Just how important is 4p10?

[ammo187]

There seems to be a general consensus that 4p10 is the way to go, but given the gear I currently have available to me, I was hoping to get some opinions.

I'm an Affliction warlock currently running with 2p10 (head/robe), and two non-set items (shoulders/hands). My current hit rating is 352 -- I'm Alliance so I get the 1% Draenei bonus to reach the hit cap. Here's what I have:

Head - Dark Coven Hood (251)
Shoulders - Shoulders of Mercy Killing (264)
Robe - Dark Coven Robe (251)
Legs - Leggings of Woven Death (264)
Gloves - Gunship Captain's Mittens (264)
Belt - Lingering Illness (264)

If I swap out the two non-set 264 peices for two 251 set peices and swap the Lingering Illness for the Belt of Omission (to maintain my hit rating), I get the following stat changes:

+4p10 Bonus
+158 Crit
-90 Spirit
-97 Haste
-53 Spell Power
-1 Hit

My main question is not what my end result should be, (of course I want 4p10.264) but rather what I should run with in the meantime until the better tier peices are available.

So, given that spell power and haste are more important than crit for affliction, if I "downgrade" to all 251 set gear, is the set bonus worth running over the offset two 264 peices? Certainly, if I had access to sanctification tokens things change... but then I also consider whether to just upgrade the two peices I already have (head/robe) and get to 4x264 quicker. I also understand that gear score isn't everything, which is why I proposed this thread.

Thanks in advance.

[Goatonlb]

Yes, the 4pc bonus is worth in excess of 400+ DPS. It's worth the loss in stats to switch down to ilvl 251 gear, especially since you've already solved the hit issue.

---------- Post added 06-18-2010 at 06:26 PM ----------

Sorry, bolded text ftl. Keep the pants, switch the shoulders and gloves.

[Doctadrew]

4pc is too good to pass up for anything

[ammo187]

Thanks for the prompt replies, but is it possible to get a more detailed explanation that can tell me why?

[gherkin]

Assume perfect conditions.
Assume 300 second fight.
We know Devious Minds (T10 4PC Proc) has no ICD.
100 UA ticks.
15 of these will proc Devious Minds.
However, some of these overlap. P stand for Proc, X stands for no proc. These are the iterations
PP = Clipped at 3s (7s lost)
PXP = Clipped at 6s (4s lost)
PXXP = Clipped at 9s (1s lost)

PP = .15 x .15 = 2.25% chance of occurring.
PXP = .15 x .85 x .15 = 1.9% chance of occuring.
PXXP = .15 x .85 x .85 x .15 = 1.6% chance of occuring

2.25% chance to lose 7 seconds = 15.75s lost per 100 ticks
1.9% chance to lose 4 seconds = 7.6s lost per 100 ticks
1.6% chance to lose 1 second = 1.6s lost per 100 ticks

(15 procs x 10s duration) - 15.75 - 7.6 - 1.6 = 125s/300s uptime = 41.67%

10% damage bonus x 41.67% uptime = 4.167% Damage increase.

Simply apply 4% to your dps and thats how much damage it increases by. If I do 12000 damage, 12000 x 0.04 = 480 dps. 4pc 251 T10 > 4pc non tier 277

[ammo187]

Thanks so much for that explanation. Given that, how much am I losing by making the two downgrades?

What's the affliction dps value of these summed up?
+158 Crit
-90 Spirit
-97 Haste
-53 Spell Power

---------- Post added 06-18-2010 at 06:12 PM ----------

So I just did a quick test on a training dummy using an identical rotation. I tried 4p10+belt swap against the gear that I listed above and my dps was about 500-600 LOWER with the 4p10. I guess I really need those tokens to use it. Unless I did something wrong.

[Greyarea]

training dummies are horrible to do tests with. Use simcraft to test out the optimal gear set up.

Like many others have said, the 4pT10 will boost your DPS by a very nice number, that number is still a percentage of your total damage so it also depends on your off set gear too like boots, rings trinkets ETC. The better your offset gear gets the better the devious minds proc becomes.

Yes you will loose haste and all the other stuff, butsaving for the 264 bits will be a nice boost. I personally used 2pT10 till I got 2 more token to go straight to 4 x 264, before then the DPS boost was slightly less than doing 2 x 264, 2 x 251 cos of my off set gear being kinda crappy at the time.

Again just sim with simcraft, it's not too hard to find out how to do it, there is even a threat here on the forums for it. Play around and see how it goes. Good luck

[gherkin]

Thanks so much for that explanation. Given that, how much am I losing by making the two downgrades?

What's the affliction dps value of these summed up?
+158 Crit
-90 Spirit
-97 Haste
-53 Spell Power

---------- Post added 06-18-2010 at 06:12 PM ----------

So I just did a quick test on a training dummy using an identical rotation. I tried 4p10+belt swap against the gear that I listed above and my dps was about 500-600 LOWER with the 4p10. I guess I really need those tokens to use it. Unless I did something wrong.

Remember that this is a % damage increase. If you do 4k damage to a target dummy, it is a 160 dps increase. If you do 10k damage to Marrowgar, it is a 400 dps increase. Also, it's an RNG proc so the shorter the test, the less likely you are to see a consistent result. Since you are testing against a dummy, you will feel the impact of the stat loss more than you will feel the gain of the proc. Extend your dps test to 5 minutes in each gear configuration and don't look at recount once. You might see them break even, or close enough to each other as to make no difference, but you will see the difference later.

158 Crit = ~175 dps
90 Spirit = ~100 dps
97 Haste = ~175 dps
53 SP = ~100 dps
Net: -200 dps

Lets pretend you average 8k in a 25 man. This is a 320 dps increase. Swapping these pieces will result in a 120 dps increase over an average encounter. If you do more than 8k, its more than 120 dps.

[ammo187]

This is an excellent answer, and exactly what I was looking for. Thank you very much.

[ammo187]

Thanks so much for this reply. This is exactly what I was looking for.

[Dethh]

make crafted pants and ditch you mittens for t10

[TheBlackSun]

If you are afflic it is even more important, as corruption keeps crit and % dmg increases as long as you refresh it.