G15 macro. Legal or not?

[Sezuka]

I asked a GM about using G19 to do this, he said it was fine as long as I was pushing the buttons.

[ComputerNerd]

If the sequence of abilities is something you can achieve with an in-game macro, ie no gcd between them, then repeating that on the keyboard, as pointless as it is should not be an issue.
Where on the otherhand, you introduce automated pauses or delays to allow for a gcd, so not being something you can achieve in game, then that is beyond reasonable use and will breach the terms of use.

[MortalWombat]

I asked a GM about using G19 to do this, he said it was fine as long as I was pushing the buttons.

GMs also said model editing was fine and look at their stance on that today!

[Deleted]

I can guarantee if Blizzard found out about this, your account would be banned.

Anything which automates user actions beyond what is capable from the game itself (including the macro language) breaks Section 2a (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/legal/termsofuse.html) of the Terms of Use Agreement and the Exploitative Activity FAQ (http://us.blizzard.com/support/article/exploitfaq).

In addition, the Blizzard software component which monitors for automation and hacking, called Warden, is known to specifically look for and report the presence of the extremely popular Logitech G15 hardware and macros. The hardware and macros are perfectly allowed by Blizzard and they signify nothing by themselves, but if any of your in-game actions result in drawing suspicion of automation to yourself in the game, this information will almost certainly be used against you.

There was a very well publicized case on the WoW forums involving the G15 in particular, summarized here: http://infernix.net/wowban/.

[Xeraluin]

i'm a clicker. i find it the most fun.

[Jaitee]

okay so i better forget it and just use the 18 extra keys for simpler tasks like open/close bags

i dont wanna risk my acc for just trying some stuff...
thank you all for your help!

my mouse i use all the extra keys for special abilities like hands bubble AW etc
just dont use anything with a delay or anything that does things on its own accord..basically set them up to do one ability only as soon as u press the button

[Aley]

As Blizzard has shown in the past, they're quite flexible with fair use.
Strictly speaking, you wouldn't be allowed to use any multiboxing software according to the EULA.
This part matters the most:

Additional License Limitations.
The license granted to you in Section 1 is subject to the limitations set forth in Sections 1 and 2 (collectively, the "License Limitations"). Any use of the Game in violation of the License Limitations will be regarded as an infringement of Blizzard's copyrights in and to the Game. You agree that you will not, under any circumstances:
............
B. use cheats, automation software (bots), hacks, mods or any other unauthorized third-party software designed to modify the World of Warcraft experience;

So basically, 1 key pressed needs to be 1 keypress recieved by the client: No repeat, no spam-while-holding-down, nothing.
Strictly speaking this does include the G15 software. I'm quite sure you won't get an immediate ban if you're using it (there are a lot of valid reasons to use it too), but it is indeed a bannable offense. (I've tested it during 3.1 on testing dummies, it's quite fun to have a macro do all the work, but it gets boring too. As of today i haven't been banned )

If you're really speaking of a rotation with cooldown-only spells, why won't you just put them in a perfectly legal macro?

/cast spell1
/cast spell2
/cast spell3

Basically, it attempts to cast spell 1 first, if that fails it continues with the other spells. If it succeeds, you'll be on GCD / busy casting and the next spells will fail.

[Brusalk]

Only issue with that macro is that it won't cast the other two spells, it'll only cast spell1 if its off cooldown, and then get stuck on it because it triggers the gcd.

[ComputerNerd]

I am currently using an n52te, and something I am going to try and get working is for a key to repeat as long as I have one pressed.
Basically as an alternative to key mashing.
Whether that is technically "ok" or not I am not sure, but it is more for convenience than anything.
It is not making any decision for me.

[Badpaladin]

Let me try to clear a few things up. As a ret paladin I know exactly what the OP is talking about. For starters, ret "rotation" is not about hitting the hardest-hitting thing that comes up, because we are not on a damage-per-cast system. We go by overall DPS, which is why CS > DS is often higher DPS than DS > CS. Anyways, this isn't about ret mechanics.

To begin, I use the program AutoHotkey to do essentially what you do. Here's the issues:

a. it is ILLEGAL to incorporate ANY delays, no matter how harmless. This is automation and is exactly what many bot programs do. Even though you're at the keyboard, it IS automation.

b. it is ILLEGAL to incorporate any program to repeat any key so long as they key is pressed down. This IS automation and IS bannable by the books.

That said, many blizzard representatives have differing opinions. A lot go by the book and say it is bannable, but others let it slide because you are at the keyboard pressing the keys, and you would be compeltely inactive if you were to walk away. In that regard, many of they will give you a free pass. Why?

Using what you are saying is very similar to spamming keys like mad, and is almost functionally indistinguishable from a scroll-wheel bind(and there are "super scroller" mice that can perform multiple scrolls with one spin). In the end all registered actions are stored somewhere as audit files and never looked at...but keep in mind that it IS risky business and you ARE pushing it. You will most likely not get a ban, and in fact you'll probably never be contacted by them about it...but you ARE walking the line and I wouldn't try to push anything with regards to automating the <Divine Storm!> proc as many players do.

I use the program AutoHotkey and instead of implementing delays I have a MaxHotkeysperinterval line that will spam a maximum of 10,000 key presses per interval of key presses. A lot of scripts have the "sleep 1" line which places a delay between keystrokes of one millisecond - that is a delay and "more bannable". I realize that the latteris exactly what the n52 or g15 can do, which is why I'd suggest using AutoHotkey instead.

After reading your post it seems you're looking to use one key for six keybinds. Do not EVER do this. That is 100% pure automation, will result is absolutely shitty DPS and will msot definitely get you banned.

[Deleted]

absolutely shitty DPS

I fail to see how doing your priority system to the exact millisecond and perfectly to the GCD would ever result in loss of DPS. EVER.

[Badpaladin]

I fail to see how doing your priority system to the exact millisecond and perfectly to the GCD would ever result in loss of DPS. EVER.

Try it for youself. I've tried the Divine Storm automation script for AutoHotkey before:

2 = DS
5 = Exo

25252525252525252525252525252525252525...etc

It has just as high a chance as landing on Divine Storm as it does Exorcism when both are up, which does happen. We're fairly GCD-locked with 2pc t10 but there are quite a few times each fight where multiple GCD's come up at the same time, or one has already been up and another comes up. My point is, a script that automates FCFS with one button can and will land on an undesirable ability if that ability lines up with the GCD and its placement on the script.

[Arlyist]

yes its legal and it will work but i wouldn't recommend it. you might fall asleep and stand in defile.

Summed up perfectly. DO what you want, but its not our fault when you get bored and blame it on not enough immersion factor.

[Helansin]

I am currently using an n52te, and something I am going to try and get working is for a key to repeat as long as I have one pressed.
Basically as an alternative to key mashing.
Whether that is technically "ok" or not I am not sure, but it is more for convenience than anything.
It is not making any decision for me.

Its fine... i use the same pad and i setup a macro on it to punch out MS/OP/Exe on my arms warrior and spam it, all i do it rend/slam/cleave or HS etc

its handy because it instantly punches out the procs from arms on skills. plus its pretty funny to hit it in pvp.

Being illegal however is not the issue. it about it being fun. which tbh, its not. i use it while occupied otherwise (speaking to wife/on phone etc)

I asked a GM about it in game, and he said it was illegal, the next said it was fine. TBH im not sure they understand it that well. Hell one of the most famous PVPers (swifty) uses the same setup on a razer mamba or whatever the hell its called. and that is displayed on a vid on youtube..

The fact that one person owns a better kind of keyboard/gamepad/mouse offering better functionality than another cant be an issue... thats like some idiot complaining on the forums to blizzard that all lazer mice should be banned because hes still stuck in the 90's and using a roller ball.

[Badpaladin]

To be fair swifty is a garbage warrior who only got decent ratings when prot was obscenely overpowered, and is now just average-rated

But Helansin, I think they know exactly what they're talking about. Just because it's illegal by the books doesn't mean they won't let it slide.

[Helansin]

To be fair swifty is a garbage warrior who only got decent ratings when prot was obscenely overpowered, and is now just average-rated

But Helansin, I think they know exactly what they're talking about. Just because it's illegal by the books doesn't mean they won't let it slide.

I never said he was the best, just one of the most famous, how? i dont care, i dont pvp enough to bother watching videos on it, i came across it while checking out the capabilities of the mouse (razor mamba i think it was) and knew of him from various forums posts.

And yes, im sure the "blizzard" guys know the programing of them quite well. I was talking about the GM's your going to speak to ingame on the issue if you bring it up (i should have been more clear on that point though)

And im fairly sure they have not declared that it is illegal to use them. the "bots" they are talking about are not simple timing macros for skills, they automate everything from moving patterns to selling crap.

[Badpaladin]

They have declared them as automation.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...geNo=1&sid=1#8

Those macro keys are pretty useful (I use a G15 myself, though that's a personal statement, not a Blizzard endorsement). On the other hand, they can be dangerous too.
Do not use them to automate game play in any fashion.
Do not use them so that a single macro press results in multiple actions.
Do not use them to insert time delays between hardware functions. For example, making a macro that causes your character cast a spell, delay one second, then cast another spell would be unacceptable.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/th...902593&sid=1#0

This is not okay. One hardware function = one action, according to standard macro rules. A hardware function is a keypress (including press/release) associated with movement and an ability/item. Obviously, our default macro rules enable you to use 'modifying' trinkets or abilities, such as nature's swiftness, plus a single spell all in a single press.

To clarify: No, you may not use hardware or software to auto-spam your shot rotations - period.

The OP wanted to spam his shot rotation macro that he wrote in-game, meaning he was spamming just one key in-game and one key only. No funny business about incorporating multiple keys into one g15 macro, which would certainly be illegal.

Now if you were to email blizzard about this or talk to GMs NONE of them would deny what I have posted. It IS illegal, period. What I'm saying is that it's "legal enough" for most GM's to let it slide. They're not going to make an official statment saying it's okay to use automated presses for just one key and one key only because that would open up a lot more people to the idea of botting and complete and total automation. They're never going to declare this as legal, and nobody here should ever think that it is legal because it is not. Period.

If you're concerned about getting banned, you won't be. This is essentially what will happen:

http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/5...8222343cp7.jpg

[Deleted]

The OP wanted to spam his shot rotation macro that he wrote in-game, meaning he was spamming just one key in-game and one key only. No funny business about incorporating multiple keys into one g15 macro, which would certainly be illegal.

Uh, woot? Read the OP's post again. He is specifically asking to about a macro with "multiple keys into one g15 macro"...As you've shown yourself from the Blizzard post: "Do not use them to insert time delays between hardware functions. For example, making a macro that causes your character cast a spell, delay one second, then cast another spell would be unacceptable."

What I'm saying is that it's "legal enough" for most GM's to let it slide. They're not going to make an official statment saying it's okay to use automated presses for just one key and one key only because that would open up a lot more people to the idea of botting and complete and total automation. They're never going to declare this as legal, and nobody here should ever think that it is legal because it is not. Period.

If you're concerned about getting banned, you won't be. This is essentially what will happen:

No idea what you are talking about here. Assuming you misread the OP's post, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt except "If you're concerned about getting banned, you won't be". People have been banned for less. The only reason to not be "concerned about getting banned" is to not break the rules...simplez!

As Blizzard has shown in the past, they're quite flexible with fair use.
Strictly speaking, you wouldn't be allowed to use any multiboxing software according to the EULA.

The OP's post and thread is not even close to talking about "multiboxing software". Do you even know what the G15 is?

But since you brought the offtopic up: multiboxing is not explicitly supported by Blizzard but it is accepted (http://blue.mmo-champion.com/t/25026...oxing-gameplay). This is like other games, especially FPS games, where technology like the ATI Eye Infinity is not explicitly supported but it is allowed. The difference in this case is that at least multiboxing confers no direct competitive advantage at all.

Multiboxing is simply two or more accounts and playing them at the same time. It is not even playing them simultaneously because you often do not want to do that since it would be either not possible or distracting or there is a queue in play or single resource.

Even with software to help, multiboxing does not automate any actions. One key press does not result in multiple actions in-game. You cannot walk away from a multiboxing setup and it continue playing for you. One key press can result in one action per screen with the right software *exactly* the same as if there was one ordinary player per screen. Also, it is just a playstyle. By multiboxing you eliminate the possibilities to play in other ways which may be far more beneficial or competitive. Playing with other smart people is more useful than playing with clones of yourself since its only one brain and one experience, for example. Another example: it is difficult to very difficult to role-specialise deeply per screen (tank/healer/dps) and retain central control - something that would be standard in a normal group.

"cheats": multiboxing is not a cheat since everyone can do it using just Blizzard software (if they wanted) and it confers no advantage - its just an expensive playstyle.
"automation software (bots"): multiboxing does not use bots or any software which automates in-game actions.
"mods or any other unauthorized third-party software designed to modify the World of Warcraft experience": no aspect of the WoW experience is altered at all by multiboxing. It's exactly the same as if you have multiple accounts and decide to play them side by side - that is all it is. In fact, if anything as explained above, it is a substantial *subset* of that overall WoW experience at potentially vastly increased cost.

[Szyrex]

yes its legal and it will work but i wouldn't recommend it. you might fall asleep and stand in defile.

Unless he has a macro for moving from defile aswel!

[Badpaladin]

Uh, woot? Read the OP's post again. He is specifically asking to about a macro with "multiple keys into one g15 macro"...As you've shown yourself from the Blizzard post: "Do not use them to insert time delays between hardware functions. For example, making a macro that causes your character cast a spell, delay one second, then cast another spell would be unacceptable."

So, do you actually read threads or just take bits and pieces out of context? I already made my statement to the OP of this thread, I was replying to Helansin with blizzard quotes and a reference to the OP of the thread in the WoW forums that I linked for convenience. A lot of people, like Helansin, are saying it's not illegal if you use it to press one key(one ability or macro) and one key only per finger press. You press "1" and it spams in-game "1" and "1" only. That is a misconception to think it's not illegal, because it most certainly is and the quotes about hardware functions prove this. It's automation. Now I went on to explain why many peoples' emails to blizzard seem to have conflicting interests, but it does not change the rules.

No idea what you are talking about here. Assuming you misread the OP's post, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt except "If you're concerned about getting banned, you won't be". People have been banned for less. The only reason to not be "concerned about getting banned" is to not break the rules...simplez!

Refer to the above, this was part of my response to Helansin and the statements people in this thread are making regarding legality. Regarding getting banned, the blue posts say specifically that they will not ban your account for actions such as these. Every single action by every single player is recorded and stored, but that doesn't mean they're not looked at when there's something odd detected. If warden senses specific time delays and your character doing a lot more than just hitting Crusader Strike(as in, botting a BG or farming or...whatever) it will flag your account and strike you in the face with the banhammer. Now something like that is very functionally distinguishable from a g15 macro spamming one key X times, and they can distinguish the two quite easily.

The screenshot I linked was when the program WoWModelEdit was officially bannable if players used it. This player was obviously using the program, but Warden flagged it and made the player unable to log in until the program was deleted.

In case you're mistaken in thinking I didn't read the thread, here is my specific response regarding legaility:

After reading your post it seems you're looking to use one key for six keybinds. Do not EVER do this. That is 100% pure automation, will result is absolutely shitty DPS and will msot definitely get you banned.

Sorry for any confusion. Motherfucker, three edits! On a roll here...