Gag Order or Piercing Howl

[Flaks]

According to the front page, the newest build made it so that Gag Order in the protection tree is now a tier 2 talent. This really forces us into an exceptionally tough decision-making spot as arms warriors. I think its kind of obvious what Fury will be going for but Arms has to sacrifice one or the other. I know it says 'rank 4 to rank 2' but I'm pretty sure that means tier.

I know nothing's final. Thoughts?

P.S. OMG REMOVAL OF STANCE PENALTIES!!!111oneone!!11!1

[bateman]

Fury might be arena viable with the stance penalty removal.

[Nide]

I'd say Gag for arms. PH is a great luxury but having a ranged interrupt is amazing and to boot you get blood and thunder and/or Shield spec!

[fizikz]

large amounts of rage on spell reflect sounds pretty nice to me.

[Zarghol]

large amounts of rage on spell reflect sounds pretty nice to me.

That'd mean you'd have to skip Blood Craze, and... you don't want to skip blood craze. Not for Shield Mastery, at least. PH or gag order, though... Now we're talking utility choices like they promised us! I'm really not sure what I'd rather want though, we lose out on quite a bit of damage by going to prot and a chance of enrage to consume with enraged regen. However, a ranged attack+silence on 30s CD is _badass_, and assuming heroic strike is something we want to be hitting a lot, it might not be that bad of a damage reduction. I'm definitely leaning towards gag order, arms PoV! Might even see if I can sneak in a point or two in improved hamstring, now that it'll be the main slow.

[Pnad]

a ranged attack+silence on 30s CD is badass

^^^THIS^^^

Will be able to make a nice silence chain, with Hthrow>Sbash>HThrow obivously there is some gaps in there that can easly be countered with a fear, spell rflax or pummel

[bateman]

You're still going to go down into fury for PH+a ton of other useful talents.Gag order + a bunch of useless shitty filler talents aren't worth what speccing into fury is gonna give you.

[Pnad]

you can still get 2/3 blood craze, and nothing else in fury is really THAT appealing compared to the low tier prot talents which arent spectacular either.

having a 30 sec CD is great utlitly and somthing warriors have needed for a long time, loosing our best snare for this kinda sucks, but personally I'd prefer gag order. let your partners do the slowing. playing a whole expansion worth of arena with out a reliable interupt makes me sad face

[Pnad]

Unless something drasticly changes in Cata, casters have never been an issue for warriors other than Frost mages and, more recently, Shadow Priests. And Heroic Throw talented is not going to be what makes that match for us. PH > HT any day of the week, especially when you factor in the wasted talents.

wot

do you actually play this game, have you ever tried to kill a holy pally, my god man.

with gag order we will probably be able give them the beating we've been waiting 4 years for.

same with disc priest, try to beat them in a duel
you can pretty much destroy a resto druid if you keep him silenced so they can't get hots up

lots of classes have much better snares than us, I havnt been up on the changes latly but the last i looked hamstring was a immobilize on 30 sec CD, so all you have is Phowl, it last 6 sec so you have to use it every 4th CD, let rogues and mages do that shit. not really that apealling compared to a 3 sec silence on a 30 sec CD and a 3 sec silence on a 10 sec (i forget) CD

nothing else in fury is all that great, blood craze is must have and you can still get 2/3, but the new cruelty and other talents arent game breaking so I dont see your point.

If you ever played prot pvp you can see how crippling you can be with silences + stun (throwdown) and the lower CD on Hthrow is pretty hot.

[Pickwickman]

Gag Order all the way.

Why? It's ranged, that's why. It's also 30sec.

It will be hard to adjust into a play with spamstring instead of PH though, for those pillar huggers. D:

[Pnad]

I'm not really to focused on duels, 1v1 doesnt matter

but in arena there is lots of times in 2's where you get into a 1v1 situation vs a pally or w/e and being able to stop spell casting has been our weakest feature since wotlk

its pretty clutch in arena to, to be on focus target fear healer, have him come back and silence him from range, ect. all sorts of cool shit you can do.

P howl is a nice talent dont get me wrong, but after playing prot here and there and learning to live with out it, its not a big deal, and after playing with a crappier version of gag order, this change makes me wet.

again, mages and rogues for aoe snare, wall of frost, FoK, add a frost trap too

[Pnad]

I'm just honestly confused why you're in a 1v1 situation against a paladin who is so far away from you. I'd suggest you intercept your ass on over, PH, and go to town from there. If you really need to interrupt you have your choice of Pummel, Shield Bash, or the new Knockdown we're getting.

I get it; Gag order is a shiny new toy and you're all excited. But I can guarentee 3 months from now you'll all be subspeccing Fury.

like I said before, do you actually play this game?!

there is many times where you 1v1 a pally. and Phowl + 'going to town' is laughable, he will out heal and dmg you put out no problem, you may get him low, but try doing that twice between bubble CD's ... good luck, and as for Sbash and pummle, I have to much lag to try to bash a hasted flash of light, and like wise with pummle, unless you pre emptivly switch to zerk stance. yes throwdown will deffintly help is this department no doubt, will be very nice... so would 2 seperate silences both on extremely short CD's

gag order is hardly a 'shiny new toy' its been around since wotlk, however having acess to it as arms is indeed new and a very interesting oppourtunity

I can't say for sure if i'll play sub specced prot or fury, but after years of the same game play I am sure as hell gonna give gag order/arms a shot, like i said numerous times, having a readly accessable interupt, let alone blanket silence, has beens arms weakest link this whole x-pac

anyways I'm done debating this with you, I've seen you post here befor with your inane BS where you think you know everything but really your just a random 1500 rated scrubnub who talks a lotta shit. yur bad bro

[Rend]

I can't agree with Pnad anymore, I for one am giving this a try.

[Martsus]

I for one can't play without PH, makes spammstring feel clunky. And who knows, perhaps all warriors will be fury this xpack, we just don't know yet.

[Torne]

Fury might be arena viable with the stance penalty removal.

good luck with druids dispelling all your enrages with one spamable spell.
fury will not be vialble in PvP with the recent Soothe change.

[Rend]

Torne has rose quite a fair point, soothe will mess up fury as a viable pvp spec for sure, which is typical because fury was just looking viable and fun to play. Damn it I was looking forward to atleast giving it a try.

Ohwell, nothing has changed there eh Blizzard? -.- Why does everything have to have a counter huh? It doesnt make it balanced at all imo, And even if it was to have something to counter it, it should not be something like they did to bladestorm where it totally annihalates the ability/spec. A spammable button is pretty retarded. I mean I know priests have mass dispel right? But removing things like bubble off the paly isnt exactly f*cking over the class is it?

[Pnad]

I for one can't play without PH, makes spammstring feel clunky. And who knows, perhaps all warriors will be fury this xpack, we just don't know yet.

i hear ya brotha, playing w/o P.howl feels very weird at first, but after a while you do get used to it. and hamstring will no longer be spamstring leaving howl as your only spammable snare, which being the GCD starved class that we are isnt likely you'll have 100% up time with only 6 sec duration + all the new abilities were getting.

I forget what talent give S.bash a daze effect, but there is always that in a pinch aswell.

as for fury, its has some nice things going for it, imp intercept + heroic fury is pretty sexy, but unless they put furious attacks MS effect on BT (which they should) I cant really see it being competitive ... plus the whole enrage dispell thing which is basically furys lifeblood

[Pnad]

ya i see your charcter sig, warrior with gear attainable from pugging icc25 on weekends...

lots of times you get 1v1 with a paladin, and if you ever get both partners dead you will not kill him, he can BoF pillar hump and avoid most your dmg, if you DO get him low he heals/bubbles, and you will not kill him in zerk stance with out being able to catch some heals with OP first...gg like I said, 1500 player opinion is invalid.

you were talking a bunch of smack in a post I made about shield slam being prot only, usual verbal dribble, sounded like a bunch of herp derp and basically everybody agreed your a moron, big suprise.

I guess when all your arguments are invalid and you run out of crap to come up with trying to criticize spelling and grammar is your last straw haha, yea bro spell check makes your smart, durrr. If you can't even break 2200 your should stfu lol

and what are these GREAT fury talents your talking about besides blood craze?

go back to get farmed in 1400 brackets by people on there alts in blue gear you scrub, if you ever wants some tips on how to not fail so badly @ warrior send me a PM ill help ya out buddy.... its pretty easy you know.

[Pickwickman]

Now now kids, don't start calling each other names.

Although I most of the time do not agree with Anth3m, I do not think of him as a scrub. He just states the things that he has experienced and how he makes things work.

If you ask me, Arms without PH will be harder to play of course, as we used to be able to slow people who are pillarhumping. Gag Order will give us a much easier time controlling spell-locks but we won't have the same mobility reduction anymore that we had with PH.

But Blizz wants to make Fury pvp capable too, with PH being restricted and most importantly getting rid of the -5% damage penalty on zerker stance. This will not mean that Fury will be OP for pvp, but it will become playable.

[Aranes]

I assume this would be the Arms/GO build:
http://www.wowtal.com/#k=BWLxgsiG.9uf.warrior