Berserking vs. Mongoose!

[Deleted]

How about instead of bashing players at that level, link yourself, Paragon's main feral is tank, that's why I linked outside of them, and that tank, despite what you said about mongoose being better for them too, uses blood draining. Stop saying that people that have killed heroic LK and Halion, and are raiding at the top are bad just because you're losing an argument. Link your own feral with mongoose or stop talking.

How about you actually learn what enchants are used for before spouting bullshit, Blood Draining = Effective HP, Mongoose = Mitigation/Avoidance/Minor Threat

For progression guilds pushing LK25HC Blood Draining is better purely to give you more Effective HP, but for everything else Mongoose is.

[braxx]

Also, for someone who says that people need to read all the pages, the last 2 or 3 pages of EJ even go on with the math behind Black Magic simming out really well.

---------- Post added 2010-09-04 at 08:55 PM ----------

Also, in the most recent few threads they mention how most people overvalue Mongoose because it still hasn't been updated in Rawr to reflect the 30 static haste that it was changed to, and still models it at 2% passive haste.

http://druid.wikispaces.com/ToskksDPSGearMethod

thats all i'm off now but dont forget agi=crit=more chances to get a free combo point, and go sim that on a fight like putricide. L2P

[kittyrawr]

what is the yellow crit cap? 104.8%, thats right

---------- Post added 2010-09-04 at 08:50 PM ----------



try Xodan from paragon.

also i'm in a top 150 guild but that doesn't add to anything to the op question.

Sure, yellow crit cap is huge, but we're not talking about yellow crit cap. Cats only really care about white crit cap, since 35% of our damage comes from whites. Past that, it's more or less a waste.

And I'm also in a top 100 guild, but that doesn't mean anything. I'm still bad at this game.

[Zibi]

How about you actually learn what enchants are used for before spouting bullshit, Blood Draining = Effective HP, Mongoose = Mitigation/Avoidance/Minor Threat

For progression guilds pushing LK25HC Blood Draining is better purely to give you more Effective HP, but for everything else Mongoose is.

Yes, progressiong guilds PUSHING LK25HC. Paragon isn't PUSHING LK25HC anymore, they've killed it without the buff even. There is no more progression for top guilds in this expansion.

[Mushy]

http://druid.wikispaces.com/ToskksDPSGearMethod

thats all i'm off now but dont forget agi=crit=more chances to get a free combo point, and go sim that on a fight like putricide. L2P

Christ, just shush.

Top 150 guild or not, you know very little about kitty weapon enchants.

[braxx]

Christ, just shush.

Top 150 guild or not, you know very little about kitty weapon enchants.

say hi:
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...Blade&cn=Xodan

[Mushy]

say hi:
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sh...Blade&cn=Xodan

Your point being what exactly ? I mean, if you're wanting to show us how well you can armoury top ferals then .. damn you're certainly good at that.

Seriously, what is your point ? Not all top 10 guild people have PERFECT gemming / enchants.

EDIT: Lol, running a quick sim is telling me he should get Black Magic on his polearm : >

[braxx]

Not all top 10 guild people have PERFECT gemming / enchants.

this druid has

[Cosima]

Braxx, you have made it very clear to all (most) of us that you pretty much don't know fuck all what you're talking about. Feel free to take your aura of shit-ness elsewhere.

To answer the question of the topic, what weapon enchant you should have depends a lot on your gear. Generally, when you become BiS / close to BiS geared, Black Magic will become the best, but untill then it can be anything from mongoose to berserking (even executioner, tho very rare)

Even tho spreadsheets such as RAWR ain't 100% accurate, they give you an idea about what's good and what's not. Download it and try!

[Zibi]

this druid has

Because you say so? or just because he's good? I could link that link of an Ensidia druid too, and you can say "they suck, this one's better" but I could say the same backwards. Sim it, and stop using opinion.

[Higgi]

Don't try to argue with fanboys.

[Zibi]

Don't try to argue with fanboys.

Good point, Cosima answered the thread, have a good one all.

[Shawaam]

I rawr'd Tun, and according to rawr in his gear, the enchants were Black Magic > Berserking > Mongoose.

[Deleted]

Please realize that the nerf to mongoose was much bigger than going from 2% to 1.1% haste; the haste on the old mongoose was classified as "physical haste" and multiplied with all your existing haste buffs. While the new mongoose has just a bit of haste rating.

Since it was discovered that Black Magic procs off shred and mangle, it's been the top enchant for ferals that are hit/exp/arpen capped, and crit softcapped. If you're not capped on 1 of these, or if you got a lot of haste, the value of BM goes down and the value of berserking up.

This is supported by all major sims: rawr, simulationcraft and toskks, as well as EJ.

If you say "mongoose > all" then you better bring some numbers to back that up, as that has not been true since the nerf.

This is how it looks in my bis gear according to rawr:

[Shifthappens]

1: i will not take mongoose simply because of its patheticly low proc rate
2: it was nerfed
3: when u crit capped its almost useless
4: berserking is almost up all the time in raid for me and its far better then mongoose when ARP capped

im almost full 277, but damn i never knew Black magic procs for ferals, i have to try it now, unless ppl r joking.

[axxey]

It procs, Scourgebane is also very nice in ICC, i have 1 distant land with BM, one with scourgebane, one of these days LK will cough up his damn oathbinder instead of stupid bows and daggers.

[Legendary_Zer0]

if you are core raiding go with Black Magic currently it procs off Shred/Mangle/Rake and FF possibly Roar and it has been a dps increase for sure. Mongoose is decent for kitty if your only using one weapon for both bear and cat, cause BM only procs off Frenzied Regen and FF in Bear

those are my 2 cents and u can also ask Tossk or Toskk w/e his name is

[Sidonis]

It procs, Scourgebane is also very nice in ICC, i have 1 distant land with BM, one with scourgebane, one of these days LK will cough up his damn oathbinder instead of stupid bows and daggers.

Was hoping someone would mention Scourgebane.

If you can get a 2nd weapon to use ONLY in ICC, and you aren't stat capped enough to use Black Magic, put Scourgebane on it. Someone would have to sim it to verify, but a static 140 AP (versus undead) should be better than berserking, considering how close in value Berserking and Massacre (110 AP) are, and it may even give Black Magic a run for it's money considering static vs. proc.

[Dedweight]

Sorry but this is simply not true, before the nerf moongoose.

Honest question but when did this "nerf" happen? I know it doesn't give the 2% haste it did back in TBC but as far as we know the enchant could have always had a 30 haste rating(2% haste) even back in TBC seeing as there hasn't been any patch notes(none that I've seen anyway) mentioning a change to the enchant.

On topic though I think it's more dependent on your other stats, if Mongoose aids you in getting crit capped i see no reason not to use it, if it puts you significantly over the crit cap you should definitely use Berserking.

[Sidonis]

Honest question but when did this "nerf" happen? I know it doesn't give the 2% haste it did back in TBC but as far as we know the enchant could have always had a 30 haste rating(2% haste) even back in TBC seeing as there hasn't been any patch notes(none that I've seen anyway) mentioning a change to the enchant.

On topic though I think it's more dependent on your other stats, if Mongoose aids you in getting crit capped i see no reason not to use it, if it puts you significantly over the crit cap you should definitely use Berserking.

That's just it though, we do know it was originally just 2% haste, not rating, from hours of testing both live and simmed. It was never haste rating in TBC, why do you think people knew it was multiplicative instead of just being addditive? I forget exactly when it was changed, but making it 30 haste rating let it still be 2% haste for a lvl 70, but not as valuable to a lvl 80, which is the entire reason behind the combat rating system in the first place, to force upgrades to newer items/enchants.