Is arm pen viable for enh

[Khailik]

I DO NOT play enh first off just let me state that. So I have no real clue what to aim for. But I've been picking up melee mail pieces in ICC that no one needs and well I've got almost a complete set but it's all mostly arm pen stuff so yeah...

[Zhalseran]

short answer: no
long answer: nooooooooooooooooooooo


Honestly, ArP doesn't technically hurt to have, it will still give you extra damage that you wouldn't otherwise have. The fact of the matter is you do mostly magic damage, which armor penetration doesn't do a thing for. Avoid it as much as you can.

[Arathull]

you avoid armor pen because most of your stats are spell based, you benifit more from haste/crit/attack power

[Khailik]

Ok I'll just sell the arm pen stuff then.

[wintersbane]

my enhancement shaman is only level 71, but from what I gather the majority of our damage comes from spells.(shock spells, lava lash, windfury proc, Lightning bolt, ect.)

Arp. penn only effects phsyical damage, for example a warrior. all of their damage is phyiscal. whereas for a paladin, some of their attacks are considered holy damage.

although, I don't know if Windfury counts as physical damage.. it might be nature damage, I don't know.

but essentially Armor penn would only be viable for enhancement shamans if the MAJORITY of their damage is physical, and even then it would still not be very useful.. sort of like how it's viable for Ret Pallies, but not an often sought after stat.

[ticktickboom]

The answer you are looking for: no
While arp is almost unavoidable, leave things like DBW to the other classes. A good way to remember is that we usually use maces, which don't visually benefit from ARP

/edit: okay DBW bad example, i didnt mean the proc part, but just the static ArP part. And by visually benefit, i meant sharp shit=need ArP, blunt shit (maces)=doesnt need ArP. sorry for being confusing.

[Truffelz]

alot of your gear from icc is going to have armour pen on it since its hunter gear.
its worthwhile keeping until you get urself something better, i myself am running with leggings of northern lights since i cant get anything better atm.

[Vargarii]

Majority of our dmg DOES NOT come from spells. around 40% is. 60% would be able to make use of armor pen. You should not go out of your way to avoid armor pen. because of that. Rogues get 30% dmg from their poisons and it's still a useful stat.

The fact isn't that armor pen is bad, it's just that it falls a little short of haste/ap. This is why we still have BiS arp pieces. Don't go avoiding armor pen if it is an upgrade, but don't go stacking it or gemming it, either.

[Fornaw]

With the exception of weapons, trinkets, and tier bonuses choose gear like this basically.

ilvl>stats

People are going to hate on me for this, but at the same time all the theorycrafting is generally going to agree that the 13 ilvls gap between tiers is generally enough to make up a piece having armor pen. Don't throw away ICC gear just because it has ArP, it will almost always be better than non-ICC gear. Several pieces of our BiS have ArP because there is no other choice in ilvl 277. If there was mail with agility and spirit that would invalidate this statement, but Wrath has had an unprecedented uniformity in the way stats have been assigned to epics.

[Intoeternity]

Rogues get 30% dmg from their poisons and it's still a useful stat

lol? our mut rogues are pushing 30% melee attacks, 35% instant poison, 15-18% envenom, 10-15% mutilate, and the rest deadly poison/mote of angers.. 65% nature damage > 30% for mut.

[Epiclurker]

Yes and no for armor pen.
Yes take the gear if its all you have for that spec and/ or its improve your damage done.
No its not optimal since aside from your auto attacks your not getting much from it.
Take what you can get in the beginning and build from there.

[Deleted]

lol? our mut rogues are pushing 30% melee attacks, 35% instant poison, 15-18% envenom, 10-15% mutilate, and the rest deadly poison/mote of angers.. 65% nature damage > 30% for mut.

heard of combat rogues?

OT; no, haste & AP is better

[Gray_Matter]

alot of your gear from icc is going to have armour pen on it since its hunter gear.

This is a big problem for casuals. I won the roll on http://www.wowhead.com/?item=49988 in a pug and after a lot of complaining by a hunter in the group about ArP not being a Enh Shammy stat, they decided to give the pants to him. At the time, I had my 232 T9 pants so it was a good upgrade for me.

[Vargarii]

lol? our mut rogues are pushing 30% melee attacks, 35% instant poison, 15-18% envenom, 10-15% mutilate, and the rest deadly poison/mote of angers.. 65% nature damage > 30% for mut.

As previously stated, the numbers i used were from the parses of a combat rogue. It doesn't make my point invalid, as combat rogues do make use of ArP.

/edit nor does it change that they have a similar amount of non ArP dmg and still make use of it, as well.

[Deleted]

The answer you are looking for: no
While arp is almost unavoidable, leave things like DBW to the other classes. A good way to remember is that we usually use maces, which don't visually benefit from ARP

This answer is highly misleading. DBW has a small static ArP rating but that has bugger all to do with whether its a good trinket or not the huge majority of its damage comes from the proc and NOT the ArP so avoiding it because it has ArP is just plain daft. There are certainly better trinkets out there but it is a good trinket for Enhance.

And WTF is the mace comment meant to mean? "don't visually benefit"??

[Deleted]

Ok I'll just sell the arm pen stuff then.

A mistake. There are some really good items with ArP out there and it helps 50-60% of your Enh damage so its a decent stat. However there are a lot better stats out there. Try reading the FAQ for information.

[Charo]

This answer is highly misleading. DBW has a small static ArP rating but that has bugger all to do with whether its a good trinket or not the huge majority of its damage comes from the proc and NOT the ArP so avoiding it because it has ArP is just plain daft. There are certainly better trinkets out there but it is a good trinket for Enhance.

And WTF is the mace comment meant to mean? "don't visually benefit"??

I think he meant, just keep telling yourself that you're using blunt weapons so they shouldn't benefit from ARP (lol mace spec @ warrior/rogue??) in the first place... it was a joke.

[Omanley]

lol? our mut rogues are pushing 30% melee attacks, 35% instant poison, 15-18% envenom, 10-15% mutilate, and the rest deadly poison/mote of angers.. 65% nature damage > 30% for mut.

i may be wrong, but arent melee attacks and mutilate physical damage? if so it would be 30 +10-15% => 40-45% physical damage, 55-60% poison.

you avoid armor pen because most of your stats are spell based, you benifit more from haste/crit/attack power

my enhancement shaman is only level 71, but from what I gather the majority of our damage comes from spells

wrong. i dunno why people keep raising the percentage of magic damage we do. our melee dmg is 50-60% in most cases ( with 60% being the most frequent especially in boss fights ).

The answer you are looking for: no
While arp is almost unavoidable, leave things like DBW to the other classes. A good way to remember is that we usually use maces, which don't visually benefit from ARP Cheesy

big fail. you dont take trinkets for the static stats. also the Taiaj trinket has only 85 hit, which makes it not better in terms of static stats. whispering fanged skull is packed with a huge amount of crit, which will haunt you because of melee crit cap at higher gear lvl. best overallstat on trinkets would be attackpower. every melee wants it and you cant have enough of it. for some reason blizzard doesn´t want to add it on icc trinkets though.

fact: DBW 264 beats Taiaj 264 in 6/8 of my different gear setups simmed
DBW is similar good to WFS 264 and Taiaj 264, maybe it´s the overall second best 264 trinket after herkuml for us. pity to those not knowing that and willingly giving it to other classes because of it.

Majority of our dmg DOES NOT come from spells. around 40% is. 60% would be able to make use of armor pen. You should not go out of your way to avoid armor pen. because of that. Rogues get 30% dmg from their poisons and it's still a useful stat.

The fact isn't that armor pen is bad, it's just that it falls a little short of haste/ap. This is why we still have BiS arp pieces. Don't go avoiding armor pen if it is an upgrade, but don't go stacking it or gemming it, either.

that sums it up pretty well. good job :-*

[Millhouse Manastorm]

This is a big problem for casuals. I won the roll on http://www.wowhead.com/?item=49988 in a pug and after a lot of complaining by a hunter in the group about ArP not being a Enh Shammy stat, they decided to give the pants to him. At the time, I had my 232 T9 pants so it was a good upgrade for me.

Moral for the story: don't pug with 12 year olds.

[SkyBlueAri]

Ok I'll just sell the arm pen stuff then.

Nah dude keep it because if one day in the future u need a stat from that peice of armor then ur screwed because uve sold it. Unless u hav something that will never be used again (ie naxx gear) then dont sell it. ICC stuff is good to just hav incase another upgrade u got brings u under hit cap or expertise cap.