An Open Letter

[Flaks]

Tarien, you're letting these people get to you.

Most people on the mmo-champion forums are trolls, flamers (lol) and the like and argue only for the sake of argument.

Your points are exceptionally valid despite them being bias. Personally, I agree with everything you typed. Nonetheless, people on these boards honestly need to learn a lesson in civility and manners before they try to 'discuss' something in a public form. This crap about "WELL INTERNET ANONYMITY MEANS EVERYONE DOES IT SO WHY SHOULDN"T I" needs to be oozed out of our thick skulls.

/end rant. I've been ranting a lot on these forums lately... the feeling seems to be contagious.

[Lebored]

For a child tying their shoes for the first time, sure, it's an achievement. As adults we expect challenges to be of much greater complexity and difficulty, even in some forms of our entertainment. Otherwise they just aren't entertaining. Where's the fun in a football game where the opposing team can't move, a quiz you know all the answers too, or an fps where you can't die. Sure it's briefly fun to be winning all the time, but without challenge it quickly becomes meaningless.

I'm afraid your double standards have me confused. You feel that the game in it's current state of everyone-can-clear-everything is okay and that I am wrong to think Blizzard should make raiding more challenging, and yet you think that you have high standards than me... no I can't see the logic there at all.

---------- Post added 2010-06-29 at 01:11 AM ----------



Oh goodie more logic. Lets assume you haven't read a thing I wrote eh, because you clearly haven't.

Logically everyone wants everything with no effort, logically we want to play for free, so logically Blizzard should give them it. How is that logic working for you? Logically I pay the same subscription you do, so logically if I log in once a month I can collect all the xp/gold/loot/items that you have, log out again. Right?

Your logic is faulty. Blizzard wants to keep as many people as it can happy, and I think they know that they erred too far on the casual side this expansion. This why there will be more algalon type bosses, less easy purples and so on.

Logic actually dictates that if there isn't sufficeint challenge people will get bored and leave. In the same train of thought, we know that without monthly subs there is no game, and that players who play more and/or play smarter deserve more. Otherwise I would just log in once a month, dance on IF bridge to show off my shinies and log out to spend my monthly sub on some beers.

See thats when your argument fails when you have to resort to exaggerations and lies
The game isnt in a state of everyone can clear everything, and nobody is requesting it be so
Its understandable why you dont see logic, you appear to not even know what it is

I understand that your WoW accomplishments are all you have and that you must hold onto them for dear life but most WoW players play it for fun not for accomplishments

[Tarien]

Tarien, you're letting these people get to you.

Most people on the mmo-champion forums are trolls, flamers (lol) and the like and argue only for the sake of argument.

Your points are exceptionally valid despite them being bias. Personally, I agree with everything you typed. Nonetheless, people on these boards honestly need to learn a lesson in civility and manners before they try to 'discuss' something in a public form. This crap about "WELL INTERNET ANONYMITY MEANS EVERYONE DOES IT SO WHY SHOULDN"T I" needs to be oozed out of our thick skulls.

/end rant. I've been ranting a lot on these forums lately... the feeling seems to be contagious.

I agree with you except on the first point (and the bit about bias?). I enjoy a good debate, my first degree was Law so I come with +100% fire resistant skin, the more they dissent the more I enjoy the challenge of pointing out the flaws in their arguments :P

---------- Post added 2010-06-29 at 01:30 AM ----------

I understand that your WoW accomplishments are all you have and that you must hold onto them for dear life but most WoW players play it for fun not for accomplishments

I understand that you can't make an argument without resorting to personally insulting me and that you must keep doing this for dear life as it makes you feel better about yourself. It's okay, I understand

Accomplishments = fun btw.

[Lebored]

/yawn

Like I said you have no argument you simply complain about a situation that doesn't exist and talk down to anyone who doesn't agree with you
The best part is no matter how much you feel you're "winning" the argument by doing so, at the end of the day Blizzard is going against your point of view. They want people who put in less effort to still see the game.

[Tarien]

/yawn

Like I said you have no argument you simply complain about a situation that doesn't exist and talk down to anyone who doesn't agree with you
The best part is no matter how much you feel you're "winning" the argument by doing so, at the end of the day Blizzard is going against your point of view. They want people who put in less effort to still see the game.

The 'situation' doesn't exist, but then you state that 'they want people who put in less effort to see the game'. Is that not the 'situation' I am claiming is the current state of affairs and making a case for changing? Also, if Blizzard are going against my point of view, why are they making epics less common and introducing more hardmode only fights?

You really know how to make yourself look stupid.

[Lebored]

"everyone-can-clear-everything" isn't that same as "people who put in less effort to see the game"

I know its complicated but try and keep up

[Tarien]

"everyone-can-clear-everything" isn't that same as "people who put in less effort to see the game"

I know its complicated but try and keep up

Is this the best you could do? They are the same.

By making raids easier you allow people who put less effort in to see everything. 'Everyone' was a bit a bit of a generalisation that most intelligent people would understand meant 'the majority of those interested in raiding' and not 'everyone single person who plays including tiny Timmy who plays on his dads account with a L27 rogue'.

I know it's complicated using your brain, but do try to keep up old chap

I'm pretty much done with you now to be honest as you've not had one intelligent thing to say. Post away, you won't get a response.

[Combine]

There is a lot of QQ'ing from the OP going on here. Ultimately nothing Blizzard does will ever satisfy the WoW community no matter what they do so.... =/

[Tarien]

There is a lot of QQ'ing from the OP going on here. Ultimately nothing Blizzard does will ever satisfy the WoW community no matter what they do so.... =/

I wouldn't say QQing, not quite at the stage where the number of retards able to access ICC is keeping me awake at night. I would say vigorously defending my position

And are you saying we should just STFU and let Blizz do whatever they want? Player opinions do still affect Blizz. Not much, but it does happen.

[Combine]

I wouldn't say QQing, not quite at the stage where the number of retards able to access ICC is keeping me awake at night. I would say vigorously defending my position

And are you saying we should just STFU and let Blizz do whatever they want? Player opinions do still affect Blizz. Not much, but it does happen.

I'm saying that no matter what Blizzard does to please the WoW community everybody will still bitch that it isn't good enough even if they do exactly what players want they will still bitch.

[Creotor]

I'm offering my view on most of the issues you pointed out:

1. Naxx is bad, hope Hyjal won't suck because it will essentially be recycled content as well.

Blizz has admitted a long time ago that 3.0 Naxx sucked. As for Hyjal.... how much of it have you seen in CoT? Some poorly designed terrain, just enough for 25 people to not have to move through it in a single file. It was an instance.
Cata's Hyjal will be a huge world zone, not an instance. It's not at all correct to compare Naxx to Hyjal here...

2. Sartharion + ToC.

It's true, there wasn't much lore behind Sartharion, but do you really not know why we killed him? He was a bad dude. We kill bad dudes.
ToC wasn't exactly great, but I don't hate it like many people do.

3. Arthas's effect on the world.

The implementation of the storyline was indeed somewhat botched, even though the general plot (I didn't kill u cuz I wanted to make you my super agents, and dis was my plan all along, kek) was acceptable and logical. I do agree with your suggested improvements for Cata.

4. There should be more guilds and less pugs.

This is a very personal opinion of yours. Yea, it's MMO, it's supposed to be social, but I'm quite confident that far from everyone in pugs is some crazed neurotic with low self-esteem. There...

At this point, I realized I don't want to waste my time on meaningless tries of changing someone's mind.

3.

[Combine]

There is no pleasing the WoW community.

[Tarien]

I'm saying that no matter what Blizzard does to please the WoW community everybody will still bitch that it isn't good enough even if they do exactly what players want they will still bitch.

Very true my friend, very true, but it's like voting, if I don't say something what can I expect to change? I knew when I posted this that there would be all sorts of people applauding and denouncing me, and that it would probably devolve into a flamefest. Still, I wanted to throw it out there.

[Combine]

Very true my friend, very true, but it's like voting, if I don't say something what can I expect to change? I knew when I posted this that there would be all sorts of people applauding and denouncing me, and that it would probably devolve into a flamefest. Still, I wanted to throw it out there.

At least we can agree on that.

[Lebored]

Is this the best you could do? They are the same.

By making raids easier you allow people who put less effort in to see everything. 'Everyone' was a bit a bit of a generalisation that most intelligent people would understand meant 'the majority of those interested in raiding' and not 'everyone single person who plays including tiny Timmy who plays on his dads account with a L27 rogue'.

I know it's complicated using your brain, but do try to keep up old chap

I'm pretty much done with you now to be honest as you've not had one intelligent thing to say. Post away, you won't get a response.

Dont worry theres enough slobbering morons on these boards to take your place
If you believe those two to be the same than that is your lack of understanding no one elses

Again cold hard facts dont support your claims and infact prove the exact opposite but I wouldnt expect you to let the truth get in the way of you tantruming over how Blizzard ruined your precious feeling of accomplishment in a video game.

[Heltoray]

99% agree @ op

[Noomz]

You are aware that it is very much too late to suggest anything regarding Cataclysm?

The only thing you can do now, with the beta close at hand, is to suggest ways to make the already excisting content work better. Aka, beta testing.
The design is already there, the layout is already there, most of the rough work is already done.

It's nice to see someone formulate themselves so good, but it's all quite a wasted effort I'm afraid.
You are also just another person to suffer from nostalgia. This is an MMO and it changes, you really have to go along with it.

And luls at people nitpicking and being wise about the storyline and lore.
Everything's just crap to some people, isn't it?

[DownButStillOut]

What ive heard Blizzard say in Posts and such is that everything is a experiement in the patches to see how players react to the changes and that they do this to create a better MMO that appeals to the majority of the players...And thats the reason why Cataclysm is going to be Casualclysm, there is more casual players than Hardcores. (Last sentence offtopic but just proved point.)

Belive emewhen i say this even though it may be hard to swallow, Cataclysm will be better than Wotlk, BC, or Vanilla.

[MildCore]

I never played TBC. But I was back in Molten Core, and Blackwing Lair. Then AQ was released with a once in a lifetime opportunity to unlock and get a special mount and stuffs and I thought it was cool, but sad that I was never able to participate in it. Fail guilds were common, struggling on Molten Core while other guilds were already progressing into Naxx. All the stuff that was available to do pre-patch. (Like the Necropolis things overtop of the zones spawning ghosts, or the junk for AQ) was pretty neat and gave people something to grind for I guess, but wasn't fun that's for sure. And made making alts and even bigger pain in the ass.

Overall, 40m was a bad choice, and now they're basically bringing it down to 10m which personally, I think is a great idea. Now you can get a small group of friends or talented people and take on everything yourselves. Epic doesn't have to mean entire armies of "heroes" taking on 1 boss, actually I find that anti-epic, seems kinda RTS'ish.

So anyways, Attunements are good I think, I like your ideas of getting rid of them with each patch. I kind of miss them myself. Better voice acting is a must, coupled with better storytelling. More cutscenes could be better, it's a lot more interesting to watch the story than to read it in a quest log. Making content harder I think is a great idea. A lot of stuff is really easy right now and yet on 25m you could have half the raid fail and still make it past the first boss. Then what, too difficult on the 2nd boss, or the 5th boss.. whatever, the raid falls apart. Make it hard from the start and marginally harder throughout the instance. I don't like seeing pugs make raids, it really is said and I wish they couldn't do it. Incidentally, I only pug because finding a guild is even more inconvenient. (So many fail guilds too). With the elitists being at the top.

[drockrock]

everything is an experiment

Fixed for spelling but this is what people need to wrap their heads around. I may speak for a very large majority of players that don't feel the need to post on forums like these, but preparing 8-10 hours a week for Vanilla raiding was not fun. Spending 6+ hours in one zone banging our heads against a wall (pre-3.0 SWP, pre-nerf Kael'Thas, etc) in TBC was not fun. I quit raiding in WLK because I've grown up and don't have that kind of time to dedicate to listening to some angry guy on vent tell us how much we've screwed up. I'm glad that Blizzard has experimented and gone in new directions with the way their raids are structured. Not every idea has been a homerun, but every raid has been in some aspects better than the last.

Even ToC was good for how little time it took to complete.

Also like Labored, I don't play WoW to gain any kind of accomplishment. Some activities are more fun than others, but I play the game to have fun. Blizz looks like they're well on their way to satisfying me, speaking as a majority group player, in the next expansion.