Normal Mode = Warm up

[Mixon]

Why are so many ppl getting all hot and bothered by normal mode buffs and titles and what not? Normal modes are practice to let you see the fight and learn the mechanics where they have relativity little consequence for mistakes. We act like hard mode are super douper hard when in reality they are just the same fight but now there are consequence for making mistakes and not doing the stuff your are supposed to. i support the buffs in normal modes they help us practice the fight and see the mechanics to get ready to not mess up on them. i do however find it ridiculous that they added to buff to the hard modes kinda defeats the purpose no?

or am i totally off base here?

[Garnik]

You can remove the buff, you know that right?

The ICC buff is there as a way to nerf the bosses, instead of just actually nerfing the bosses. And it can get removed, so all those die-hard raid guilds can make it a little harder.

[Mixon]

You can remove the buff, you know that right?

The ICC buff is there as a way to nerf the bosses, instead of just actually nerfing the bosses. And it can get removed, so all those die-hard raid guilds can make it a little harder.

not exactly what i meant but props for trying to understand at least!

[Gron]

Buffs were added to ease the game along the months - it provides more opportunities for people to experience content.
It helps guilds advance, and helps Blizzard stay in the business, as people can see 1 new boss every week, etc.

[Deleted]

Because people want to be special snowflakes and thus get mad at people "inferior" to them using the "same" gear.
(Assuming I get your point.)

[Bakis]

Normal mode = for casuals
At least half the heroic modes = for casuals (given time, which passed long ago)

Deal with it

[levitate]

Normal mode = for casuals

What's your definition of "casuals"?

[Bakis]

Casuals for me personally is someone who either are in a laid back guild which have relaxed raiddays with no demand for attendence or a players who only enter raid instances in pugs.
What is your definition?

[Bakis]

Thing is LK normal is much more challenging than many heroic nonwing bosses. That is why the progress in hc ICC is still off limit to less hardcore/casual, guilds/players.

[hellpyre]

casuals, if theyre good, can do the same content as any hardcore guild with maybe a few weeks time difference, if it means the hardcores get to feel better for having downed the content with 5% less of a buff, good for them, now a bad player will still die in marrowgars fire no matter how hard you buff his dmg, but a casual isnt necessarily bad, they just have less time to commit to wow cuz of say, work, or not living in a basement :P

[Bakis]

They can do much of the same content, not all the same content. Some fights in ICC still demand a welloiled team who understand what to do without written orders or speaches on ventrilo.

Part of being casual is also that they spend much less time playing. That doesn't mean they are automaticly bad, far from it. However it does mean its much much bigger risk that a casual got too little experience and knowhow of the game or a bossfight to be as good as a noncasual.

[SPC7R0]

Normal mode = for casuals
At least half the heroic modes = for casuals

Basic Concept of a wow player:
noobs < you < nolifers

i am only in BQL in 10 man normal mode with my newb friends, i quit serious raiding after i killed half of the ulduar 25 hardmodes, (well tbh was when i killed KJ lol wotlk ftw) and guess what, wow has never been so much fun for me..

in a serious guild:
dumb wipe: nerdraging elitists arguing with everyone, usually making me grab my guitar and put it loud as fck until i see a readycheck popping out

in my guild:
dumb wipe: laughter for 30 minutes, possibly causing the next try to be a wipe, causing even more laughter xP


yeh imba titles are worth all of the hours spent listening to your nerdraging guild leader

[Bakis]

The classic ventrecording "MINUS DKP!" comes to mind

[Jon]

What's your definition of "casuals"?

Bad players. If you're stuck on normal modes, you're a bad player.. or you're surrounded by bad players.

Normal mode ICC bosses are so easy, that even the most average player can clear them with buffs.

Personally, I don't think the term "casual" should have anything to do with the skill level.. it's more about the time you spend to play the game. Any good casual player will have no problem clearing the normal modes easily, and most of the hardmodes too.

Players struggling with normal modes aren't casual, they're just bad.

[SPC7R0]

Bad players. If you're stuck on normal modes, you're a bad player.. or you're surrounded by bad players.

Normal mode ICC bosses are so easy, that even the most average player can clear them with buffs.

Personally, I don't think the term "casual" should have anything to do with the skill level.. it's more about the time you spend to play the game. Any good casual player will have no problem clearing the normal modes easily, and most of the hardmodes too.

Players struggling with normal modes aren't casual, they're just bad.

Am i bad because i only killed a third of normal ICC 10??
my guild only raids on saturdays, i cant log for more than two hours in any other day along with everyone else from my guild, we all have the same schedules

btw i have togc10 finished with 49 tries, is that being bad?

[Bakis]

ICC normal is pisseasy basicly cos the fights are so forgiving and overall about moving from stuff on the floor.
Trying to think up encounters where a single BAD player can wipe the raid (not incl a retarded MT :P) and that list came up pretty short indeed.

[Nigeldruid]

Am i bad because i only killed a third of normal ICC 10??
my guild only raids on saturdays, i cant log for more than two hours in any other day along with everyone else from my guild, we all have the same schedules

btw i have togc10 finished with 49 tries, is that being bad?

I'm playing a guild doing 1 raid a week (being friday night) as that's all we can muster and we've done 11/12 hc 10man, so ye only reaching BQL is not great :P

Besides.. it seems you've had some pretty hectic guild leaders in the past.. not all are like that, not even in top end guilds.

[Bakis]

A good guildleader is of the outmost importance. 25 players in the raid, many of them might be bad at handling stress or bickering, ppl poiting fingers on a wipe etc.
Having a calm, relaxed and fair guildleader to stear the boat is what every good guild need. It's simply no way a guild can go really far with some damp guildleader/raidleader.

[Szyrex]

Why are so many ppl getting all hot and bothered by normal mode buffs and titles and what not? Normal modes are practice to let you see the fight and learn the mechanics where they have relativity little consequence for mistakes. We act like hard mode are super douper hard when in reality they are just the same fight but now there are consequence for making mistakes and not doing the stuff your are supposed to. i support the buffs in normal modes they help us practice the fight and see the mechanics to get ready to not mess up on them. i do however find it ridiculous that they added to buff to the hard modes kinda defeats the purpose no?

or am i totally off base here?

I guess you just killed Lich king 10 man HM..?

[LeperHerring]

Basic Concept of a wow player:
noobs < you < nolifers

In reality after a certain point the more skilled players actually raid less than the average due to the fact that you clear everything much faster when you don't wipe to idiotic crap.

i am only in BQL in 10 man normal mode with my newb friends, i quit serious raiding after i killed half of the ulduar 25 hardmodes, (well tbh was when i killed KJ lol wotlk ftw) and guess what, wow has never been so much fun for me..

Not everyone enjoys end-game raiding, that's fine.

in a serious guild:
dumb wipe: nerdraging elitists arguing with everyone, usually making me grab my guitar and put it loud as fck until i see a readycheck popping out

That's a shit guild with wannabe elitists, not a serious guild. In a serious guild you figure out what when wrong, fix it and then go again as fast as possible. Sure sometimes you need to raise your voice, but that's simply because getting yelled at drills the mistake into your brain much better than someone calmly explaining why you fucked up, thus making it less likely you repeat it - it's nothing personal, just the way human mind works.

in my guild:
dumb wipe: laughter for 30 minutes, possibly causing the next try to be a wipe, causing even more laughter xP

I might do that on alt runs while still enjoying proper raiding on main.

yeh imba titles are worth all of the hours spent listening to your nerdraging guild leader

If you think that's what end-game raiding is about, then you've never been an end-game raider.