Stat priority for a disc priest?

[Auraye]

Leander: Tell your guild that shield spamming will be especially helpful on LDW, Rotface, and Putricide as well. You will shine on those fights as disc.

Lenerien: Are you using exact same gear for holy as disc? If not, gem the holy only pieces to best support that spec, and the same with disc. Also, try to get Solace of the Fallen to replace Talisman of Resurgence. Lastly, you might consider using an MP5 flask (mojo) and MP5 food when you go holy instead of flask of frost wyrm and feast. Due to the 25% healing buff in ICC, your spellpower is fine as holy.

[Lenerien]

I use different pants, belt and dont use resurgence, Pants are Zabra's Leggings of Conquest, belt cant remember but its from ICC 10 first boss and trink is Sliver of Pure Ice

[Auraye]

Be sure you're using your trinket every time it's off cooldown. That's why I <3 Vuhdo. Autofire trinkets and Arcane Torrent FTW. I'd be using the Sliver for disc too, instead of the talisman.

You know what you should do until you have 4 pcs T10 is use the Zabra's pants with the gloves for 2 pc T9 bonus for holy. +20% on POM. I totally wore the 2pc T9 on aura fights until I had 4pc sanctified T10. You might as well wear it anytime you're holy since you're wearing the pants anyway.

[Bigslick]

well i just did the math i have 7 +20 int gems if i change to + 12SP and + 10 int i gain 84SP lose 70 INT so maybe not so bad. Just that im dual spec holy and dont have 30k mana in that spec. but lots of SP almost 3500 self buufed no flask

You should prioritize your gear to the role you play most in raids. Looking at the balancing of your gear (ESD meta, < 400 haste) I'm assuming that's disc. If you want to make this set more viable for both roles, you'll want to get to at least about 600 or 650 haste (I forget where the sweet spot is for holy) and change the ESD meta to the IED meta.

That aside, you don't need 30k mana unbuffed in holy or 33.5k unbuffed in disc. In my normal gearing, I have almost the same (4 less) MP5 as you, and I have no mana issues in any regular or heroic content while operating with 2k less base mana aside from H LK 25. For that fight, I switch out regen trinkets and ask to be put in the healer group for mana tide (never get fed innervates).

At the level of content you're currently working on, you should not hesitate to start switching out some of your regen, starting with all of those int gems changing to pure SP. You still shouldn't have issues at that point, and should have a throughput trinket to replace the int badge trinket, keeping that around only for specific fights you know will challenge your mana longevity.

[Lenerien]

Great thank you every for the help.

[Checksmix]

You had mostly right but this is what i do


SP>CRIT>INT>HASTE(unless at cap for shield spam, which is what you do generally)>Spirit>MP5>stamina

and gem pure SP with a SP/haste gem and a sp/spirit gem for the meta (or two sp/haste if you use 2% more int)

---------- Post added 2010-06-25 at 06:25 PM ----------

And for those of you gemming int your bad. After 25k mana you should never run out of mana. The effective ness of timming your shields right to get multiple raptures is how you stay toped off (ie spamming shield before bonestorm FOR bonestorm and NOT shielding the tanks untell after a multiple of them have been poped)

And as holy you should focus on Sp>haste>spirit>int>crit>stam because spirit gives you sp and mp5 (which you never gear for)

---------- Post added 2010-06-25 at 06:28 PM ----------

If you want to make this set more viable for both roles, you'll want to get to at least about 600 or 650 haste (I forget where the sweet spot is for holy) and change the ESD meta to the IED meta.

That aside, you don't need 30k mana unbuffed in holy or 33.5k

The sweet spot is 1260 (or what ever the soft cap is). anything below that is bad. You need that haste you dont need sp or int or spirit or what ever.

as posted before you need only 25k+ as both specs to be fine.

[Argan]

SPELL POWER, end of discussion.

[vasyl83]

I can't tell if you agree or not with what I ask. With what you say here it mean that shield suck if lots of raid damage because only protect for very short time. Shield only last for a little while on fight like Sindragosa and Queen so then can't shield again until debuff is gone. Is shield so much better for 4 sec that it works on those type of fight? That seems not right to me because it only waste one or maybe two hot tick, but even then it only waste them if target is full on hp to start. Are you saying its better when first applied only? That seems wrong to me because if shield was replaced with another hot then neither hot would be wasted and player with hots would be healed for more overall. Is Divine Aegis even a lot? When I look it seem like it isn't that important, just tiny bit more shield.

I know fight like Lich is different because all damage done in one hit. Festergut sometime does that too when he exhale, but damage so low that its not that bad. What about other fight though? Many fight shield seems like crap because no one take damage anyway so lot of shield do nothing maybe one or two get use. Other fight have a lot of damage all the fight so having two hots on someone seem better because heal for lots more than absorbed. It sound like all you say is shield better because it happen before damage come, but lots of fight damage come all the time. Only Lich really have big one hit of damage to shield. Why people like smaller shield over bigger hot? Even if some of hot is wasted isn't hot bigger?

Am curious because guild I am in only wants me to shield on Lich and other fights they give me gold to be Holy and use hot. I like being Discipline because for 5 man it really easy so I wanted to know if maybe they wrong? Fight seem easier now, but mana is hard sometime, but Druid like to give me mana because I help more now. Should maybe I tell them this so I can use shield more?

You are forgetting divine aegis, with downtime on shielding (once everyone is shielded) just spam PoM, Penance and in my case I also spam PoH (sitting at 30% haste with BT makes them go off real fast, also having almost 50% crit raid buffed allows for a lot of DA to go out) so you end up shielding with other things than PWS.

To reiterate, your mileage may vary, in my guild we run with 2 disc priests 1 resto druid, 1 holy pallie (or 2), 1 holy priest and the rest are resto shammies. So with shammies pumping out huge HPS with chain heal, 2 disc shielding and proccing DA, holy priest spot healing what was left and pallie on tanks, our druid doesn't get much to heal with HoTs.

[_leander]

OK thanks. I still think I don't understand. Divine Aegis so small compared to difference between hot and shield. You talk it increase from Prayers too, but its still small and random. I figure my healing before and now is lots better on all fight. Lich same because still use shield all the time, but everything else so much better.

You beat Druid too? I try, but only win on Lich. You say you have 5 healer, but also have Shaman? How many healer do you use? We only use 5 on all fight with extra on dragon. Always is me and two Druid and Paladin and Shaman. We overheal lots still with only us. Maybe shield better with lots of healers then? That seem weird to use two shield Priest too because one already shield all of raid? Maybe it is because you are 9 in Hard, not 11 and 12? I know guild only make me change after healing too low for end bosses before Lich.

[vasyl83]

OK thanks. I still think I don't understand. Divine Aegis so small compared to difference between hot and shield. You talk it increase from Prayers too, but its still small and random. I figure my healing before and now is lots better on all fight. Lich same because still use shield all the time, but everything else so much better.

You beat Druid too? I try, but only win on Lich. You say you have 5 healer, but also have Shaman? How many healer do you use? We only use 5 on all fight with extra on dragon. Always is me and two Druid and Paladin and Shaman. We overheal lots still with only us. Maybe shield better with lots of healers then? That seem weird to use two shield Priest too because one already shield all of raid? Maybe it is because you are 9 in Hard, not 11 and 12? I know guild only make me change after healing too low for end bosses before Lich.

I run HMs, here for example is a BQL HM 25 kill: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/c...=11118&e=11423 as you can see top 2 are disc priests, 3rd is a pallie. As you can see we run 7 healers. Again, not everyone has a similar raid set up so your results may be completely different. (also notice that DA is up to 35% oh my total heals)

Also DA aren't small. I crit for around 7k with Penance tick, 7k x 30% = 2.1k (that's a substantial absorb in my book) with PoH I hit anywhere from 8.5 to 9.5k crits so that's up to 2.85k DA that procs on at least 2 people (around 45 to 50% crit, means it crits on anywhere from 2 to 3 people). DA are absorbed first, so if you spam non stop DA will be on a lot of people and will get used before PWS. In our raid setup I am responsible for 2 groups, so my rotation usually includes PWS the 10 people I am responsible for, cast Penance and PoM then spam PoH on those 2 groups while waiting on Weakened Soul to fade.

Now also consider that even if I cast a heal on someone and that heal is 100% overheal, if that heal critted, the resulting DA is 100% effective healing so DAs are never wasted, even if the spell that procced it, is.

I forgot to mention the PWS glyph, it also can crit (3k in my case) so that's up to 900 in absorbs, so already you cast a shield on someone that absorbs up to 8 or 9k and plus you get a mini shield off just for casting the big shield ... it's 12% more absorbtion.

[_leander]

I looked at link, but numbers make no sense. Divine Aegis only 30% of crit healing. How can you get 864,609 shield from only 440,948 crit heal? It look bugged. Show 32 but should be 5. Other Priest bug more. Show 34 but should only show 4. Is that log why you say Divine Aegis good? It still seem really small. Maybe broken log why you think it good. Maybe try with lower healer so not so many overheal. All your healer half waste or more because too many.

Thank you again for help. Sorry for bad English. It is why I don't post before. I thought maybe I change back, but waste time.

[vasyl83]

The log isn't bugged, those numbers are what we usually get, I can show you more examples. DA is always either top or second.
In nay case I am telling you what I have experienced. Believe it or not.

[Auraye]

(also notice that DA is up to 35% oh my total heals)

I'm pretty sure that's inaccurate. Just like Recount or anything else, absorbs are estimated and guessed who/what they belonged to. Blizz's combat text doesn't state which kind of shield or who the absorb belonged to.

Think about it. How could your DA do half of your absorbs with less than 5% uptime during the entire fight? How could it do 35% of your healing when it crits for only 30% of your heals? Remember, your top heal, PW:S cannot crit. Only the heal from it. Check it out:

Your actual heals were only 589,226, but somehow you had DA in the amount of 1,024,878. It's not even remotely possible, especially when DA is only 30% of the heal. Therefore, the max your DA value could have been is 176,767 if you crit on every single heal you cast, but that's not possible. You probably crit only about 30 to 40% of your heals, which means that your total DA absorbs were probably more in the neighborhood of 50k.

Take what's leftover from the DA reported heals (589k - 50k) and add that onto your PW:S absorbs, and now you've got more accurate numbers.

Sorry to burst your bubble, guys. Your lack of mathematics betrayyyys you!

[vasyl83]

what numbers are you looking at?
the log I pasted PWS are 1098251 (I am Semiraghe not Neraids)
Yes it seems to be screwed up but still is isn't negligible, and as I said I am not implying that it is awesome, I was just trying to make a point that with multiple fast healers and disc, hots become less useful. Since DA and absorbs get counted first, only then healing, disc will very often come on top. The logic being that of any ammount oh HP to heal, shield will not be wasted, while healing will overlap and be split, making absorbs come on top of effective healing.

---------- Post added 2010-06-25 at 10:34 PM ----------

Also if you look at WoL healing in general, all disc priests have 40%+ DA

[Auraye]

Again, WOL is reporting it wrong. A lot of PW:S is attributed as DA. Let's play with numbers. I think I jacked them up earlier, and I probably will again. I'm in a hurry, but let's have fun. Your healing done for that fight:

PW:S ............... 1,098,251 .............. (cannot crit for DA)
DA ................... 864,609 .............. (cannot crit for DA, because it's DA)
Glyph of PWS ......... 248,709 ...............(can crit)
POM .................. 194,023 .............. (can crit)
POH .................. 108,019 .............. (can crit)
Penance .............. 55,191 .............. (can crit)
Echoes of Light ...... 54,854 .............. (can crit)
Divine Hymn .......... 45,351 .............. (can crit)
Flash Heal ........... 19,001 .............. (can crit)
Binding Heal ......... 5,059 .............. (can crit)

Add up all of the heals that can crit, and you get 730,207, which includes the crit value. That's more than what is being reported for DA absorbs. Let's pretend that you had a 100% crit rate, then that means the max DA you could have had in that fight is 219,062 (30% of 730,207). Do you see how impossible that is? You can't crit for more than what you heal. DA's value is 30% of a crit heal. In all reality, your DA value was probably closer to 100k with around a 40% crit rate raid buffed.

Just like any other tool that is measuring heals (WMO, Recount, etc), they have to guess where the absorb is coming from. Blizzard's combat logs (look at one) don't say whose absorb it was or what exactly did the absorbing. These tools are guessing based on what the last absorb ability was that landed (or is it first? - I forget and I don't have time to look it up).

Hope this helps, and if anyone can show me that I'm fundamentally wrong, I'd love to know.

---------- Post added 2010-06-25 at 06:33 PM ----------

Now you got alot of advice on gear, I will recommend Svelte UI

I hate looking at a ugly UI while playing, so I downloaded this and fitted some extra addons in like Buttonfacade, Pallapower, WIM and recount. After some config's I ended up with, ini, smooth and clean UI.

http://i45.tinypic.com/vfcvg9.png

Wow, bro. Are you the creator or friends with the person that made Svelte UI? That plug was kind of random. I just looked at your UI, and I must say that I'm not a fan of how you sort of bastardized Svelte UI. You lose a lot of visibility at the bottom with that super dark bar with the frilly thing all the way across. It doesn't even look like Svelte.

Personally, I made my own using Kgpanels, and probably another 10 more addons. Maybe I'll post it in the UI FORUM sometime. lol

[harky]

Actual crit healing in that log is ~423. Actual DA size ~127k. For some reason this thread was clicked as 'follow' so I just got 24 spam emails when I got home from work. Nice to know even when things get stickied... no one reads them.

Either way, if you post a log seven healing and Discipline isn't #1 they suck. DA always shows up for roughly your total absorbs * your crit rate +/- 5%. If 90% of your healing is absorbs and you crit 40% you'd expect 31-41% to show up as DA. The actual percentage is almost always ~5% when raid healing.

And now to unfollow this crap so I'm not tempted to peruse forums.