AVR - Best thing ever or unbelievably retarded?

[anyaka21]

I'd also point out, in terms of boss mods, whether that be avre, dbm, dxe, or hwatever, we'd still be back in the days of vanilla naxx in terms of fight complexity. What boss mods do is allow Blizz to actually make more difficult, more complex boss fights.

Without the tools we have today, again, we'd be back in the stone age of raiding where there was a ton of tank and spank.

[Deleted]

Look, if you want to get LK down on 25, use it, it's a good addon that replaces brain for the bads, bads simply do not need brain while using avr. only eyes. how is this not a good thing? every casual guild can kill every 25m normalmode aslong as they use AVR, even some of the heroic modes. it is a good addon, i dont really get the statement of why should it NOT be made mandatory in any guild, unless looking for real challenge, but then again, the icc buff is removable too, so why not remove that aswell, afterall it's only there to make stuff easier to kill.

[Archimand]

Leaving stupid comments like ban avr or mods that playing the game for u aside
bench ppl that cant drop defile good from the raid this is encounter that dont forgive mistakes 1 defile can easily wipe the raid
for all those ppl that say that avr is crap u can say the same for dbm or decursive u dont really need to look for when the boss is about to cast ability dbm does it for u and it make things really trivial some boss mods even show you arrow where to run so i dont see whats the problem is

[Vanni]

AVR needs to be banned.

wait wait wait...AVR needs to be banned? Something that's actually useful?

First let's get rid of the utter faggotry that is Gearscore. Then we'll consider looking at AVR. Till then...deal with it.

[Duskmourne]

In my mind: It's not the problem; but rather a symptom.

People are getting lazier and lazier, and thinking less and less.

[xeroxide]

Right now at 11/12 Heroic25 I think its kind of a neat mod, but its attachment AVRE is something I won't personally use. It just seems like something that Blizzard won't let last too long as its just pushing the limits.

same, it's avre that's the "omg how is this legal???" mod.
avr seems to me just to be an awesome flare replacement for discussing strats.

besides with aussie/malay ping already dragging our guild down, don't want extra crap hogging up bandwidth with un-needed synching. that and GS seem to make a lot of us DC during fights.

however i would also point out that a lot of raid timer mods give OMG so much more info, having neat timers letting you know when the next defile, soul reaper, incest, shambler and necrotic plague is going off... could also be called OP... perhaps even more so than avre.... however they still require you to be aware what's around you.... with avre... yeh people who stand in fire will still fail.

[NathSB]

TL;DR version: What's your opinion on AVR? Is it making raiding a huge joke or is it the best thing ever? Why do you feel this way?

Please no "LOLOL THE RAIDS ARE ALREADY STUPID EASY UR DUMB" comments and please no commenting on my personal raid progression. All I'm asking about is your opinion on this mod.

While I don't mind people using the addon, I feel it's kinda redundant. DBM is more than enough. People use all these addons and internet-posted tactics, and then they whine about how easy raiding is.

I PUGed ICC up to Festergut without any addons at all (fresh install of WoW) a good while back. I was tanking, and we wiped once, because of a chain of major screwups, arguably triggered by a stupid mistake I could have done even with DBM spamming my screen. Thing is, the experience was far more enjoyable than earlier guild-runs, and far more successful too, as I actually had to think and pay attention.

[shocknawe]

our guild uses it just for the circles it puts under peoples feet if they dont have plague sickness in h PP and so i can always stay close to where the ice block is about to be in h sindragosa

not like it plays the game for you, just gives you a better idea where x yards from someone is or who has a debuff, which are both things other addons do using numbers

[taureninator]

i am 11/12 HM 10 and 10/12 HM 25 - our raid recently required AVR

i personally turn everything during combat off - i find the circles and things distracting, but i know alot of people who have trouble knowing where to stand use it alot

its not a "is AVR bad" conversation - people reacted teh same way to DBM and shit like that - we all excell at different parts of life - if your really good about judging how much 10 yards is, or moving when shadow crash is going out, then you dont need the addon - if you have trouble with it then get the addon and see if it helps

to each his own

[pomop]

I was thinking about what to say in response to this but all I can say is thank you. Makes a lot of sense when you put it that way, haha.

As a guildie of mine just put it "I don't have a problem with the mod, I think it's useful, I just have a problem with US using the mod. We're using it in the 'last resort lets all hold hands cuz we suck omg" kinda way" and I guess that's what I was feeling too.

Hopefully people will get their shit together and tonight's raid will go a little smoother with this mod.

Pretty much my same reaction. I still think that 'bad' players will still be bad, with or without the use of addons. :/

[njd.aitken]

If you don't need it, but it is mandatory, why don't you just DL in anyway, turn it on for raids, and just play the same way.

It is helping your guild, why would you not like it?

[foofymoonkin]

One day, raid with no mods and using all default.

Thats where the fun is (yes, I've done it. Festergut was a blast cause I missed every spore )

[herpecin]

AVR and AVRE are great addons IMHO.

do they play the game for you? no.

are they game breaking? no.

anyone who would die in a fire without AVR will 95% of the time die with AVR because their problem is computer/internet/IQ<50.

what it DOES do is gives you a realistic range check. boss mods already have range frames but they jsut tell you who is close not where they are in relation to you. and if you have never been to ICC before you can simply follow 2 basic rules and they will work in all but 1 ability. First if the circle moves with you make sure no one else is in it. Second if the circle doesn't move with you get out of it.

makes explaining boss fights a lot less time consuming when in PuGs or with new guild members.

[Blues`]

AVR - Best thing ever for the unbelievably retarded.

Being serious, i think AVR does simplify a lot the implementation and execution of a strategy by adding visual elements that are impossible not to see and informative at the same time. But it is not necessary, it just reduces the amount of skill necessary in positioning during a boss fight and avoiding random crap.

[draticus]

The people who hate AVR are a lot like some of the people that hate gearscore. I call them the black + whiters. They say AVR is completely useless because its possible to use it and still fail. All or nothing, it has to play the game for you or its uselss. They say the same thing about gearscore. Gearscore doesn't guarantee someone will perform so its completely useless. All or nothing.

AVR gives you more information. It helps. Its a tool, just like DBM. It wont MAKE you good. It wont play the game for you. Some people also argue that its a crutch and good players shouldn't need it. I call these people pseudo purists. They arbitrarily draw a line where they feel like it and call anything past it a crutch. If something that makes the game easier is a crutch then why are you using strength of wrynn, flasks, Vent, DBM, key bindings, or any mods at all? They're all things that make the game easier and they're all things that were intended to be part of the game. Blizzard already said they design encounters assuming you use vent and boss mods like DBM/AVR. If they don't like it they can disable it. Until then... if you mess up even once when AVR would have prevented it then you're an idiot.

[hugeericshin]

AVR is awesome!
AVRE however, is not.

[codeparadox]

AVR is a mod/addon that lets people who should NOT be raiding, the ability to maybe raid a little better. Fail is fail. Everyone knows that. And it's really discouraging to know there are guilds out there that have cleared up to The Lich King and are still having problems weeding out the people that shouldn't be raiding. Carrying someone through a raid is pathetic, and what more, the person being carried should be ashamed to accept any loot that is given to them/they receive.

[Gramgaido]

Honestly I've only found AVR Encounters to be useful on Rotface and Putricide. And the basic AVR on Putricide (particularly heroic) and Sindragosa 25.

People who stand in fire are going to stand in fire, people who don't don't need another mod to help them from not standing in fire. For Sindragosa setting up a patern for Ice Tombs is fantastic and seeing where the Ooze explosion is going to land is great, but the majority of fights don't really benefit from it, and the mentioned fights are easily done without it. In the end I think AVR and AVR Encounters just sucks up CPU usage. If AVR really feels like cheating to you, your probably bad.

[Rayvene]

It's just another tool. BigWigs and DBM are just tools too. AVRE provides graphical warnings where boss mods provide text warnings.

But requiring any addon is stupid. The game can be played with the default UI, anything a player does to modify it beyond that should be the player's choice, not the raid leader's or guild master's choice.

[seam]

TL;DR version: What's your opinion on AVR? Is it making raiding a huge joke or is it the best thing ever? Why do you feel this way?

My opinion? It's a mod for people who want/need it. It's a tool, and nothing more.

Is it making raiding a joke? Well, it's like link using a air pump as opposed to an air compressor to air up a bike tire. You can do it either way, but one is faster, more efficiant, and is easier.

That said, I'm not against it. I won't use it, but there are people out there who might need it.

Plus, it's an advancement in making addons, which is always good.