Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst
1
2
  1. #21
    Pandaren Monk Yosef1015's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    The Freljord
    Posts
    1,936
    right, they should get rid of inner rage and add another new button to press!

  2. #22
    Scarab Lord Master Guns's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    4,584
    Quote Originally Posted by Pearson View Post
    If you feel overwhelmed then your probally not keybinding efficiently enough. Or you only have a two buttoned mouse.

    I like the variety. It's a nice cooldown in my opinion; you have to put some thought into when you use it or you will get punished with rage starvation.
    Lol, raiding fury warriors requires keybinds to raid effectively? did I miss that memo?
    3 buttons to push =srsly tuf
    I'm sorry but anyone who says Warriors require keybinds to raid is just a fucking baddy. Warriors are probably the easiest and simplistic class in this entire game. I can fit all of my crucial raiding abilities on 1 bar. That's tuf.
    Last edited by Master Guns; 2010-09-21 at 02:39 AM.

    Check out the directors cut of my project SCHISM, a festival winning short film
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiHNTS-vyHE

  3. #23
    Mechagnome MildCore's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Not America
    Posts
    558
    Playing a fury warrior is beginning to feel a lot like playing an enhancement shaman -_-... Minus the ability to heal.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by epard View Post
    You think warriors have too many buttons to press try some of the harder specs and then see if you still think you have too many buttons also(i havent kept up with beta warriors)isnt the rage normalization making it harder to hit rage cap?
    "Hard" specs? If any spec is hard it would be either an enhancement shaman or kitty druid. All the rest are your pretty basic 3-4 button rotations/priority abilities. As for rage normalization, they haven't fixed anything they have just broke it. Rage was perfectly fine this whole xpac. It's pretty awesome tanking on beta where you barely have enough rage to even get enough threat.

    ---------- Post added 2010-09-20 at 10:42 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    Lol, raiding fury warriors requires keybinds to raid effectively? did I miss that memo?
    3 buttons to push =srsly tuf
    I'm sorry but anyone who says Warriors require keybinds to raid is just a fucking baddy. Warriors are probably the easiest and simplistic class in this entire game. I can fit all of my crucial raiding abilities on 1 bar. That's tuf.
    So can mages and rogues...almost every class uses only 4 spells in any particular fight.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    Lol, raiding fury warriors requires keybinds to raid effectively? did I miss that memo?
    3 buttons to push =srsly tuf
    I'm sorry but anyone who says Warriors require keybinds to raid is just a fucking baddy. Warriors are probably the easiest and simplistic class in this entire game. I can fit all of my crucial raiding abilities on 1 bar. That's tuf.
    Change your avatar back to the old one =x
    No world! You put YOUR hands up!

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Drefanator View Post
    You shouldn't have to buy accessories to play a class effectively. Keybinding, sure, but spending $40+ just so I can play a warrior? That's bad class design. No class should be that complicated that you need to use anything but the default layout to play the class.

    Macro's, keybinds etc. will help, and possibly make the class trivial, but they shouldn't be necessary to play a class effectively. (read: well enough, but not to maximum potential)
    Have you seen the new(old) Rune UI?

    If IR is off the gcd, it most likely won't be that hard. If you are complaining it will be too 'hard' to use properly, then you really need to just L2P.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shampayne1985 View Post
    "Hard" specs? If any spec is hard it would be either an enhancement shaman or kitty druid. All the rest are your pretty basic 3-4 button rotations/priority abilities. As for rage normalization, they haven't fixed anything they have just broke it. Rage was perfectly fine this whole xpac. It's pretty awesome tanking on beta where you barely have enough rage to even get enough threat.
    I would much prefer Rage to the new Rune system for tanking.

    So can mages and rogues...almost every class uses only 4 spells in any particular fight.
    Should I just start listing all the buttons I press every fight?
    Last edited by Foibles; 2010-09-21 at 03:41 AM.

    [11:50:45] Earthmender Duarn says: Shamanistic healing is a complex art. You can't just chain heal all day.

  7. #27
    Scarab Lord Master Guns's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    4,584
    Quote Originally Posted by Electromatt View Post
    Change your avatar back to the old one =x
    But I got oh so much hate mail for it. XD

    Check out the directors cut of my project SCHISM, a festival winning short film
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiHNTS-vyHE

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    But I got oh so much hate mail for it. XD
    lame.
    I guess zombieboxxy is ok...
    No world! You put YOUR hands up!

  9. #29
    Elemental Lord
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Wales, UK
    Posts
    8,527
    Quote Originally Posted by epard View Post
    You think warriors have too many buttons to press try some of the harder specs and then see if you still think you have too many buttons also(i havent kept up with beta warriors)isnt the rage normalization making it harder to hit rage cap?
    You do know that Arms PVE is the hardest spec to play (well), or at least tied with kitty/enhance, yeah?

  10. #30
    Herald of the Titans Tuvok's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    West Sussex, England.
    Posts
    2,708
    I don't see the point in it. With heroic strike, rage changes etc, I can't see us ever being able to use it for a benefit more than once in a blue moon. Strike is hardly an interesting ability, a weak boring attack, heroic leap is fine, but Inner rage just seems like a pointless waste of space to me.

    Replace it with something else imo, no doubt there are plenty of things that could be done.

    ---------- Post added 2010-09-21 at 01:11 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    You do know that Arms PVE is the hardest spec to play (well), or at least tied with kitty/enhance, yeah?
    There really is no reason to speak with people talking about classes being hard to play, as no class is hard to play. If he finds it hard after a month at max level, he's bad at the class, simple as that.
    "The truth, my goal."

  11. #31
    Scarab Lord Master Guns's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    California
    Posts
    4,584
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    You do know that Arms PVE is the hardest spec to play (well), or at least tied with kitty/enhance, yeah?
    That's funny, because I played Arms PVE in Ulduar (when Ulduar was what was important) and pulled 6k+ DPS on non gimmick boss fights such as General, and I didn't have a single damned keybind or macro that actually had anything to do with Arms. And please don't say "OMG 6K DPS LOLWUT FAILURE", 6k in Ulduar was pretty damned decent on non gimmick fights. I'm not talking Hodir, Freya, Yogg, where either adds or damage increase gimmicks were in effect. I'm talking single target asskicking.
    You don't need them. It's not hard. Pushing buttons is not fucking mind blowing people. You just push them.

    Check out the directors cut of my project SCHISM, a festival winning short film
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiHNTS-vyHE

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    That's funny, because I played Arms PVE in Ulduar (when Ulduar was what was important) and pulled 6k+ DPS on non gimmick boss fights such as General, and I didn't have a single damned keybind or macro that actually had anything to do with Arms. And please don't say "OMG 6K DPS LOLWUT FAILURE", 6k in Ulduar was pretty damned decent on non gimmick fights. I'm not talking Hodir, Freya, Yogg, where either adds or damage increase gimmicks were in effect. I'm talking single target asskicking.
    You don't need them. It's not hard. Pushing buttons is not fucking mind blowing people. You just pushthem.
    I agree, Arms isnt hard, really.

    I would like to say more, but Master Guns your avatar scares the shit outta of fix, i cant get my eyes off it ! Leave Broxxy alone !

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Tuvok View Post
    There really is no reason to speak with people talking about classes being hard to play, as no class is hard to play. If he finds it hard after a month at max level, he's bad at the class, simple as that.
    I hear ret is hard now, like a 3 year old trying to solve a rubix cube instead of stacking blocks hard.


    and Im talking about a 1x1x1 cube, not a 3x3x3.
    Last edited by Electromatt; 2010-09-22 at 08:47 AM.
    No world! You put YOUR hands up!

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Snes View Post
    Might use it for burst in AoE or PvP but that's it.
    So you'd rather be raged capped and doing less damage?

  15. #35
    Sorry, I am not familiar with warriors. I have leveled 9 classes to 80, and I am saving warrior for cataclysm. I am going to try to make a hard shift from altohalic to having only one main, so I am starting to take an interest in future issues with warriors.

    That said, if i recall correctly inner rage used to activate when you hit the rage cap, and would deactivate when you went below a certain amount of rage. That seemed nice, to function to burn off excess rage but leave you with rage to use abilities. However, I can understand why some players would prefer the choice to control when the ability activates. So now, Inner Rage is an on use ability, and it increases the Rage costs of abilities you use while active. Now warriors are disliking the concept of Inner Rage causing them to be Rage starved, and therefore being a DPS loss because warriors can not use their abilities. Why can't warriors just macro into one of their abilities a /cancelaura Inner Rage?

    Hypothetically, a warrior should be paying attention to their Rage pool while fighting, in much the same way a Mana user has to pay attention to their Mana. It seems a simple solution to simply macro into Heroic Strike /cancelaura Inner Rage, and to use that ability when your rage falls below for example 50. Then the Heroic Strike will fly with the bonus damage, with /cancelaura Inner Rage after the line in the macro for /cast Heroic Strike. Afterward you are left with your normal Rage costs and will be able to use your abilities as normal.

    Are there any errors in my theory?

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Nira View Post

    Are there any errors in my theory?
    Nope. Just kinda over excessive the original point of this topic :]!

    I'm not on the beta, so i'm not super positive about just how much there is too watch now, but it just seems too much. Especially for arms, There already is an insane amount of procs/cd's to use for arms now, tacking on another rage niche seems, kinda dumb if it's not passive.
    Last edited by krowd1; 2010-09-22 at 05:23 PM.

  17. #37
    Bloodsail Admiral Samyaaza's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Same country as Radek Zelenka
    Posts
    1,181
    Quote Originally Posted by Shampayne1985 View Post
    "Hard" specs? If any spec is hard it would be either an enhancement shaman or kitty druid. All the rest are your pretty basic 3-4 button rotations/priority abilities. As for rage normalization, they haven't fixed anything they have just broke it. Rage was perfectly fine this whole xpac. It's pretty awesome tanking on beta where you barely have enough rage to even get enough threat.

    ---------- Post added 2010-09-20 at 10:42 PM ----------



    So can mages and rogues...almost every class uses only 4 spells in any particular fight.
    Yay, really can't wait to see that. Now I don't have to wait to over gear a stupid 5 man heroic for not having enough rage because of avoidance, now I won't have enough rage from beginning, I am sure that warriors are fine though.

    "Dude, why are you dead again?" "Because I'm raid-leading, doh..."
    Mess with the best, die like the rest...
    >>>Goes by name Samyaza<<<

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Mortisia View Post
    Yay, really can't wait to see that. Now I don't have to wait to over gear a stupid 5 man heroic for not having enough rage because of avoidance, now I won't have enough rage from beginning, I am sure that warriors are fine though.
    It's like rubbing salt in the wound eh?
    I'm sure warriors will be fine by the end of cata......amirite?
    No world! You put YOUR hands up!

  19. #39
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Nira View Post
    ...Why can't warriors just macro into one of their abilities a /cancelaura Inner Rage?

    Hypothetically, a warrior should be paying attention to their Rage pool while fighting, in much the same way a Mana user has to pay attention to their Mana. It seems a simple solution to simply macro into Heroic Strike /cancelaura Inner Rage, and to use that ability when your rage falls below for example 50. Then the Heroic Strike will fly with the bonus damage, with /cancelaura Inner Rage after the line in the macro for /cast Heroic Strike. Afterward you are left with your normal Rage costs and will be able to use your abilities as normal.

    Are there any errors in my theory?
    If warriors macro this ability into say, Heroic Strike, they will most certainly not be at what is considered "max efficient". Say you have 50 rage and your next attack is a heroic strike, then using it as you have suggested would basically instantly negate the effect. Also I am not in Beta or anything but as many people have reported so far heroic strike seems to be something that is currently used more often than blizzard may perhaps want it to be. Either way, imo this is something that will not be best used in a macro, but something to click on its own (situational).

    Regarding the mana pool and rage bar comparison, I must strongly disagree with you there. Mana users know that for example they have 80% mana and that it is slowly decreasing. Or even if they receive innervate or something they can estimate how much mana they will have afterwards, fluctuations will never be as strong. Rage bars can permanently spike up and down. The income or depletion is not as simplistic to foresee as it may perhaps be for a mana user.

    Regarding the actual topic, I believe blizzard has no choice but to make inner rage an activateable effect. Why so? Well, their original idea states that they dont want it to be either useless (punishing warriors that hit maximum rage) or mandatory. Say it was really worth it with the initial 50%dmg increase for 15% more cost (other way around now, I know). So it would force every warrior to permanently have it activated. This means that it would stop being situational but would become a "must have" ability that every warrior "must use" leading to every fight starting with the warrior auto attacking until he has 100 rage. This from my knowledge is something that blizzard does not want. So they have little choice really. The easiest way for them to negate that is by making it activateable. Personally I dont think that the numbers currently make it desireable in most situations, yet I do have faith that blizzard will try to balance it so it can be used in more than 1/20 occassions.

    Regarding the people who qq about warriors qqing how simplistic arms is and how with practice everything becomes simple, well yes that is an obvious statement. Yet, when we compare to what may perhaps be neccessary in comparison to what other specs/classes may need to do, it may be considered "less easy" if you wish to put it that way. Most classes can get away with pressing 2-4 buttons. It doesnt mean it is optimal or anything. Personally everyone should play what they enjoy and if a class is too "difficult" to play they should just pick a different one. If people complain that warriors have too many buttons to press, if blizzard then agreed, what would happen? People would complain that they have too few buttons to press. The only important thing imo is that the effort people put into e.g. pve shoudnt require 1000x more work than what someone else can do with 2 buttons half afk watching TV and still e.g. end up doing more dps/healing or whatever.

    Oh and for referrence, I have played Arms since classic and been forced to go Fury for wotlk because arms is just no way close enough dpswise (PVE). I am actually looking forward to arms changes hoping that it will be somewhat viable for pve again.

    And regarding the rotation, say you press rend, overpower, MS, CS and Slam in between. Thats 5 buttons. Below 20% you add execute. Thats 6. Theoretically to dump rage you have HS (how incite etc works in the end and if it will be part of the rotation is something we will see later imo, and not as of yet - tbh I think we will still see a couple of changes). Rend however is only used every 15 seconds or whatever, forgot it now. Thats about as complex as it gets. Its not in order of importance now, please dont take me apart for that ^^ In between you may add shouts, or cleave or press SS. So the prioritized buttons one has to press will still only be at around 3-4 with the others ending up as fillers or just lower on the priority list. The situational components of CS and perhaps even OP (despite it being predictable) have been made more simplistic by blizzard through adding a built in power auras (not saying this will replace power auras) but even blizzard saw the need of such a mechanic. So if "large icon pops press 7 (or whatever is bound wherever)" should be manageable Sure, one may argue that warriors can press many buttons, or even "have to", but if we had less to press, as stated above, people would just complain again.

    Personally my suggestion would be to make IR slightly more desireable, especially if it is an activateable effect. And if for example Recklessness and DW are taken off the GCD, then imo warriors should not complain about this aspect of having too many buttons to press. In fact, they should enjoy the fact they have so many opportunities. If all remains on a GCD it would complicate things, then again blizzard has discussed that it would make sense to remove the GCD on those effects, not sure if this has happened in beta yet.

    The only thing we may perhaps complain about now is that some of our promised skills are being removed again and so far we have received nothing else as a compensation (whereas other classes are perhaps receiving more new "skills and fun talents" --> gushing wounds, Heroic Leap having been changed) yet, this is again another topic. I hope and as mentioned previously actually have faith that blizzard will still adress many of these issues (the question is just when).
    Last edited by mmoc068958febb; 2010-09-23 at 02:11 PM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •