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  1. #41
    Brewmaster Bassch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enderfish View Post
    Does this even matter? Isn't ArP being taken out in 4.0? Which I'm guessing will be released on this Tuesday or the following one? I admit I don't know for sure what those ArP gems will turn into, but I think it might be haste.
    ARP goes to Mastery and wut? Patch this week? Or am I just being slow and missing news/misunderstanding? O.o

    On topic, keep hit cap, get a +10 stats gem for your meta, and keep every gem possible ARP

  2. #42
    Fluffy Kitten ASO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bassch View Post
    ARP goes to Mastery and wut? Patch this week? Or am I just being slow and missing news/misunderstanding? O.o

    On topic, keep hit cap, get a +10 stats gem for your meta, and keep every gem possible ARP
    Arp gems turn into crit gems. Arp on gear turns into haste.

    Unless they totally changed it yet again...


    Also 4.0 is a while off. Don't expect it before October.



    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    My goal right now is to see if it's resonable to get Steady Shot down to a 1sec cast time to match the GCD or at least 1sec cast time with Bloodlust active. We will be able to pepper targets with our Arcane Shots cause we'll have so much Focus.
    What in the name of holy fuck are you on about? GCD is 1.5s for hunters. SS is a 2.0 cast time in 4.0. I don't think anyones given a definite answer as to if haste is reducing our GCD as of yet, but it's impossible to hit 1.0 gcd even gemmed, enchanted, and wearing all haste gear. Not to mention that you'd need an impossible amount of haste to increase our Focus regen to be infinite-spammed Arcane Shots (and that easily could be a terrible thing, as they'd be hitting for so low).
    Last edited by ASO; 2010-09-21 at 04:11 PM.
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  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by chelate View Post
    . Not to mention that you'd need an impossible amount of haste to increase our Focus regen to be infinite-spammed Arcane Shots (and that easily could be a terrible thing, as they'd be hitting for so low).
    But it might be fun for a few minutes right?!

  4. #44
    If you gem straight ArP with only 780ArP passive you will fall far short of the cap and on most fights will see a dps loss as compared to gemming for agility. Even with hard cap ArP, you will probably see a dps loss unless you are very good at managing your movement so you hardly miss an autoshot.

    Also in a week or so ArP will be out of the game and you will have wasted 10-20 gems that will now be crit gems that must be replaced.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by chelate View Post
    Arp gems turn into crit gems. Arp on gear turns into haste.

    Unless they totally changed it yet again...


    Also 4.0 is a while off. Don't expect it before October.





    What in the name of holy fuck are you on about? GCD is 1.5s for hunters. SS is a 2.0 cast time in 4.0. I don't think anyones given a definite answer as to if haste is reducing our GCD as of yet, but it's impossible to hit 1.0 gcd even gemmed, enchanted, and wearing all haste gear. Not to mention that you'd need an impossible amount of haste to increase our Focus regen to be infinite-spammed Arcane Shots (and that easily could be a terrible thing, as they'd be hitting for so low).
    I ran that code you provided on PTR because I don't have access to my beta machine for a while, and GCD is 1.5 with haste reducing GCD. Steady bar / timer was matching circular timer exactly from 0 haste up to my crazy haste + procs which only brings me to 1.1 steady.

    Glyph of Rapid Fire + Rapid Fire + Focus Fire + Improved Tracking

    Herkuml + Distant Land + Sanc Pants + Anubar Stalker Gloves = 415 base haste

  6. #46
    Fluffy Kitten ASO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frott View Post
    I ran that code you provided on PTR because I don't have access to my beta machine for a while, and GCD is 1.5 with haste reducing GCD. Steady bar / timer was matching circular timer exactly from 0 haste up to my crazy haste + procs which only brings me to 1.1 steady.

    Glyph of Rapid Fire + Rapid Fire + Focus Fire + Improved Tracking

    Herkuml + Distant Land + Sanc Pants + Anubar Stalker Gloves = 415 base haste

    I'm sorry but I think you need to rephrase your post (that or I'm dumb...dumb as hell). You're saying GCD is 1.5s base on PTR, and haste is reducing it as reported by my little code and mods?
    "WoW is a game about upgrading your stuff." - Ghostcrawler

    Quote Originally Posted by Cilraaz
    anachronistic hypocrites
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  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by chelate View Post
    I'm sorry but I think you need to rephrase your post (that or I'm dumb...dumb as hell). You're saying GCD is 1.5s base on PTR, and haste is reducing it as reported by my little code and mods?
    I was under the assumption that the GCD for hunters is 1.5 on live, and is getting lowered to 1.0 in cataclysm.

  8. #48
    Fluffy Kitten ASO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhryke View Post
    I was under the assumption that the GCD for hunters is 1.5 on live, and is getting lowered to 1.0 in cataclysm.
    Where are you getting this info? It definitely feels faster on the beta (stupid char copy system lost my PTR hunter copy to the mists of time) but I haven't had time to run that little script, nor have I seen a blue saying "yes, it's 1.0". I would assume that if it is in fact feeling faster, then it's haste reduced.

    I need facts, though.
    "WoW is a game about upgrading your stuff." - Ghostcrawler

    Quote Originally Posted by Cilraaz
    anachronistic hypocrites
    Oh noes! We're time traveling hypocrites!

  9. #49
    GCD on PTR is down to 1sec and Steady Shot is only a 2sec cast time BEFORE any Haste is taken into account. I didn't notice that the GCD had been reduced at first so I got back on the PTR yesterday and looked and sure enough it's down to 1sec. With Haste talents, a few Agi/Haste gems for slot bonuses and some Crit reforged into Haste my Steady Shot is at a 1.48sec Cast time in Marks and a 1.23sec cast time in Surv. So it's only a 2sec cast time before you start using talents and gems to bring it down. I do not know if it's the Haste that's lowering the GCD or if it just got lowered in general since I didn't test it until after I put in my talents, gems and reforged. But with all that it is down to a 1sec GCD.

    I am not giving up any siginificant Crit using Agi/Haste gems instead of Agi/Crit or by reforging some Crit into Haste. All together I am up to a little over 1000 Haste but still have 65% Crit and that's before any Trinket procs like DBW and with out any raid buffs. With 65% crit I'll easily hit +100% with buffs and procs so Haste has some good DPS value.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    Then you were hit capped with out using Focused Aim for 3% hit. Since that talent was removed anyone who had been using it to be hit capped lost that hit. I did end up with more from gear, an extra 0.63% but since I lost 3% from the +Hit talent I ended up with less. Sounds like u used Mastery for the BM buff, which is good with how insanely OP pets are right now. On the PvE Test Realm there is a go who got as much Mastery as possible and it nearly insta-killing anyone he duels with Beastial Wrath + Kill Command. His wold, and not even an exoctic one, was critting for over 39k, and that's after the KC nerf. He wouldn't have shoot at the ppl and his pet would have them dead in about 3 seconds. Now this was against a mix of ppl in PvE and PvP ger and the Hunter himself was in 232-251 lvl PvE gear.

    My goal right now is to see if it's resonable to get Steady Shot down to a 1sec cast time to match the GCD or at least 1sec cast time with Bloodlust active. We will be able to pepper targets with our Arcane Shots cause we'll have so much Focus. The extra regen fromt he Haste it's self and from getting off more and more Steady Shots. Can't truly compare numbers until we see top lvl talents and Cata gear with Mastery all ready on it. Blizz has already said they are finding some ppl are stacking Mastery about all other stats and they do not want that. They don't want on stat being the "good stat" while everything is ignored as junk. That's what happened with ArP and they don't want it to happen again. The nice thing is they can easily tweak Mastery % bonuses when ever they want when they see one is becoming too powerful or when one is not powerful enough. "BM is doing too high of damage with their pets cause they stack mastery, ok so reduce the % bonus damage from 5% for every 100 points of Mastery down to 5% for every 250 points of Mastery, OP issue fixed."
    I definitely wasn't thinking of the loss of Focused Aim, my bad. I've got enough hit on gear that I wouldn't have it even if I was MM on live (presumably, as I suppose some gear choices might be different if I could get the hit through talents), so it never crossed my mind that was the issue. If I wasn't clear regarding mastery, I was trying to indicate that it's a worthwhile stat now if the spec's mastery bonus is good. On paper, I don't think MM's looks very good (though I haven't tested it to see what sort of damage it's actually doing), so that's why I specifically mentioned BM and SV.

    I do agree that the final weight on stat importance has not been discovered yet. I was referring specifically to what stuff looks like at 80 for 4.0. Heck, I'm not convinced that BM's mastery is going to be worthwhile in the long run because of their stated design goal of keeping pets to 20-30% of a hunter's damage. If they nerf mastery to a point to keep BM within that range, I think it's quite likely that crit is going to be a lot more desirable for the spec (more shots and pet attacks hit harder and grant each other focus, allowing even more shots to be fired). I don't have any math to back that up, but logically, limiting the pet's damage and having pet damage increased by a lot seem pretty mutually exclusive.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Organoth View Post
    GCD on PTR is down to 1sec and Steady Shot is only a 2sec cast time BEFORE any Haste is taken into account. I didn't notice that the GCD had been reduced at first so I got back on the PTR yesterday and looked and sure enough it's down to 1sec. With Haste talents, a few Agi/Haste gems for slot bonuses and some Crit reforged into Haste my Steady Shot is at a 1.48sec Cast time in Marks and a 1.23sec cast time in Surv. So it's only a 2sec cast time before you start using talents and gems to bring it down. I do not know if it's the Haste that's lowering the GCD or if it just got lowered in general since I didn't test it until after I put in my talents, gems and reforged. But with all that it is down to a 1sec GCD.

    I am not giving up any siginificant Crit using Agi/Haste gems instead of Agi/Crit or by reforging some Crit into Haste. All together I am up to a little over 1000 Haste but still have 65% Crit and that's before any Trinket procs like DBW and with out any raid buffs. With 65% crit I'll easily hit +100% with buffs and procs so Haste has some good DPS value.
    I can confirm this. Patch 4.0.1 is reducing our GCD to 1 second, and it's still unaffected by haste as far as I can tell. Best evidence I have is that a level 80 in full icc gear with a boatload of haste has the same 1 second GCD as a level 1 hunter naked. Tested it myself.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post
    I can confirm this. Patch 4.0.1 is reducing our GCD to 1 second, and it's still unaffected by haste as far as I can tell. Best evidence I have is that a level 80 in full icc gear with a boatload of haste has the same 1 second GCD as a level 1 hunter naked. Tested it myself.
    Well that's good to know since Haste affecting the GCD would make Haste worth too much. Sitting around a 1000 haste I've been getting really good Focus regen. In Marksman I'm getting in about 5-6 Steady Shots and 5-6 Arcane Shots inbetween each Chimera, except during Master Marksman procs that allow for Aimed Shot and Kill Command to be used.

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