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  1. #241
    Wow... this game is going to feel like Jump Start: First Grade by the time Cata launches.

  2. #242
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazuun View Post
    31 point trees. And we will be force do spend all 31 talent points to be able to put them in another one. So for me it seems that now there will be no "builds" because you will have to complete one tree in 100%. So where are the differences between PvP and PvE builds? In my equipment?
    You know very little about the game in general if you honestly think you have to fill in all talents to get to the 31 point talent. That has never been the case. There have always been choices below that 31 point talent and there will continue to be.

  3. #243
    Bloodsail Admiral roboscorcher's Avatar
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    I'm okay with this!

  4. #244
    This.. is.. AWESOME

  5. #245
    I don't understand the need to lockout the other trees, why force us down a single tree until 31pts. I just don't see a need to do that, seems stupid.

  6. #246
    Quote Originally Posted by Dch48 View Post
    Does this mean that there will be no tanks or healers until level 70? Who is going to level a Warrior as Prot? I see big problems coming because of this change.
    Probably everyone that wants to have an instance dungeon queue come up instantly instead of waiting for 30 minutes to run one dungeon. Lots of people level as tanks and healers now because doing so in the random dungeon system is faster than questing. Also, healer and tank specs normally have a much easier time questing with less down time and easier completion of group quests.

  7. #247
    Fluffy Kitten Zinnin's Avatar
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    Really liking this change, if it goes how I am expecting. Which is that you'll be making choices between utility, fun talents. Some may increase you DPS, or w\e, but a lot are survivability things, or utility.

    So as a Destro lock I could decide, do I want Shadowfury to stun those adds, or should I pick up Nether Protection to make me easier to heal on that one fight.
    Or as Demonology do I want Improved hearthstones for the raid or do I want Demonic Resilience to help stay alive.

    Things like that, sure some talents will always be better...But you can't really say that your going to use shadowfury in a DPS rotation, and its a DPS loss not to get it.

  8. #248
    Quote Originally Posted by Alsmir View Post
    First of all, there seem to be many ppl saying that it will make leveling more fun and enjoyable, but I couldn't care less. I'd rather have one class that I'm playing for a long time I know that class and its mechanics well and I can actually play it both in pvp and pve at decent level. I don't want to reroll every patch, like many ppl do.

    Secondly I liked having a choice when specing my character. I've spent thousands of gold on respecs and tested carefully every single talent my character has just to be able to use them efficiently. I hate the idea of dumbing down WoW just to please some new customers.
    If this one class that you've played for so long happens to be an 80, this change should not even concern you that much, unless it's a class which you'd normally wouldn't gun for the 51 point talent and go for something else. IF that's the case, you're going to see some changes there.

    You people need to understand WHY locking the trees until you've spent 31 points in the one you have chosen. They are doing away with so many passive talents, and keeping the important ones around, this applies to the other tree as well!

    If you keep all of them unlocked, and you get to a certain level where you get a spell from one tree and one from the other, it could be a potential gamebreaker.

    I want to see this idea go through. I can only see the "pigeon holing" that is necessary to be the only problem, unlike path of the titans, which had a vague system or guild leveling, which could break a guild just because someone is not agreeing with the talent points spent (It can happen).
    Quote Originally Posted by Respen
    I was very disappointed in the screenshots. I usually base my entire gaming experience around ground textures and so far it seems like Cata will be totally unplayable.

  9. #249
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymeria View Post
    But when will they release cataclysm? 2012? Seems there's still much work to be done.
    With a change like this, they would have to implement the new trees for all classes at the same time. Judging by the fact that Blizzard has been trying to keep a lid on major changes while they are being developed, and the fact that the blue post mentions the next beta patch, I fully expect to see at least a first pass of the new talent trees for EVERY class perhaps as early as this week.

    This also explains why we haven't gotten any new info on revamped talents since that first batch was released a while ago. They must have decided that it just wasn't working how they wanted with the first set, so they set off in a new direction and have just gotten it to the point where the new system is ready for the beta.

  10. #250
    Quote Originally Posted by tokn View Post
    I don't understand the need to lockout the other trees, why force us down a single tree until 31pts. I just don't see a need to do that, seems stupid.
    Because you'll get class defining abilities you wouldn't otherwise get until late?

    If you 'picked' one tree, but then leveled up the rest of your points in a different one, you'd be getting major talents from tree 1, and then more abilities from tree 2.


    Think about it

  11. #251
    Quote Originally Posted by Daez View Post
    You know very little about the game in general if you honestly think you have to fill in all talents to get to the 31 point talent. That has never been the case. There have always been choices below that 31 point talent and there will continue to be.
    I think you missed his point. He's arguing why lockout the other trees until 31pts are spent in one tree, not that you needed to put points in every talent.

  12. #252
    I couldn't care less.

    Each patch puts the game in a blender talent and ability wise - some times minor - some times major. An expansion would fall into a major scramble.

    Then you have...

    1. The hard core gonzo number crunchers (God bless them) will dig in and figure it out and argue with each other until something is establised.

    2. Folks like me will find out what is what after that and adapt to the new information and cookie cutter specs and rotations.

    3. Players will flock to the trendy class or whine about how it's OP.

    4. Blizzard will announce that the upcoming patch is going to change it all up again.

    Repeat.

  13. #253
    haha good luck balancing these for 85 levels blizzard!

  14. #254
    When I first read it, I was confused. The second time, a bit less so. The third time through was when I felt I had a firm grasp on what Zaryhm was talking about.

    I feel very mixed about the proposal for the talent tree system, but until I actually see something I'll try to remain (cautiously) optimistic.

  15. #255
    Quote Originally Posted by zinnin View Post
    Really liking this change, if it goes how I am expecting. Which is that you'll be making choices between utility, fun talents. Some may increase you DPS, or w\e, but a lot are survivability things, or utility.

    So as a Destro lock I could decide, do I want Shadowfury to stun those adds, or should I pick up Nether Protection to make me easier to heal on that one fight.
    Or as Demonology do I want Improved hearthstones for the raid or do I want Demonic Resilience to help stay alive.

    Things like that, sure some talents will always be better...But you can't really say that your going to use shadowfury in a DPS rotation, and its a DPS loss not to get it.
    /signed

    as Frost DK, I really want to pick up Acclimation for added resist. I can't pick it up though, since there are not enough other talents to subtract points away from where I won't be gimped DPS-wise.

    Talents are going to waste as is, with the only people picking them instantly being ridiculed by their peers for not selecting the 'right build'.

  16. #256
    These changes are actually one of the most exciting, maybe the most exciting, for Cata that I have seen from Blizzard - finally!

    That said, I have a feeling this will make balancing classes PvP under the level cap much harder, if not "impossible". The useful thing about passives is that they are easily tweakable and when they are sprayed liberally throughout a talent tree with one talent per level, balancing classes at each level or bracket is just a case of tweaking numbers. Now with this system and any remaining passives lumped per talent which is only available every other level, there could be big discontinuities/jumps both per level and between PvP level brackets.

    But whatever, I guess most people levelling, certainly up to level 75+ (Wintergrasp requirement) are not too concerned with PvP and those that are probably have many alts if not BoA twinked alts.

  17. #257
    Quote Originally Posted by Genju View Post
    There is not a single bad thing about the changes.
    They get rid of all "You deal x% more dmg,y%crit", aka all the talents u had to skill to not get called "n00b","rofl how u skilled",......
    and its not like you lose those which separates you as a DD from a non-DD spec, cause u get them passivly.

    With this system leveling a twink is way more entertaining, and nearly every talent point u get is like "oh hey now i get a funny new talent" and not like "hey i got a lvl up, yay now i put my third talentpoint in a row in +1% dmg "/cheer" .

    About the commitment to spend all 31 points in a row in a talent tree:
    who doesnt do this atm? 99% of all twinks go all out in one talent tree to get the one special active skill you need to level more satisfied. Now u get it from the start. -> big improvement.
    And since when should game design care about twinks?

  18. #258

  19. #259
    Overall I like these changes. I don't, however, being locked into one tree until I spend 31 points! If I choose ret pally, for example, I will prolly max that tree anyway before I branch out, but I don't like being forced to do so.

  20. #260
    I really like these changes, particularly the skills you automatically get for specializing in a tree. Mages can get water elementals at level 10? Nice!

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