is their new thing. It's nice to want to play with your friends, but I doubt anyone on here really has 9 or 24 friends they HAVE to play with constantly that all happen to be the same class. It's a nice concept, but makes the differences in classes so minute that there might as well be 4 classes and that's it; Tank, Healer, DPS, Caster DPS.

[exochaft]

Well, we're starting to see WHY Blizzard is pushing towards homogenizing all roles and abilities shifting to new classes: their recent release about 10man and 25man raids sharing the same loot/lockouts/etc.

In order to balance 10man on the same difficulty as 25man, they need to give abilities to several classes so they can execute this raiding concept. 10man designs will have to revolve around heroism/bloodlust since 25mans will (at least for hard modes), unlike in previous content, otherwise class limitations would be set and only allow a couple class switches. Now I'm not saying I agree completely with why Blizz is distributing these unique skills, but with the raid changes in mind, I don't think druids will be losing our B-rez to another class (esp. when the CD goes back up to 30 minutes).

[Lionhearte0]

Well, we're starting to see WHY Blizzard is pushing towards homogenizing all roles and abilities shifting to new classes: their recent release about 10man and 25man raids sharing the same loot/lockouts/etc.

In order to balance 10man on the same difficulty as 25man, they need to give abilities to several classes so they can execute this raiding concept. 10man designs will have to revolve around heroism/bloodlust since 25mans will (at least for hard modes), unlike in previous content, otherwise class limitations would be set and only allow a couple class switches. Now I'm not saying I agree completely with why Blizz is distributing these unique skills, but with the raid changes in mind, I don't think druids will be losing our B-rez to another class (esp. when the CD goes back up to 30 minutes).

This makes a lot of sense, which is why I also figured they gave BL/H to mages, since it really is a key ability, and BR is more like a perk and shouldn't act as a gimmick or else things would get messy.

[Cocoe]

Actually it appears that they are moving the opposite way with CRs, but increasing the cooldown drastically again... Which means that it wont be such a huge buff as before, meaning they wont need to give it another to keep thinks balanced

[Cortano]

Personally, I'd prefer to see battle rez granted as a high level talent for all healing specs, and removed as a baseline druid talent.

Its not usable by feral bears already; and cats / boomkins need to be competitive with what other DPS classes bring to a raid without this talent. Its a nice ability, but just like druids got a real rez, other healers should get a battle rez. Just another core tool of the job.

[Deleted]

If it happens I'd accept it but I wouldn't like it

[ELEDIN]

Personally, I'd prefer to see battle rez granted as a high level talent for all healing specs, and removed as a baseline druid talent.

Its not usable by feral bears already; and cats / boomkins need to be competitive with what other DPS classes bring to a raid without this talent. Its a nice ability, but just like druids got a real rez, other healers should get a battle rez. Just another core tool of the job.

Then every healer should get also reincarnation, , lay on hands, buble, soulstone, heroism/bloodlust, and some other imba cd. And welcome to new blizzard game with one and only class with many names!!!

[Nirual]

Personally, I'd prefer to see battle rez granted as a high level talent for all healing specs, and removed as a baseline druid talent.

Its not usable by feral bears already

Depends on the encounter. On Sindragosa for example it's all too easy to use it while she is in the air or while you're resetting stacks.

That said, it seems like Rebirth will be much more limited in utility in cataclysm, and it's never really been a big enough factor to stack druids (or Warlocks for soulstones, or Shaman for self-ress).
They also seem to be going for an approach where each healer can do something special despite the homogenization. Priests get Life Grip, Shaman get to heal on the move, Paladins always had the special perk of being able to negate damage (and many debuffs) on selected targets outright.

And it's not just healers they seem to be changing that way.

[Deleted]

As a boomkin, I can afford 1 GCD to bring a DPS/Tank/Healer back to life, honestly.

[Snowulf]

Depends on the encounter. On Sindragosa for example it's all too easy to use it while she is in the air or while you're resetting stacks.

That said, it seems like Rebirth will be much more limited in utility in cataclysm, and it's never really been a big enough factor to stack druids (or Warlocks for soulstones, or Shaman for self-ress).
They also seem to be going for an approach where each healer can do something special despite the homogenization. Priests get Life Grip, Shaman get to heal on the move, Paladins always had the special perk of being able to negate damage (and many debuffs) on selected targets outright.

And it's not just healers they seem to be changing that way.

You have never seen a 10 man raid with all druids.

[Nikoll]

you know, i honestly thought paladins were going to get brez, and i'm not entirely sold that they are not (possible Divine intervention change?). battle rez is still the most powerful spel in the game. bloodlust a close second, but bloodlust doesnt get a gibbed tank back up. if it stays druid exclusive i'll be surprised.

[AnotherPaladin]

I'd like to see another class get this spell, as it would take some pressure off of the druid. I almost believe it should be a core-talent, as it just seems so vital to a raid.

[Nirual]

You have never seen a 10 man raid with all druids.

Yeah I haven't. Probably because noone feels the need to do so other than just for fun. In my 25mans, we had up to seven druids at one point but it honestly didnt make that much of a difference. One or two CR helps with rng-induced deaths but if you need that many CR's on hand your raid probably has other problems.

And by limited utility, I mean that they are going to take measures to avoid that.

[exochaft]

Personally, I'd prefer to see battle rez granted as a high level talent for all healing specs, and removed as a baseline druid talent.

Its not usable by feral bears already; and cats / boomkins need to be competitive with what other DPS classes bring to a raid without this talent. Its a nice ability, but just like druids got a real rez, other healers should get a battle rez. Just another core tool of the job.

I beg to differ. I'll admit for most bear tanks, it's nearly impossible while actively tanking. However, once you get a feel for your own latency, boss swing timers, and abilites that bosses cast that will not invoke a melee swing, you can easily pop out a b-rez while tanking a boss. Other tanks call me a crazy mofo for doing it, but I haven't died or been melee'd while doing it yet. Besides, since pretty much every boss fight has an OT, as a bear MT all you have to do is say "Hey OT, taunt for a couple seconds... <pop b-rez> ...taunting back."

Edit: Forgot to mention... another option, especially if your other tanks are dead ("gg, didn't we already rez you twice??"), have a pally bubble-taunt. I've actually had to do this on a number of occasions.

[Ormula]

I beg to differ. I'll admit for most bear tanks, it's nearly impossible while actively tanking. However, once you get a feel for your own latency, boss swing timers, and abilites that bosses cast that will not invoke a melee swing, you can easily pop out a b-rez while tanking a boss. Other tanks call me a crazy mofo for doing it, but I haven't died or been melee'd while doing it yet. Besides, since pretty much every boss fight has an OT, as a bear MT all you have to do is say "Hey OT, taunt for a couple seconds... <pop b-rez> ...taunting back."

Edit: Forgot to mention... another option, especially if your other tanks are dead ("gg, didn't we already rez you twice??"), have a pally bubble-taunt. I've actually had to do this on a number of occasions.

If I saw my tank drop from 60,000 HP to 38,000 HP, I'd probably have a heartattack.

[Trillivm]

give Brezz to another class? I don't care. haven't used my BR for a while anyway. by any means, BR was always a nice addition and never a compulsory thing or a requirement. for me it was always like "I wouldn't mind hearing 'Nice save there, Trill', so I should BR that dead guy" =))

[exochaft]

If I saw my tank drop from 60,000 HP to 38,000 HP, I'd probably have a heartattack.

Well, I warn them, obviously. :P
This is generally reserved for real emergencies, not every time that one "special" DPS dies from breathing every attempt. In ICC, it's even easier with the zone buff, since druids can easily be above 50k HP in caster... I pop Barkskin just in case some damage lands (and for anti-pushback mechanics), you can generally survive even HM melee doing this. Also, SI, if activated while in bear, persists in caster form, so it's another way to ensure you'll live.

Anyways, I digress. B-rez is already "on par" with a Soul Stone, just different strategies apply. If B-rez was given to all healers, the cooldown would be increased even beyond 30min to balance encounters. If it's given to just resto druids, it would feel mandatory to have at least one resto druid in raids, or stack resto druids to some degree. As it stands now, as long as there aren't limited attempts in Cataclysm, B-rez shouldn't make or break a fight attempts. Guilds won't be sitting around 30 minutes between attempts, at least.

[Lolretadin]

To be honest a battle rez would be a nice bonus for either Paladin or Priests seeing as Shaman already have a self rez ability.