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  1. #1

    No aggro for bears?

    Ok, I am currently leveling a all tanks in game (just hit 80 on my warrior) and I can tell you from having leveled every other tank in the game, bears are by far the WORSE. All my tanks get to 80 and have no issue tanking, except ofcourse if the DPS really outgears me is just going crazy. Bear need insane amount of itemization to even begin to compare with any of the other tanks in WOTLK. Despite Blizzard saying they want all tanks to be able to do their jobs, Bears are sucking right now. Especially when it comes to AE tanking omfg! And AE tanking is ALL dungeons, some dps don't even know what CCs mean. I mean the other day a mage tlod me to wait while he puts sheep on his tool bar, and a shaman didn't know they had CC. I have posted questions, I have read forums, I have tested in game, bears are simply terrible compared to the other tanks. I think I might have found out why, check this out:

    Death Knights:
    Frost Presence
    1 Frost
    Instant 1 sec cooldown
    The death knight takes on the presence of frost, increasing Stamina by 8%, armor contribution from cloth, leather, mail and plate items by 60%, and reducing damage taken by 8%. Increases threat generated. Only one Presence may be active at a time.

    Warrior:
    Defensive Stance
    Instant 1 sec cooldown
    A defensive combat stance. Decreases damage taken by 10% and damage caused by 5%. Increases threat generated.

    Paladin:
    Righteous Fury
    Instant
    Increases the threat generated by your Holy spells by 80%. Lasts until cancelled.

    Now Druids:

    Dire Bear Form Shapeshift
    35% of base mana
    Instant cast
    Shapeshift into dire bear form, increasing melee attack power by 120, armor contribution from cloth and leather items by 370%, and Stamina by 25%. Also protects the caster from Polymorph effects and allows the use of various bear abilities.

    The act of shapeshifting frees the caster of Polymorph and Movement Impairing effects.

    Notice anything missing from the bear tanks? Anyone ever wonder why bears do not deserve to get a +threat in their form? I am not QQing or anything, I am just wondering... Anyone care to explain that to me please?
    In life pain is mandatory; Suffering however, is optional...
    Source: Naruto

  2. #2
    Just because it isn't mentioned doesn't mean that there isn't a +threat modifier for bears. Assuming the correct spec, you should have no problems holding aggro over anyone close to your gear level. However, the number of players that fail to take a few key talents (I've seen a lot of variation, from arguing that more swipe damage is useless to not taking Naturalist) is amazing to me. If you take a decent spec, though, most of your problems are gone. AoE is going to be a little tougher since all you have is Maul and Swipe, but you get used to it after a bit.

  3. #3
    Scarab Lord Robinhoodexe's Avatar
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    lol @ your list tbh....

    from wowwiki:

    DRUID

    Bear Form 2.0735
    Feral Instinct (3pt Talent) No longer affects Bear Form threat.
    Cat Form 0.71
    Imp. Tranquility (2pt Talent) 0.5/zero for Tranquility
    Subtlety (3pt Talent) .90/.80/.70 (Restoration spells)
    Nature's Reach (2pt Talent) .85/.70 (Balance spells)
    Cower -3474 (rank 6)
    Demoralizing Roar +61 - divided amongst targets
    Faerie Fire +638
    Growl Sets threat equal to NPC's primary target
    Lacerate +515 innate; 0.5x threat on initial and periodic damag
    Mangle (Bear) Causes normal threat (1x damage done)
    Maul +422 (rank 10)
    Swipe (Bear) Base threat is 1.5x damage
    PALADIN

    Righteous Fury 2.534 (all Holy-school abilities)
    1.43 (all non-Holy actions)

    Imp. Righteous Fury (3pt Talent) No longer affects Righteous Fury threat.
    Blessing of Salvation Removed from game.
    Passive Reduction (Healing) 0.5 (all healing done)
    (on top of baseline healing modifier)
    Fanaticism (3pt Talent) .90/.80/.70 (all actions)
    (disabled when Righteous Fury is active)
    Righteous Defense Sets threat equal to friendly target being attacked
    Affects up to three NPC's attacking the friendly target
    Hand of Reckoning Sets threat equal to highest threat among all players.
    Divine Intervention Removed from threat lists of all enemies
    Hand of Salvation Reduces target's threat by 2% every 1 second for 10s
    WARRIOR

    Defensive Stance 2.0735
    Defiance (3pt Talent) Removed from game.
    Tactical Mastery (3pt Talent) 1.21/1.42/1.63 (Bloodthirst and Mortal Strike)
    (only if used in Defensive Stance)
    Battle Stance
    Berserker Stance 0.8
    Imp. Berserker Stance (5pt Talent) extra .98/.96/.94/.92/.90 in Berserker Stance
    Vigilance (talent) target: extra 0.9
    caster: gains remaining 0.1 as own threat
    Battle Shout +78 (rank 9) - divided amongst targets
    Cleave +225 (rank 8) - divided amongst targets
    Commanding Shout +80 - divided amongst targets
    Demoralizing Shout +63 (rank 8) - divided amongst targets
    Devastate +5.0% attack power
    No longer applies Sunder Armor threat.
    Disarm +104
    Hamstring +181 (rank 4)
    Heroic Strike +259 (rank 13)
    Heroic Throw threat = 1.5 * damage caused
    Revenge +121 (rank 9)
    Improved Revenge +25
    Shield Bash +36
    Improved Shield Bash +??
    Shield Slam +770 (rank 8)
    Improved Spell Reflection Reflected damage causes threat for reflecting ally.
    Sunder Armor +(345 + 5.0% attack power) (rank 7)
    Taunt Sets threat equal to NPC's primary target
    Thunder Clap threat = 1.85 * damage caused
    DEATH KNIGHT

    Frost Presence 2.0735
    Blood Presence
    Unholy Presence 0.8
    Subversion (3pt talent) extra .92/.84/.75
    (while in Blood or Unholy Presence)
    Rune Strike x1.75 damage
    Death and Decay x1.9 damage
    Icy Touch x7 damage
    sorry for long post
    Congratulations on graduating to expert level trolling, I would stick around but I'm busy getting gay married in 13 states and performing roadside abortions while passing bills that take away people's guns while i sip superior european wine and cheese i bought with european style socialist money, arrivaderci!

  4. #4
    while yes, you're going to have problems vs geared people when you're a new 80, which is a problem for all new tanks, druids aren't any worse off than any other tank, and even have it better than some. Assuming you have maul glyphed and macro'd to your swipe, in your aoe, you're hitting everything in a frontal cone, plus mauling 2 of those targets.

    On a warrior: you need to tab cleave while watching omen to shield slam the mob who is closest to losing aggro. Yes, you have shortish CD ae abilities (TC, Shockwave), but I know from experience, it's all to easy to lose that one mob your cleave doesn't hit if you aren't tabbing around. Also, both cleave and HS are on next swing timers, so you can't spam both like a druid.

    Paladins: Don't have demo roar/shout (they can take vindication in their build, but I find it cumbersome). Yes you can face roll through most of everything, welcome to the bandwagon class.

    DK's: Less effective on chain pulling (I.E. Tunnel in PoS) IMO as their AE is set in a stationary location with a longish CD. Granted you could FF and Pest as you go assuming you have disease glyphed. Also, their Icy Touch is elemental damage, so can be resisted by some mobs (tanking Ahune on a DK is a bitch)


    Granted, there are some things you need to understand about a druid to not have aggro problems, but is competitive with all tanks around your gear level for Aggro gen, and ahead of all of them (except Paladins, who have Ardent Defender, which is basically an auto last stand and SS) on survivability.

  5. #5
    maybe you just suck when you play drood?

  6. #6
    Bear threat has always felt very dependent on weapon, much more so than my warrior. Just an observation. (With equivalent gear, I think they both tank with a similar effectiveness.)

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Sligboy View Post
    maybe you just suck when you play drood?
    this


  8. #8
    You're an idiot.
    AP effects the agro on Swipe etc.
    You get extra AP in Bear Form.
    1+1 =
    Quote Originally Posted by Nesingwary-Eliada View Post
    Basically, my last guild leader was a wheel-chair bound Mexican who wanted to be Black, posted pictures of his dad claiming it was him, had the hots for his sister, created a fantasy in which his sister was his wife and that they had twin daughters together, and thought he was an FBI agent.

  9. #9
    Last night ICC25 pug - me DK dw frost tank, and one druid tank and one pally tank
    big gear difference - they are on 5800gs, me on 5300 (just for clear picture on gear difference, not that i belive in gs)
    I had to just auttoatack on marrowgar for 40% of fight, didnt want to surpass druids tps who was MT, i mean dk tps is really huge...i also have druid tank and i do it fine, but dks are just way ahead other tank in tps

  10. #10
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    icy touch has a 7x threat multiplier

  11. #11
    Ferals are probably the best end game tank. With crazy amounts of hp, and most of their threat coming directly from their dps rather than a lot of threat modifiers, they scale the best with the ICC buff. That said, there is always going to be a huge difference in a good feral and a bad feral.

  12. #12
    Druids are using high damage for threat? what?? really???

  13. #13
    OP = troll who doesn't know how to play a feral.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vertue View Post
    I have posted questions, I have read forums, I have tested in game, bears are simply terrible compared to the other tanks.
    If you actually did this then you wouldnt be posting this silly thread. That or you have no idea what you're doing.

    All the tanks are pretty equal, so long as the person playing the toon knows what they're doing. I suggest learning how to play the class before you start making bold claims like you are.

  15. #15
    In the original posters defense, I think he is coming at it from the viewpoint of a fresh-80 druid without good gear... and I think he has a reasonably valid observation about low threat from under-geared bears (just not the correct reasons.)

    I personally find that a good weapon is critical for holding aggro with a druid. (A warrior can get away with a much lower i-level weapon.)

  16. #16
    My experience with tanks (have all, though DK isnt max level) is that their tools are all somewhat similar, except for druids. Druids tools are quite different, and thus a bigger change to learn than the others. Paladins have a simple rotation, DK's rune system also follows a rotation of sorts, and warriors have quite specific tools for each job, and its pretty obvious. Druids have all the tools they need, but learning when to use them I found to be much harder, as well as using them effectively.

    I also found, as has been said, that low gearing made a huge difference, both in threat and survivability. Once I got a few heroics done and some gear, things eased up incredibly, and I felt a lot more on par with other tanks. OP is definitely talking from frustration I would say.

  17. #17
    Druid threat is fine really without having awesome gear. I remember gearing my bear and the biggest mistake I remember making was not to let lacerate actually tick. Bear snap agro I think can be low, even with a mangle and maul bound together - but once you are into the fight (beyond the first 10 secs), that mob is stuck to me.

  18. #18
    Wait, did someone just learning how to bear tank is a bigger challenge than the other three classes? LOL, wat?

  19. #19
    Step 1: Make this macro

    #show Swipe (Bear)
    /cast Maul
    /cast Swipe (Bear)

    Step 2: Bind this macro to your L and O buttons

    Step 3: Run into any heroic and LOL your way to victory

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by saxmfone1 View Post
    Step 1: Make this macro

    #show Swipe (Bear)
    /cast Maul
    /cast Swipe (Bear)

    Step 2: Bind this macro to your L and O buttons

    Step 3: Run into any heroic and LOL your way to victory
    this made me a happy panda

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