Justice + Valor Vendors

[Yooya]

How much JP are the the blues? Is what I am most curious in.

[Nekosom]

I admit, my stomach turned when I found out you could buy all the tier gear from valor points. God I hope that isn't final, because that would mean by 4.1 you will have no need to run previous tiers of raiding.

[mezmir]

I admit, my stomach turned when I found out you could buy all the tier gear from valor points. God I hope that isn't final, because that would mean by 4.1 you will have no need to run previous tiers of raiding.

Wait why are you trippin balls? We have 0 valor points until we raid at 85. Justice points are what we get from heroics and shiz.

[Yooya]

I admit, my stomach turned when I found out you could buy all the tier gear from valor points. God I hope that isn't final, because that would mean by 4.1 you will have no need to run previous tiers of raiding.

I think they plan to make VP transfer to JP upon a major patch. Then transfer lets say T11 to JP and make T12 VP. If you see what I mean. Or maybe they will release a new type of point for each raiding tier like in Wrath?

[Alvito]

Boy oh boy am I a sad panda that I just bought 12 saronite with frost badges. I did make just over 6k gold but damn the points towards lvl 85 gear is worth so much more. After reading a few threads on her and talking to beta players I foolishly believed and hoped they wouldnt let me gear for 85 with running things at 80. The real pisser is the boa bracers I got for a new 80 toon thats 60 badges right there times two specs. F@CK.......ok QQ session over.

[Nekosom]

Wait why are you trippin balls? We have 0 valor points until we raid at 85. Justice points are what we get from heroics and shiz.

Yes and when the next tier of raiding comes out, all items that were available for valor points will be available for justice points, meaning T11 will only require heroics after 4.1. Also, if Blizzard is sticking with their original plan, daily heroics will also reward valor points once a day, meaning many won't even require that long. It's just a bad system, and I'd hoped Blizzard had grown beyond it.

I think they plan to make VP transfer to JP upon a major patch. Then transfer lets say T11 to JP and make T12 VP. If you see what I mean. Or maybe they will release a new type of point for each raiding tier like in Wrath?

Exactly. It's the same as the previous system, meaning like Tier 9 today, Tier 11 will not require players to go through Tier 11 content to get the gear.

[mezmir]

You only get a certain amount on a daily basis, theres a weekly cap, and at the point when t11 becomes available for valor points what rewards valor points will probably have changed. By that point you wont care. It's the same as how at first tier 9 was hard to get, then eventually it was easy to get but at that point people were too worried about tier 10 to give a crap. It happens, it's progression. New instances&raids lead to old loot being obsolete anyway.

[Cowt]

How much JP are the the blues? Is what I am most curious in.

This.

Anyone kind enough to sit down and list the price for all of the Justice Points (blue) rewards, for us without access?

I'd love to be able to plan ahead!

[Deleted]

It happens, it's progression. New instances&raids lead to old loot being obsolete anyway.

Getting a new tier without even do the previous contents is not progression.

[Nekosom]

You only get a certain amount on a daily basis, theres a weekly cap, and at the point when t11 becomes available for valor points what rewards valor points will probably have changed. By that point you wont care. It's the same as how at first tier 9 was hard to get, then eventually it was easy to get but at that point people were too worried about tier 10 to give a crap. It happens, it's progression. New instances&raids lead to old loot being obsolete anyway.

Except you're wrong. Old loot didn't used to be obsolete, it used to be a prerequisite for doing newer content. You would start with regular dungeons, move your way up to heroic, then to the first tier of raiding, and so on and so forth. With this system, you need only be able to do heroics, then skip to the latest tier. This will lead to the EXACT same problem we have today. Old raids being entirely abandoned, even if a guild never cleared it in the first place. Then you get situations where only the newest tier or raiding is relevant and people get bored with it VERY quickly.

---------- Post added 2010-09-27 at 08:18 AM ----------

Or maybe they will release a new type of point for each raiding tier like in Wrath?

To answer this point, unless they change the system they announced, then no. In fact, I believe that was the entire purpose of starting said point system, which was to have only two types. They could always change their mind on this, but they've admitted the badge system and all of the different types were a disaster, so I can't imagine they'd go back to it.

[Yooya]

Exactly. It's the same as the previous system, meaning like Tier 9 today, Tier 11 will not require players to go through Tier 11 content to get the gear.

I'm personally not against handing gear down. However, they should put a timer on the vendors, an unlock system if you will, before the gear can be bought. This way players who earned their T11 maintain their advantage into T12 content. The other thing I thought cool would be is if Tier sets were reduced to Blues, only in name, upon a new Tier's release. These are probably just my fool ideas though.

[ToxTheWrecker]

This.

Anyone kind enough to sit down and list the price for all of the Justice Points (blue) rewards, for us without access?

I'd love to be able to plan ahead!

^ This.

[Yooya]

This.

Anyone kind enough to sit down and list the price for all of the Justice Points (blue) rewards, for us without access?

I'd love to be able to plan ahead!

Yep, they are the important ones! No point getting tied in a knot over the Tier sets till you can actually raid.

[Astray]

Tank-trinket with stamina, the first epic for any tank to get and the last to drop in that expansion, mark my words.

[mezmir]

Except you're wrong. Old loot didn't used to be obsolete, it used to be a prerequisite for doing newer content. You would start with regular dungeons, move your way up to heroic, then to the first tier of raiding, and so on and so forth. With this system, you need only be able to do heroics, then skip to the latest tier. This will lead to the EXACT same problem we have today. Old raids being entirely abandoned, even if a guild never cleared it in the first place. Then you get situations where only the newest tier or raiding is relevant and people get bored with it VERY quickly.

---------- Post added 2010-09-27 at 08:18 AM ----------



To answer this point, unless they change the system they announced, then no. In fact, I believe that was the entire purpose of starting said point system, which was to have only two types. They could always change their mind on this, but they've admitted the badge system and all of the different types were a disaster, so I can't imagine they'd go back to it.

Firstly, it won't be immediate. Secondly, They said they wanted to make it possible for people to raid who dont have the time to raid every week all the time, or even do a ton of dailies per week. And lastly, I'm going to assume like every other expansion every single raid isnt going to be available from day 1. If you play from day 1, yes wou will be playing through most of the content before you can even attempt the later stuff or that which has yet to be released. If you watch TB on youtube you can see how much harder even some heroics will be to clear. That being said, yes eventually they WILL inevitably bump down the gear that is considered "top notch" at day 1. Catering to the people who either have alts they want to bring to the newest raid, or people that cannot play that often is most likely the reason they make the originally top notch gear more accessible down the line. Even so, if you are one of the people who has been workin your butt of from day one, YOU are going to experience everything im sure. So who cares how much easier it is to do down the line?

Mind you if you're worried about wow dying at some point, I guarantee you it will happen some day. We all pay 15$ a month to stare at moving pixels, it will get old eventually. People that play all the time are going to become overwhelmed and like you said "bored very quickly". Those who take it in doses will squeeze a lot more enjoyment out of it.

[Winfernal]

Yes and when the next tier of raiding comes out, all items that were available for valor points will be available for justice points, meaning T11 will only require heroics after 4.1. Also, if Blizzard is sticking with their original plan, daily heroics will also reward valor points once a day, meaning many won't even require that long. It's just a bad system, and I'd hoped Blizzard had grown beyond it.



Exactly. It's the same as the previous system, meaning like Tier 9 today, Tier 11 will not require players to go through Tier 11 content to get the gear.

No. Tier 11 Will require you to go through raids. You wont get Valor points wihout raiding.

[Geckomayhem]

Why are people confused?

First iteration of the expansion (patch 4.1)
For Justice points and doing heroics you will buy and get from bosses iLevel 346 blues only (no epic gear).
For Valor points and from the three raids on release you will purchase Tier 11 (with tokens that drop in said raids) and other iLevel 359 epics.
You cannot get epic level gear unless you raid (so for casual players the first patch will be quite sad in that respect).

Patch 4.2
Tier 11 will still require the tokens that drop in the first tier of raids but equivalent epics will cost Justice Points. This means that in the next major patch after release, iLevel 359 gear will become available to people who run heroics and aren't able to raid. Tier 12 will cost Valor points and armor tokens and be something like iLevel 374 epics, and equivalent iLevel epics will cost just Valor points. The three raids that get released with patch 4.1 will then award Justice points rather than valor points.

What this means
When the expansion is released, non-raiders will not have any epic gear. When patch 4.2 hits, many months into the expansion, the playing field is not levelled, as the difference between T11 ranked gear and T12 ranked gear will be rather big. Remember that they are itemising with T13 in mind, and have worked backwards from there. This means that come 4.2, the lower level of epic gear which becomes available to non-raiders will be good enough to step up into the current tier of raiding but the gear available from doing those raids will be far superior.

It would also be nice to have epic gear drop from the end bosses in heroics, a la TBC - but that won't be, it seems, until 4.2.

So raiders, rejoice, and naysayers, go sit in a corner. So-called "casuals" are not going to steal your epeen-ranked gear.

[Ektoplasme]

No. Tier 11 Will require you to go through raids. You wont get Valor points wihout raiding.

You're wrong.

On release day, you will earn Valor points once a day by doing the heroic dayly. You'll earn more by doing the raids.

So even without raiding, you will be able to buy T11.

When 4.1 is released, T11 will be moved to Justice point (the points you earn from any boss kill in an heroic) and T12 will be the new tier to buy from Valor point. At the same time, all the valor points you had would be transfered to justice points.

[mezmir]

Why are people confused?

First iteration of the expansion (patch 4.1)
For Justice points and doing heroics you will buy and get from bosses iLevel 346 blues only (no epic gear).
For Valor points and from the three raids on release you will purchase Tier 11 (with tokens that drop in said raids) and other iLevel 359 epics.
You cannot get epic level gear unless you raid (so for casual players the first patch will be quite sad in that respect).

Patch 4.2
Tier 11 will still require the tokens that drop in the first tier of raids but equivalent epics will cost Justice Points. This means that in the next major patch after release, iLevel 359 gear will become available to people who run heroics and aren't able to raid. Tier 12 will cost Valor points and armor tokens and be something like iLevel 374 epics, and equivalent iLevel epics will cost just Valor points. The three raids that get released with patch 4.1 will then award Justice points rather than valor points.

What this means
When the expansion is released, non-raiders will not have any epic gear. When patch 4.2 hits, many months into the expansion, the playing field is not levelled, as the difference between T11 ranked gear and T12 ranked gear will be rather big. Remember that they are itemising with T13 in mind, and have worked backwards from there. This means that come 4.2, the lower level of epic gear which becomes available to non-raiders will be good enough to step up into the current tier of raiding but the gear available from doing those raids will be far superior.

It would also be nice to have epic gear drop from the end bosses in heroics, a la TBC - but that won't be, it seems, until 4.2.

So raiders, rejoice, and naysayers, go sit in a corner. So-called "casuals" are not going to steal your epeen-ranked gear.

^^^this

but that being said, if you play from the beginning, you will be working your way through each raid. Down the line things will become obsolete, and will be skipped most likely. This is how wow works. Its not like we stop at lvl 60 to get some tier gear before we keep leveling. I dont hear any QQ about all the neglected lower level instances and item sets.

[marmion]

This.

Anyone kind enough to sit down and list the price for all of the Justice Points (blue) rewards, for us without access?

I'd love to be able to plan ahead!

Read post #11:
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...=1#post8937254

With the exchange ratio of 2.75 JP per EoF/EoT you will need:
800 Emblems for Legs/Chest/Helmet
600 Emblems for Belt/Gloves/Shoulders
455 Emblems for Neck
345 Emblems for Offhand