Unholy vs Frost Aoe

[Coldbringer]

I was just getting into this conversation with a friend, which has better potential aoe when running or standing still, against certain types of mobs or when certain things are affecting damage, just things like that.

My friend was routing for unholy cuz he's more comfortable with the play style and cuz of wandering plague potential but i was routing for both (more towards frost).

Wat do u guys think has more potential for aoe?

[Atty]

Depends. Unholy aoe doesn't cap at 10 mobs. But then again the only ability that caps for frost is howling blast.

On the other hand, unholy is definitely easier.

[Rawfury]

Unholy.

[Zerioc]

Frost is better burst, Unholy is better sustained.

[Deleted]

Frost is better burst, Unholy is better sustained.

This pretty much sums everything up. If you get a bit lucky with frost you may get a lot of Rime procs but the chance of getting enough to compete with Unholy in the longer term is probably somewhere around 0.15%.

[Vaka]

agreed. As Canuk stated, Frost is bursty, and is also very proc dependant. If you're talking long, sustained aoe dps, you can't do much better than Unholy.

[Coldbringer]

say like trash before marrow vs trash after saurfang to plague

[Vaka]

for reliable aoe on trash, like you specified above, go with Unholy. Frost can do big numbers, but as I said above it's highly dependent on procs. If you don't get any rime/KM procs, you're not going to get those fat Howling Blasts and your damage on large add packs will suck. Unholy only depends on dropping a well placed D&D, putting up and spreading diseases, and blood boiling like there's no tomorrow.

[Lakelancelot]

Unholy is better no doubt if aoe specced

[Coldbringer]

i usually go unholy frost sub spec, which was for people with a proc weap single target the last time i looked

so yea, basically your saying unholy is easier to do damage with. It makes sense cuz its not dependent on procs

but yea thanks on your guys thoughts

[Razordeath]

I would have to agree Unholy is best

[Deleted]

Depends. Unholy aoe doesn't cap at 10 mobs. But then again the only ability that caps for frost is howling blast.

On the other hand, unholy is definitely easier.

well, actually, wandering plague also caps at 10 targets. they have done math on this matter on EJ. http://elitistjerks.com/f72/t72364-u...5/#post1652223 for more info.

edit: or does unholy have other AOE, because both frost and unholy have diseases.

[Nangz]

Burst: Frost
Sustained: Unholy

Sustained aganinst more than 10 mobs is still unholy because while mob number will reduce WP, HB, and dnd damage it won't reduce disease damage which is 30% higher for unholy anyway.

[Shiira]

People always talk about how frost has better burst aoe and unholy has better sustained aoe, what you don't often hear about is where the break even point is.

This is napkin maths but it seems like for my gear, which is admittedly pretty arp heavy as I'm gearing for frost, it takes about five seconds for unholy to catch up if frost uses killing machine for howling blast. It would of course be much faster with a normal howling blast or more than ten targets.

[Nangz]

People always talk about how frost has better burst aoe and unholy has better sustained aoe, what you don't often hear about is where the break even point is.

This is napkin maths but it seems like for my gear, which is admittedly pretty arp heavy as I'm gearing for frost, it takes about five seconds for unholy to catch up if frost uses killing machine for howling blast. It would of course be much faster with a normal howling blast or more than ten targets.

Are you factoring in frost using diseases aswell?

It basically is WP 30% stronger diseases and 30% stronger dnd vs HB

[yaij9841]

well, actually, wandering plague also caps at 10 targets. they have done math on this matter on EJ. http://elitistjerks.com/f72/t72364-u...5/#post1652223 for more info.

edit: or does unholy have other AOE, because both frost and unholy have diseases.

doesn't unholy's diseases have a boost or two that frost doesn't have access to?

[yaij9841]

Burst: Frost
Sustained: Unholy

Sustained aganinst more than 10 mobs is still unholy because while mob number will reduce WP, HB, and dnd damage it won't reduce disease damage which is 30% higher for unholy anyway.

i was under the impression that any disease user benefits from one dk's crypt fever/ebonplague.

[Shiira]

Are you factoring in frost using diseases aswell?

It basically is WP 30% stronger diseases and 30% stronger dnd vs HB

I factored in diseases but didn't assume that dnd would be used as frost, I haven't actually done the maths on this but it seems like the awkward rune cost and lost chances to proc rime would make it not worth it.

[vrann]

Burst: Frost
Sustained: Unholy

Sustained aganinst more than 10 mobs is still unholy because while mob number will reduce WP, HB, and dnd damage it won't reduce disease damage which is 30% higher for unholy anyway.

[Coldbringer]

yea correct me if im wrong but i think shiira is right. Dnd is bad for frost damage overall cuz of the rune cost.

dnd- frost unholy and blood

followed by diseases and pest= all runes on cd

at that point u will have 1 blood rune and 1 death which is a waste, u would prob use HB followed by an oblit, then blood strike and pest.

this would put u back on your rotation.