1. #1

    [Elem] "Too much" haste!

    Greetings, fellow lightning spewers.


    I've recently exchanged my good old Muradin's Spyglass for the Charred Twilight Scale, which brings me to 1283 haste rating unbuffed. My LB are below 1s under BL, so I'm switching pieces in order to gain more crit.
    Looking on Finnober's armory, I see he uses T10 pants with the gunship gloves. Having the T10 264 pants, I switched my Plaguebringer's Stained Pants with my T10 264 pants, and put the heroic Gunship 25 gloves.
    I also switched an haste/hit ring for a haste/crit (as gloves+pants provides more hit), yet I'm still around 1220 haste rating with 3620-3750spell and 850-950crit.


    That brings me my question: wouldn't it be worth with such sky high values that the Totem of Hex would be more interesting as crit becomes more and more valuable (just watch where Finnober stands on WoL, I admit he can have ToTT or Hysteria to get as high as 20k dps on Saurfang HM, but still!) with high stuff than the Totem of shattered ice?

    This is mostly a question threw to the air, but I wouldn't mind having some advices or ideas concerning this point other than just "get more crit on your stuff, and get Phylactery on sindra HM".

  2. #2
    Having exact same problem myself. For me the answer was changing all reckless ametrines to pure spellpower ones. Also i do not like the Halion 25 trinket with all that haste, so you should do what you suggested yourself, get the Phylactery instead of Charred Twillight scale and then Object trinket 277 version.
    The leg/hands problem, i use the legs myself and i dont think theres any significant difference between using those and using the hands. Dont forget that you also have the mail shoulders to go for and then having hands and legs tier pieces... Gogo test.
    Oh yea and hysteria in elemental related thread? huh

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Amana View Post
    That brings me my question: wouldn't it be worth with such sky high values that the Totem of Hex would be more interesting as crit becomes more and more valuable (just watch where Finnober stands on WoL, I admit he can have ToTT or Hysteria to get as high as 20k dps on Saurfang HM, but still!) with high stuff than the Totem of shattered ice?
    Short answer, no. Long answer, Haste values will always outweigh crit values until somewhere around 1994 haste (100% with all relevent buffs). Reson being is that since LB is such a high percentage of our DPS, and we will never GCD cap it out of BL or EM & Engineering gloves/Berserking used together, that every point of haste still out values crit. Now, if you were to drop haste for SP, thats another story, but for crit, nope, not worth it. Also, haste will make FS DPS rise as well.

  4. #4
    Stood in the Fire Trivial's Avatar
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    Indeed, your mistake was taking into consideration about 5% to 10% of the fight, which is when your under the effects of Bloodlust.

    Now, for the rest of the fight, the more LBs you can shoot between each LvB, the better. And they won't be capped unless you've got a lot of haste. That's what also makes Shattered Ice better than Totem of Hex. 220 haste for everything (including Flame Shock) is a lot better than 165 spellpower for just LB (and CL, but that should be a tiny part of your damage anyway).

  5. #5
    Hmm our shaman has 1365 haste and managed to get 19.7k on saurfang, he's using the haste stacking totem as well according to armory, if that means anything, I have no idea about ele's !
    Last edited by Mudkiper; 2010-09-06 at 12:54 AM.

  6. #6
    i have 1636 haste with my relic stacked, and with that much haste my base LB cast is 1.27 secs

    with my macro that has elemental mastery + engineer gloves my LB cast is 1.03

    with bloodlust my LB cast is 0.977 seconds

    i know i wouldn't have a problem with going under 1 sec if i picked the heroic phylactery instead, but i hate how my LB casts line up with my LVB timer, so i picked the regular charred twilight scale to change that a little bit

    the difference between the reg charred scale and the heroic phylactery isn't much, the phylactery is just a head by a little, but the heroic charred scale is way ahead of the heroic phylact

    bis is heroic charred and heroic dfo, so obviously more haste is not a bad idea

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by JuicedawgYO View Post
    Oh yea and hysteria in elemental related thread? huh
    Let's say it's a running joke when talking about "how to top meters"
    Thanks for all your answers, I think I'm aiming the wrong way to improve my dps.

  8. #8
    Just remember that haste always increases your dps for 2 reasons:

    Damage Per Second Per Cast (DPS/C). Even though your casts may go under 1.0 seconds you're still increasing the DPS they're doing as they're still going out faster (although with the GCD you can't recast within this time).

    Also remember that flameshock will tick faster (as the time is shortened but the amount of ticks remain the same).

    The trick is to pop as many CDs as you can at the same time, without going under (or too far under) 1 second casts.

    E.g. Just use heroism if your LB's are under 1 second, however use Elemental Mastery + Engineering gloves (for example) if your casts don't reach under 1 seconds (but remember that you ideally don't want them to go too far).

    Quote Originally Posted by Sterkrazzy
    with my macro that has elemental mastery + engineer gloves my LB cast is 1.03

    with bloodlust my LB cast is 0.977 seconds
    ^ Just like this.
    Computer: Intel I7-3770k @ 4.5GHz | 16GB 1600MHz DDR3 RAM | AMD 7970 GHz @ 1200/1600 | ASUS Z77-V PRO Mobo|

  9. #9
    According to my SimC. calculations it'll always be better to stack haste>crit.. the only reason I'm not @ 1400++ haste is, that Halion trinket/bracers with haste won't drop.. ( for long fights )

    If you really want to improve your dps try out the following points:

    1. aim for 100% active time during every bossfight.. there's no point in doing nothing at any time.
    2. motivate your guild to get faster Bosskills.. the combattime influences your dps the most.
    3. Cleave if you can.. really do it^^
    4. Use your fire elemental and get a demolock.


    and btw.. I never got ToTT/Pi/FM or anything like that( Since one or two month we skipped uploading on Wol and focussed on WMO )^^
    Last edited by Finnober; 2010-09-07 at 02:28 AM.

  10. #10
    Great, thanks a lot for answers, yet I already am among top3 at activity, and we always have a demolock (switching between glyph of Lava and Fire elem depending on fights).

    I'll stick with my sky-rocket haste values then.

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