Im curious.

[Deleted]

Ok lately we've seen some ridiculous changes Like Marked for Death which we lost the 3% extra dmg and 6% extra crit to take
a talent that Applies hunter's mark.Then the other day we see rhumba making wings and flying away those 2 changes took away
the fun and the excitement and gave boredom.Both changes had no Valid comments Especially The rhumba talent most of his
words were ridiculous i cant see a point in removing those talents.They took away the most fun talent that gave the most of
excitement for a hunter to play just a for a garbage talent.

Just to clarify this isn't a qq post Im just curious why they removed such good effects for
that garbage.

[Cyph3r]

You sure? Because it definitely reads like a QQ thread.

First, we don't know why, we're not Blizzard... duh. All we can do is speculate and discuss.

With Rhumba, they said that they thought BM had too many damage talents and not enough situational/survival talents. So they chose the dps talent they felt was most expendable, and cut it. I'd like to note that they replaced it with a fairly fantastic survivability talent by the way.

And the Marked for Death change I rather like. It takes what was a passive dps boost (remember how we all begged and pleaded for these to be removed?) and instead made it a talent that changes up our playstyle a bit. Now when target switching we don't have to worry about throwing up Mark first (and honestly, many times we skip it if the add will die fast, why waste the GCD right?). This is awesome because it means we'll always get that extra AP from mark on EVERYTHING we attack, without taking time to apply it manually. This is better in pvp, and better in add heavy situations (like um, leveling).

People seem to like to forget that Hunters are incredibly versatile DPSers. When was the last time you were in a fight with lots of mechanics that require special roles to handle, and yet got to just stand there and single target DPS the boss? Imagine getting free Hunter's Mark on stuff like blood beasts on Saurfang, adds on Lady D, or like, EVERY EXTRA ADD on Lich King. That would be freaking amazing, and I welcome it with open arms.

[Rizarroz]

You play a hunter in WotLK and you don't have rhumba so I don't see why not having it will affect you in any way in Cata.

Marked for Death, I admit, is a horrible change and I'm quite sure that it isn't going to stay. The few people who think it's good in target switching fight need to rethink because it saves you a few global CDs but the mark applies AFTER you hit your arcane/chimera so that's 1500 AP loss from a 40 focus shot. Also, it's really important in pvp that you have full control over the mark because the dps target isn't always the one you want to mark.

What we need is the global CD removal from the hunter's mark, not this useless thing.

[Deleted]

It's not a qq post i just feel bad seeing such a cool talent to go away in cold blood.Anywayz your point in MArked for death talent is indeed valid but
Rhumba talent the post that ghostcrawler made is just ridiculous there are so many talents to cut what i pretty much understand is that the flavor of new stuff
is moving away.

[Thereign]

Something had to go according to blizzard, and unfortunately it was Rhumba. Who knows, it might make a return in one way or another.

[Sharpopiev2]

I would love for Rhumba to return, even if it turned into a learnable ability to all specs I'd love it

[ASO]

Every class's trees are in flux, Blizzard has stated time and time again their new design philosophy is "a few good talents and a bunch that don't really affect DPS but are playstyle choices." The new Marked For Death is one such choice. The lack of Rhumba comes from it probably being a huge headache mechanics-wise; I loved the idea as well and I am sad to see it go.

Expect all class' trees to be hollowed out even further. I think Marked For Death is a really good example of what they want the leaves to look like.

But I mean, think about it, the old MFD was literally a boring talent, it was 3/5 talent points just to make numbers bigger, period. Nothing new, nothing fun, just +%.

[Gildian]

I dont think they will make you able to learn such passive things.
And it will be a problem mixed with the steady shot improving talents.

See: Soul Link

[Deleted]

what about Volley then thats erm....GONE? no not bugged they just removed it
hunters only ability for some decent AOEing.
oh hey but we still have multi shot :/

if they improve it and change it to a volley like AOE maybe like shooting 10 arrows instead pf just 3

ohyea its not possible to shoot 10 arrows atm like arrows falling out the sky issent real to doesnt feel right for a hunter class
but shooting 3 arrows at the time and having stone flying drakes is?
blizz fails if u ask me

Volley removed from the game (And of course when I don't report a missing skill because I think it's a bug, it's actually gone for real)
It's gone. We want to make Multi-Shot the spell hunters use for AE.

Channeling a spell that makes arrows fall out of the sky doesn't feel like a hunter ability and doesn't even really match the name of the spell.

[S@thi]

what about Volley then thats erm....GONE? no not bugged they just removed it
hunters only ability for some decent AOEing.
oh hey but we still have multi shot :/

if they improve it and change it to a volley like AOE maybe like shooting 10 arrows instead pf just 3

ohyea its not possible to shoot 10 arrows atm like arrows falling out the sky issent real to doesnt feel right for a hunter class
but shooting 3 arrows at the time and having stone flying drakes is?
blizz fails if u ask me

I feel your pain and share it..
But as their buffing multi-shot I guess it's just wait and see....

[Huntrex]

Another curious thing.

I read we arent losing deadzone after all but we are losing volley cos it isnt hunterish enough.

I accept using a bow while being meleed wouldnt really happen so no real problems - but if thats the case - since when was it possible to hit ppl with a sword at 5 yds or even 8yds with whirlwind. Thats 15/24 feet!

I ll accept having a dead zone when melee accept a true melee range - - says 2 yds.

[Deleted]

Another curious thing.

I read we arent losing deadzone after all but we are losing volley cos it isnt hunterish enough.

I accept using a bow while being meleed wouldnt really happen so no real problems - but if thats the case - since when was it possible to hit ppl with a sword at 5 yds or even 8yds with whirlwind. Thats 15/24 feet!

I ll accept having a dead zone when melee accept a true melee range - - says 2 yds.

this one,
if blizz wants to go to total teallity then this should be changed aswell!
pff arrows faling from the heavens issent realistic ok it issent but for how long do we hunters use if for now and they just figured it out it issent realistic DUH!!!

[Mammoth]

Another curious thing.

I read we arent losing deadzone after all but we are losing volley cos it isnt hunterish enough.

I accept using a bow while being meleed wouldnt really happen so no real problems - but if thats the case - since when was it possible to hit ppl with a sword at 5 yds or even 8yds with whirlwind. Thats 15/24 feet!

I ll accept having a dead zone when melee accept a true melee range - - says 2 yds.

Your arrows and bullets also don't go in straight lines. I'll accept a true melee range, when your shots miss because the mob moved after you fired your weapon.

[Kimbald]

'the mob moved after you fired your weapon'...
If you guys are playing the realistic game, just think this line over a few times.
For arrows, maybe. Bullets? Suuuuure...

Wow isn't realistic, not even by it's own fantasy logic.
Ghostcrawler can say volley wasn't like what you do with a gun or bow, but in the end they removed it in the big AoE clean up.

As for the topic itself:

on following the survival changes, I am still waiting for the 'fun element' we were promised. Or even more: for the enhanced trap utility.
We got Expose weakness first mysteriously changed to unknown effects, only to have it cut out entirely before ever being implemented.
Rhumba just the same.
These talents could have been fun.

Now those whole talent tree revamps are not showing any real choices from what I see.
Neither are they showing a lot of fun options.
So far they all reek of working towards a single cooky cutter dps build again, with a few talents spent on utility you'll hardly use in raids anyhow, so basically they are obliged pvp talents.
Main thing being: those few talents not spent on dps will NOT be real choices, since they will not seperate one hunter from the next in a raid.
Now while this is some sort of (weak) utility, it is not adding fun options as they presented it.

I'm seeing more fun talents go, and too many boring talents like improved tracking stay, or worse: Black Arrow instead of improving our traps for Survival (BA in effect in beta is nothing but a launched immolation trap, both in use as in cooldown). Making BA top of the tree is utterly boring.
So far the changes don't impress me, for the general line of events.

Survival tree is supposed to be the least finished of the hunter trees, and I sure hope that is true. Because in it's current beta form it is dotting specc that lacks every bit of creativity...
BM was looking the best till now, but removing Rhumba is a bummer for that as well.

[Maleficious]

They've really messed up Marked for Death and Rhumba was a nice talent - no idea why it got removed.

[Cyph3r]

They've really messed up Marked for Death and Rhumba was a nice talent - no idea why it got removed.

It's been discussed on these forums in over and over, in this very thread even. Also, I'm not in beta and didn't realize that Rhumba never even got implemented to begin with. Is everyone seriously complaining about losing something you never even HAD? People were saying how "fun" and "cool" it was... without ever actually trying it. For all we know when they tested it internally they discovered that it was kinda boring in practice. Let's not complain over the loss of something that was only ever an idea to begin with.

And just to reiterate I love the new design of marked for death SO much more than the original. In my opinion talents aren't there to boost our dps (especially just by passively increasing %'s), that's what gear is for. They're there to change up our playstyle and make us feel different than the other 2 specs. I view the new Marked for Death as a perfect example of what a well designed talent SHOULD look like.

[quras]

And just to reiterate I love the new design of marked for death SO much more than the original. In my opinion talents aren't there to boost our dps (especially just by passively increasing %'s), that's what gear is for. They're there to change up our playstyle and make us feel different than the other 2 specs. I view the new Marked for Death as a perfect example of what a well designed talent SHOULD look like.

I'm confused at your logic. How is it that you're so against liking passive talents (or any talent that boosts DPS or crit or whatever) and yet, a talent that turns another talent into a passive one, that you once had to actively use to gets it's DPS benefit. blizzard changed an active talent into a talent that is now passive and does nothing but boost your DPS. I just don't get your thinking.

The new Marked for death is probably one of the worst talents they have adjusted so far and it being a T6 talent makes it look even worse. (yea yea its still beta)

Might as well create a talent that by completion of you first rotation, you get an additional 500+ atk power on your current target. Oh wait they did.

Talk about unimaginative design.

[Sharpopiev2]

My theory on Multi-shot being the aoe is that its practically the same as Volley, but instead of arrows falling from the sky, they all just fly from your weapon. But I doubt it will be that simple :P

[Gildian]

My theory on Multi-shot being the aoe is that its practically the same as Volley, but instead of arrows falling from the sky, they all just fly from your weapon. But I doubt it will be that simple :P

GC said "only class claims" are a success by developers, we could very well be the only class without an AoE and instead our cleave (MS) will be buffed. Just 1 scenario that could play out.