Sindragosa

[K4ge]

I have no clue what you're talking about.

I have two specs, Eviscerate only and High Rupture.

High Rupture is where I don't use SS glyph because I like the cycle stability.

basically, there are 2 ways to play a rupture spec.
keep your normal cycle and refresh rutpure when it's not up (low uptime)
build your cycle around rupture uptime (high uptime)
Now, for combat with good gear the general rule of thumb, is that a low uptime cycle produces better results. The result of only going for high cp finishers while keeping snd up is generally higher than having a "stable" xsxrxe cycle

[Sesshou]

basically, there are 2 ways to play a rupture spec.
keep your normal cycle and refresh rutpure when it's not up (low uptime)
build your cycle around rupture uptime (high uptime)
Now, for combat with good gear the general rule of thumb, is that a low uptime cycle produces better results. The result of only going for high cp finishers while keeping snd up is generally higher than having a "stable" xsxrxe cycle

Now I have no basis for saying you are wrong or anything. But I'm wondering what model you used to get those results?

[Eyetotem]

I have a tendency to be nice to my healers as I am in a rather casual guild (dead people do no DPS). Whilst I think my healers are great, some of the DPS i run with could use some improvement on the reducing the damage they take.

I have never had an issue with energy capping using AR and BF.

The reason why you do not have a problem with energy capping is because (based on your sig) you are WAY below hit cap.....making it where Combat Potency rarely procs. You up your hit some and you will see that using AR + BF together will have you energy capped virtually the whole time.

[K4ge]

Now I have no basis for saying you are wrong or anything. But I'm wondering what model you used to get those results?

Aldrianas and mavanas spreadsheets both set SS glyph as far superior to rupture glyph

[Taalyn]

This post by Aldriana argues the value of GoSS and it is this post that I decide not to use GoSS for Rupture spec. I will likely run ToT instead of Eviscerate for Eviscerate spec as my crit is rather high anyway.

http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t39136-c...8/#post1611613

[Sesshou]

Aldrianas and mavanas spreadsheets both set SS glyph as far superior to rupture glyph

Aldriana also made a post on EJ saying that the rupture modeling in the sheet wasn't entirely accurate. He also explained how SS glyph wasn't modeled correctly for rupture spec.

Then theres Ald's post that Rahdik linked as well.

[Ferrik]

I'm surprised no one has said anything about the meta gems >.>

[K4ge]

There's no question: RED outvalues them all

[Sesshou]

I'm surprised no one has said anything about the meta gems >.>

Pretty sure (actually I am sure) I said that the 21 crit meta was bad and the rogue using it was therefore, also bad.

[Ricen]

lol 5 stacks does not kill you fail heals

[Sesshou]

lol 5 stacks does not kill you fail heals

I dunno I could see 5 stacks on HM with 5 stacks of the aura killing you during the suck in where the healers are running out.

[Spunky]

If u use proper cloak of shadow u will have 100% uptime on boss w/o worrying about any debuffs.

[TehInterwebz]

If u use proper cloak of shadow u will have 100% uptime on boss w/o worrying about any debuffs.

Care to tell us how you do the fight? I usually have to briefly stop dpsing.

[Spoogles]

IMO its a matter of personally checking your debuffs and watching your own HP its all good and well to say that you can cloak at 5 or 8 or 10+ stacks but if your not watching your HP at the same time you could find yourself dead with only 3 stacks and although it probably isnt your fault it could of been prevented by yourself with a little bit of awareness

[Annoying]

IMO its a matter of personally checking your debuffs and watching your own HP its all good and well to say that you can cloak at 5 or 8 or 10+ stacks but if your not watching your HP at the same time you could find yourself dead with only 3 stacks and although it probably isnt your fault it could of been prevented by yourself with a little bit of awareness

The stacks on melee are expected raid damage. Competent healers should have no problem with a standard (<6 or so) amount of stacks. It's generally not getting to 8+ stacks that kills you. It's not getting enough heals for the damage after you get to that level. I get to 8 stacks and cloak on hard mode every ground phase and only die when healers mess up. Sitting at 5/6 stacks between pull in's/phase changes shouldn't get you killed.

I dunno I could see 5 stacks on HM with 5 stacks of the aura killing you during the suck in where the healers are running out.

You probably should never get 5 stacks of mystic buffet as a rogue. I get maybe 2-3 if I'm free to dps the boss for a tiny bit between needing to kill iceblocks. Any more, and you're asking to die from your debuffs. Unless you have cloak, of course =D

[Sesshou]

The stacks on melee are expected raid damage. Competent healers should have no problem with a standard (<6 or so) amount of stacks. It's generally not getting to 8+ stacks that kills you. It's not getting enough heals for the damage after you get to that level. I get to 8 stacks and cloak on hard mode every ground phase and only die when healers mess up. Sitting at 5/6 stacks between pull in's/phase changes shouldn't get you killed.
You probably should never get 5 stacks of mystic buffet as a rogue. I get maybe 2-3 if I'm free to dps the boss for a tiny bit between needing to kill iceblocks. Any more, and you're asking to die from your debuffs. Unless you have cloak, of course =D

I agree you shouldnt get that many. Just saying...

[Pastor]

I said I would update here once we tested some things out.

First, my DPS went up from 7400 in 25 Saurfang, to 8700 this week in the same fight.

Second, Sindragosa isn't causing our rogues to hold off dps like they were.. The modified play style is a success, we made some progress (down to 1.7 mil) but no kill yet.


Certainly a worthwhile discussion and I hope more people benefit from it down the road.
Thanks.

[MMO scrub]

Are you a 100% sure that the debuff doesnt proc off your attack speed? I had to stop at every tenth second to reset the debuff off of 4 stacks. It got too much so I logged my warrior

[Struthy]

I dunno I could see 5 stacks on HM with 5 stacks of the aura killing you during the suck in where the healers are running out.

5 stacks and the passive aoe dmg would probably kill you on 25heroic.

Not sure about you other rogues, but all our rogues (mut and combat) spend most of the time on block dps in p3 since we build up debuff stacks the fastest (the good old haste machines we are)

[Zogrim]

Last time I checked it was inferior to gem agi

Last time I HEARD (not 110% on this) that Rawr is SHIT!!!

This.
You're better off with using a real - working - spreadsheet.
Agility sucks with ICC gear because of white critcap issues. Rawr doesn't take this into account because before ICC noone thought that you're going to reach it.