Guys, are we the baddies? (Alliance)

[unillenium]

OK everyone things that Hordes are the baddies and we are the honorable goodyes....but apparenltly not...
First we get to destroy Camp taurajo, killing the civilians in the process and looting it.
Second We ally with the grimtotem taurens in stonetalon to mash up some orcs
Thrid we destroy the dancing troll willage, this helping the twilight cultist in the area a bit ( by saving them from a troll invasion that is)! And lots of more darkish things!
And heres something for fun:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpZ8EkK3eWY
Please, discuss!

Pure conjecture based upon presumptions that are lacking in evidence.
/thread.

[Jeer]

OK everyone things that Hordes are the baddies and we are the honorable goodyes....but apparenltly not...
First we get to destroy Camp taurajo, killing the civilians in the process and looting it.
Second We ally with the grimtotem taurens in stonetalon to mash up some orcs
Thrid we destroy the dancing troll willage, this helping the twilight cultist in the area a bit ( by saving them from a troll invasion that is)! And lots of more darkish things!
And heres something for fun:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpZ8EkK3eWY
Please, discuss!

I'm pretty sure that they destroy the dancing troll village because the trolls attacked them.

[Deleted]

Then you have the Horde. Undead are pure EVIL, no explanation needed. Blood elves are pure EVIL, no explanation needed. Trolls are not that evil but they do thrive on voodoo magic. Goblins, if you want to include them, are nothing but a bunch of scam artists. Orcs were always blood thirsty brutes and were only kept at bay by their peace loving leader. Who has now been replaced by a hateful warmonger. Asshole needs to remember who is invading whose planet here.

The undead are hardly pure evil. They're in a war from all sides and paranoid as can be about humans coming with torches to their lands claiming it is land of the alliance, so they're lashing out at everything. There have been several examples of Forsaken becoming incredible heroes. With a more benevolent ruler, the Forsaken could easily have adapted to live in peace.

Blood elves? Evil? Yeah I don't see this one. They might be stuck up, but that's about it. They are magic addicts who's pool of magic died out. They're desperate people, who know have access to a pool of holy magic. They're not evil, they're survivalists. Their homeworld was mostly destroyed and the only people who came to their aid were the Forsaken, who helped them reconquer the ghostlands.

Orcs were not always bloodthirsty brutes, they were one of the most peaceful races in existence before the burning legion corrupted them. I'm going to have to point the finger of blame to the Draenei there, for luring the burning legion to Draenor. Or perhaps the Night Elves instead, for luring them to Azeroth, which in turn made the legion seek out new warriors to conquer azeroth.


Now let's look at your so called benign races. We have the humans, who betrayed the people who helped rebuilt Stormwind by kicking them outside of the city gates. Then there's another human kingdom that betrayed the alliance to the demonic horde in exchange for land. The whole human alliance was crumbling to pieces before they had one enemy to fight against, the new horde.

The night elves are hardly benign, they care for nature, but that's where it ends. They're responsible for the war of the ancients, as well as the war with the Orcs. They've been portrayed as hocus pocus oh so nice in World of Warcraft, but these were people who had no problems with trying to massacre a race trying to fight off the burning legion for chopping down some trees.



Every race has rotten apples in them, that doesn't make one faction evil and the other good. The Horde could very well simply have packed their stuff and gone back to Draenor to let the alliance fend against the Scourge, Burning Legion and Twilight Cult themselves. They'd have been long gone by now.

[Albert the fish]

Um, no? Humans have quite a few bad apples, being the quintessential imperfect race prone to greed, etc. The current leader is pretty merciless but that is because he was imprisoned and made to fight as a gladiator for years by the Horde. Every other Alliance race is pretty benign. Night Elves just care about nature and nobody is going to say Draenei are evil. Gnomes may blow them selves up but that's just destructive, it's not evil. Dwarves just want to get drunk in the short term and find out their history in the long term. No evil there.

Then you have the Horde. Undead are pure EVIL, no explanation needed. Blood elves are pure EVIL, no explanation needed. Trolls are not that evil but they do thrive on voodoo magic. Goblins, if you want to include them, are nothing but a bunch of scam artists. Orcs were always blood thirsty brutes and were only kept at bay by their peace loving leader. Who has now been replaced by a hateful warmonger. Asshole needs to remember who is invading whose planet here.

The Horde has just 1 benign race and that is Tauren. With trolls that brings them to a grand total of 1.5/5 benign races. The Alliance is 4/5 benign at worst, even if you choose to count humans and furry humans as 0.5 each.

humans are not only capable of evil they are good at it 1/5
night elves are xenophobic to the point where upon seeing orcs in their forest they didn't even bother to try talking, they opened fire and attempted to destroy them. shame the orcs weren't pushovers or no one would know. they also hat their descendants with what can only be called passion, they despise high and blood elves for the sins of the Highborne. not what you'd call nice people. 2/5
dwarves are culturally very similar to humans with the exception of the whole prefering to live underground and liking beer a bit more. not the same, but we aren't exactly dealing with the difference between pakistan and canada here,more like united states and england. if the humans are treated as suspect the dwarves have to be.plus Dark Iron dwarves who are in the alliance now. 3/5

gnomes are a lot more complacent than the other races, they are a little dwarfish, but honestly seem to prefer to keep to their own little world of experimentation and science, only in this because of racial association to the dwarves. i'll let the little blighters off the hook.a few bad eggs but overall not terrible. 3/5

draenei aren't that evil. i'll give you that. they do have a few issues though. mostly steadfast hatred of the orcs, yeah they had a war a while back, the orcs were under demonic control and the draenei know this. yes i can understand that it takes a while for those wounds to heal but they aren't being very good followers of the Light and goodness by using this hate to keep them warm at night. 4/5

worgen were pretty gray even when they were humans still
5/6

that makes each faction have 5/6 races that have strong influences of what we'd think of as "bad guy" traits
yeah we're pretty much all the bad guys

[Oajng]

None are really good or bad, it's not that simple. If you want proof of some horde quests being "evil" check this out: http://www.wowhead.com/quest=13230

Alliance has a quest just like that. so both alliance and horde are even there

[Deleted]

What I don't get is why the Alliance seems to almost target the Tauren... I mean they throw insult after insult at the most peaceful race of the Horde. Allying with the Grimtotem and slaughtering Taurajo... that's just dumb. They've made enemies of the race that could possibly be a mediator between the factions.

[Deleted]

We are evil because at long last we attacked and destroyed one of the Horde bases?
Yeah right....
We have war ladies and gentlemen.

War is time to kill soldiers, not children and women and basically civilian people.

[helleros]

the winners will be honourable and the losers will be displayed as the bad guys

history is made by the victors...

[killzwitch]

Our hats...they've got skullz on them.

[Xheoul]

in WOTLK:
Horde is evil cause in the "Avenge Me!" quest they kill dying alliance soldiers! OMG THATS ATROCIOUS! Even if youre in war you dont do that!

in Cata:
Oh youre pissed off we killed innocent Tauren? This is war... durp


OT: Neither side is good or bad, but almost every alliance player I meet IRL is a complete douche.

[Frumpy Frumpy Frak]

All's fair in love and war.

[Albert the fish]

Alliance has a quest just like that. so both alliance and horde are even there

you just supported his point *blink* was that your intent?

[Deleted]

The undead are hardly pure evil. They're in a war from all sides and paranoid as can be about humans coming with torches to their lands claiming it is land of the alliance, so they're lashing out at everything. There have been several examples of Forsaken becoming incredible heroes. With a more benevolent ruler, the Forsaken could easily have adapted to live in peace.

Blood elves? Evil? Yeah I don't see this one. They might be stuck up, but that's about it. They are magic addicts who's pool of magic died out. They're desperate people, who know have access to a pool of holy magic. They're not evil, they're survivalists. Their homeworld was mostly destroyed and the only people who came to their aid were the Forsaken, who helped them reconquer the ghostlands.

Orcs were not always bloodthirsty brutes, they were one of the most peaceful races in existence before the burning legion corrupted them. I'm going to have to point the finger of blame to the Draenei there, for luring the burning legion to Draenor. Or perhaps the Night Elves instead, for luring them to Azeroth, which in turn made the legion seek out new warriors to conquer azeroth.


Now let's look at your so called benign races. We have the humans, who betrayed the people who helped rebuilt Stormwind by kicking them outside of the city gates. Then there's another human kingdom that betrayed the alliance to the demonic horde in exchange for land. The whole human alliance was crumbling to pieces before they had one enemy to fight against, the new horde.

The night elves are hardly benign, they care for nature, but that's where it ends. They're responsible for the war of the ancients, as well as the war with the Orcs. They've been portrayed as hocus pocus oh so nice in World of Warcraft, but these were people who had no problems with trying to massacre a race trying to fight off the burning legion for chopping down some trees.



Every race has rotten apples in them, that doesn't make one faction evil and the other good. The Horde could very well simply have packed their stuff and gone back to Draenor to let the alliance fend against the Scourge, Burning Legion and Twilight Cult themselves. They'd have been long gone by now.

Whats with all that "DEATH TO THE LIVING" Thing?

[Deleted]

Um, no? Humans have quite a few bad apples, being the quintessential imperfect race prone to greed, etc. The current leader is pretty merciless but that is because he was imprisoned and made to fight as a gladiator for years by the Horde. Every other Alliance race is pretty benign. Night Elves just care about nature and nobody is going to say Draenei are evil. Gnomes may blow them selves up but that's just destructive, it's not evil. Dwarves just want to get drunk in the short term and find out their history in the long term. No evil there.

Then you have the Horde. Undead are pure EVIL, no explanation needed. Blood elves are pure EVIL, no explanation needed. Trolls are not that evil but they do thrive on voodoo magic. Goblins, if you want to include them, are nothing but a bunch of scam artists. Orcs were always blood thirsty brutes and were only kept at bay by their peace loving leader. Who has now been replaced by a hateful warmonger. Asshole needs to remember who is invading whose planet here.

The Horde has just 1 benign race and that is Tauren. With trolls that brings them to a grand total of 1.5/5 benign races. The Alliance is 4/5 benign at worst, even if you choose to count humans and furry humans as 0.5 each.

I think I DO need an explanation as to why the Blood Elves are considered evil in your eyes. The Darkspear practise their magic, nothing evil about that(do you think the Haitians are evil?), by your logic, any race that has warlocks is evil. I think the Horde is split about evenly between the more warmongering ones and shamanistic/peaceloving ones, as for the goblins, the ones joining the Horde don't look as the cutthroat businessmen kind that many other cartels are(disasters like the ones they had to endure change people's perspective). As for the Forsaken..well, they're their basterdly awesome selves.

[Deleted]

All's fair in love and war.

Except it isn't. There are boundaries that should be observed, otherwise you end up labeled as a monster and shunned by everyone, even your own people.

[Graden]

What I don't get is why the Alliance seems to almost target the Tauren... I mean they throw insult after insult at the most peaceful race of the Horde. Allying with the Grimtotem and slaughtering Taurajo... that's just dumb. They've made enemies of the race that could possibly be a mediator between the factions.

Alliance wanna conquer the Barrens and Taurens stood in their way.

[Fireslave]

Alliance and horde are always at each others throats, Varian has a hell of a temper and Garrosh is a somewhat loose cannon with a lust for blood so it was always going to become full out war on both sides. If you listen to SW civilians they tell of how their lands were pillaged by horde too so...both are pretty bad.

[Phenomina]

Horde are Baddish and Alliance are goodish

The OP is not Alliance, we can smell Orc's in Human clothing

[NotValidAnymore]

Both Alliance and Horde have done bad things and keep doing them.
But both sides also do good things.

There isn't any good or bad side. Everyone just fights for a cause they believe in. Some causes are good, some causes are bad. But there isn't any side that fights for only good or bad things.

This is why World of Warcraft is interesting, because there are several different viewpoints to the situations in the world, there isn't just a good and a bad side.
Though it's easy to forget that sometimes.

By the way, the only reason Alliance seem good and Horde seem bad is because of how they look. Maybe it has something to do with their cultures too but it's mostly just because of their looks.

[Deleted]

Horde are Baddish and Alliance are goodish

The OP is not Alliance, we can smell Orc's in Human clothing

Dude i play alliance (gnome warlock-warlock is the key word- with intentions for making worgen warlock or warrior), and on my opinion on this, i actualy like how we are getting corrupted and bad. Kinda cool.