Need feedback on business model..

[halmotors]

I just recently maxed out my alchemy and herbalism on my warlock alt, and very quickly turned him into elixir-spec. Since then, I've been advertising my business in the trade channel, hoping to draw in some customers. My macro looks like this:

[Elixir Master] LFW! Need flasks made? All work done ~absolutely free~, I keep any procs that might happen. *insert witty remark here*

9 times out of 10, my posting in Trade is immediately followed by someone posting 'Alchemy/Elixir Master LFW, free with your mats and you get all procs' or something similar to that. Either that, or I'm openly ridiculed by people for keeping procs in lieu of a crafting fee, or called a thief and accused of trying to scam people.

My view on it is this: I don't charge to make things. If things don't proc, I don't make a dime. Procs are how I make my money. They still get the same amount of flasks they gave me mats for, and they get it done for free. I'm up front and honest about the terms of the transaction up front. And yet I still get haters constantly when I advertise.

Am I doing it wrong? Am I being unreasonable for running my alchemy business that way? I think it's a perfectly fair way to conduct business, to be honest, and I'm not trying to scam anyone. If anything, there's a greater chance for me to lose out by using it.

[feigning]

Personally, I wouldn't ask you to make me anything. If I farmed/purchased my mats, and specifically looked for an Elixir Master, I probably did so with the hope of getting procs. Of course, I also pay quite handsomely, as when I need elixirs made I generally have hundreds of mats to do so.

I guess it would depend on the server, but for my Blacksmithing and Jewelcrafting I simply advertise the profession, not asking for any fees or what not, and I normally get quite nice tips. Having been one of the only players on my server with all of the ToC patterns, people were tipping me 100g+ even in 3.3. Obviously it is different with the procs, but I feel the principle is still there.

In my opinion, you should just advertise your alchemy and hope for tips. Best advice I can give.

[halmotors]

I've done that with other professions in the past, and to me that's an extremely hit or miss way of making money. I'm not really doing it to be kind, I want to make gold, and I've found (at least on my server, The Scryers) that people are seemingly incapable of tipping.

[feigning]

I see. I was on a very low population server, so that also was a factor when looking for/finding players for us.

Are you currently getting any business? I was always very nice, supplying mats for players when the could not obtain them all, taking IOU's, meeting them halfway for crafts, etc. I found this made people recommend me, add me to friends lists, and seeking me out later on for more crafts.

Now, in regards to your business plan, the part where you state you keep all procs does sound slightly rude. I'd say it'd be easier not to mention it at all, and give the person, say, 1/10 of the total procs, saying that's all there was. You wouldn't even need to lie unless they asked :P.

[halmotors]

I have gotten some work, yes. And there have been people in Trade supporting me and defending how I run my business.

Also, people can see what I craft when we're partied together, and I really hate lying to people about what's procced and what hasn't. I'd much rather be up front and honest with them about what I'm doing than have it be under question.

[feigning]

Hrm.

Well...

I don't know. :S

I made most of my gold by buying and selling primordial saronite at low prices. Professions for me were never a big money grabber. The only other suggestion I could give is to change your business plan somehow. Maybe state that you will keep 1/2 of all procs or that procs cost a little bit of extra gold? Yeah, I like that one. Say, depending on the amount of procs you get, you will require a small amount of gold or the right to keep those procs. Be upfront about it and don't make the amount of gold something stupidly outrageous and I think you could do decently well.

[pomop]

I can't give you an answer to your problem, but can give you my opinion and how I treat things.

On the AH (Not your case, but just to see my personality) If there is an item for 24g 99s and another for 25g, I but the one for 25g. The 25g was the original one and the 24 99 was the jackass that wanted to undercut him with losing the least amount of money. If you undercut, at least do it ~20s.

But on topic, I don't really use people that advertise with a cost to make stuff. To me, that just feels like a shop. I don't want to go to a shop, I want to go to another person. So I will use the random guy who says "LFW", and tip him roughly the same amount that a "shop" required me to pay. The difference to me is, at a required payment, it is as said, a shop. You have to pay that money in order to receive the service. However at a person, you are being kind, generous and helpful by giving them money when they didn't even ask.

Also yes, keeping the flasks are rude. Any way you say it, it is rude. People seek Elixir masters for the very reason that they hope to get extra elixirs. That's like you giving me 60 bucks to go buy Gears of war 3 and I bought it in a combo pack with Final Fantasy 13. Then later on I give you GoW and keep FFXIII for myself.


Edit - Although you do say it upfront, it will always get you bad publicity for wanting to keep the procs. Also, I don't purchase from spam spammers. (IE people posting their crafting right after you post yours. It's an incredibly douchey move. :S)

[Haruk]

You should probably give an option - either you keep the procs or you charge a fee. I get the feeling keeping the procs could be very profitable, and you might have to set your fee at 100G or more to make it the equivalent of keeping procs.

That sounds like a high fee, but I don't advertise in trade so I'm not sure of the going rate.

[Stannislaus]

You shouldn't keep the procs. You should charge a flat fee (barring exceptional circumstances like milling a shit ton of herbs, just for example) and give them the procs. Chances are 15 g each time is better than the 25-40g you'd make from the proc once every ten times (at least thats about the rate ive seen on my elixir master). On top of that people don't care about tipping 10-15g thats expected. You'd probably get repeat customers.

If you tried explaining your business model to a prospective customer they'd see "If things don't proc, I don't make a dime" and think "Well I don't give a shit whether or not you make money, I want my flasks." What I do on my guy is buy all the empty flasks and just ask for the herbs and a small tip.

[roguepaladin13]

I see. I was on a very low population server, so that also was a factor when looking for/finding players for us.

I was always very nice, supplying mats for players when the could not obtain them all, taking IOU's, meeting them halfway for crafts, etc. I found this made people recommend me, add me to friends lists, and seeking me out later on for more crafts.

.

There is a few people in my guild that do this. The monopolize the flask market because of this. I also do the ious with jewelcrafting. People pay me back and I always get their business. Just yesterday some guy on my friends list had me cut him 27 fractured cardinal rubys and payed me 700 gold for it.

[halmotors]

Well, I changed the model today and tried it out. Work is done free of charge (as before), but I keep half the procs if they occur. The customer has the option of buying those procs for half of the current market price, which comes to 13-15g on my server. I still get a lot of opposition to it, but I did get a few more bites. Made two stacks of Frostwyrm stacks for a guy, had 4 extra when it was done. He bought my two, and gave me 50g for them. I made out pretty well.

I'm not trying to scam people here. I'm just looking for a more reliable way of making money with the profession than relying on the good will of my customers, who are a bunch of tightasses.