Presenting addon NinjaRaider (ninja looter report system)

[Deleted]

Every MMORPG player has received an unffair share-out of a loot at least once or, what is worse, someone keeps what a whole group has obtained. In many cases, if not all, there is nothing you can do about it. NinjaRaider.com is directly related to this. We provide you with the necessary tools to report a case which involves a player directly, giving relevant information and evidence on this. Other players will be able to get information about it, decide if the report is or is not right, and this way they will be able to judge if the player is innocent or guilty. Besides, through this search, we allow you to get a player's complete record of reports, what will enable the formation of more trustworthy groups of strangers. This trust is based on other players' opinions and reports. Although this information is not 100% exact, it is going to give us a quite precise opinion about the guidelines and habits of certain players when sharing out the loot and it also informs us if he or she is a repeat offender.

You can download our easy to use new addon at out site or at curse.com. It supplies all this info ingame. We are open to suggestions & feedback. Thanks to all!

[Gilian]

Not afraid people will spam ninja's without good evidence or forged evidence? And people juding the evidence wrong and innocent people get blamed for ninjaing?

Didn't check this but is the one who is reported as ninja able to reply to the evidence or something?

[Deleted]

Not afraid people will spam ninja's without good evidence or forged evidence? And people juding the evidence wrong and innocent people get blamed for ninjaing?

Didn't check this but is the one who is reported as ninja able to reply to the evidence or something?

Wel, this is the point. Addon never says "he is a ninja looter". This would be so arbitrary. It warns about reports, giving links, votes and ratio, then players decide after check all report or evidences if he is guilty o innocent. Bad evidences -> bad ratio, Good evidences -> Good ratio. We not decide, people decide. We just provide tools to make that more easy.

Of course, all reports have comments to explain or ask about all the facts. Check it and feedback plz :-)

[llDemonll]

or people will just team up and target 1 person because they can

[Mammoth]

Do the raid my way or me and my friends will all report you as a ninja etc...

[Momome]

It's very easy to avoid ninja'ing. As long as the raid leader has explicitly defined loot rules in raid chat, if he doesn't follow those rules, a GM will intervene and give the items to whoever they were meant to go to, as well as temp-banning the ninja. Frankly anyone who gets ninja'd from these days deserves everything they get :P

[Deleted]

a) You're violating global namespace in Functions.lua line 1. Use the addon-specific table passed to you using ... .
b) The system is flawed. If I don't like somebody, I can just spam-create accounts to keep reporting him.

[Deleted]

I agree that we can try to misuse. But do not think we should judge this way the tool. Its aim is not that. Its aim is to present information objectively about an event that is repeated too often in MMOs. We protect those who want to enjoy a game and not to those who break the rules repeatedly.

We want the reports are well documented and with all possible objectivity. We therefore call evidence, so given the option to comment on the report. Evidences are fundamental basis and the different points of view help to form a personal opinion or interpretation of what happened. We will never accuse anyone of anything from the site itself, but simply provide information on events in which the player has been involved, and the opinion of other players (report links, number of votes against/for, ratio).

If there are false accusations, no evidence and the report falls under its own weight. If there is abuse intervene.

There is a terms of use and a group of moderators who will ensure this is done correctly and to avoid abuse. We are aware that there is potential for misuse, but it is something that happens in almost all aspects of life ... always possible to misuse any tool. We know that and we are ready.

Of course, I take note of absolutely everything that you expose.

If you allow me, I expose my views on some of the comments:

Do the raid my way or me and my friends will all report you as a ninja etc...

If you do that, you need evidence anyway, right? As much as votes, do not blame anyone. People will see your arguments, and if not clear you will not get anywhere. Also, not everyone who votes is your friend.

It's very easy to avoid ninja'ing. As long as the raid leader has explicitly defined loot rules in raid chat, if he doesn't follow those rules, a GM will intervene and give the items to whoever they were meant to go to, as well as temp-banning the ninja. Frankly anyone who gets ninja'd from these days deserves everything they get :P

Typically in a raid with pugs when a situation like this finish with disband and lost dungeon save. The damage is already done, even if they put a ticket and the object is returned. People prefer active rather than reactive solutions.

The situations I have observed, when the addon has found a reported player, have finished checking the reports and if it was necessary, changing the master looter to another player.

a) You're violating global namespace in Functions.lua line 1. Use the addon-specific table passed to you using ... .
b) The system is flawed. If I don't like somebody, I can just spam-create accounts to keep reporting him.

a) Can you give me more info about bug? What did you did exactly. Thanks!

b) You need a lot of email accounts... you need a lot of ips... you need to fill a lot of captcha boxes ... Doable, but not easy for you. Easy for me to detect & stop. :-)

To recap, I just want to say that I understand your concerns. The first interested in is making good use of the site it is me. I would like, to assess its proper use, and not a possible misuse that can give and still has not happened. If that happens, we are ready ... is still little hard to be judged by the misuse that can be given :-S

Still no problem accept all criticism. I want to improve the system and get your feedback is really important. Thanks.

[Deleted]

I wasn't talking about a bug. You're simply violating naming rules by placing your function in a global variable.
Either create a global table that holds your functions, or use the addon table as described earlier.

[Purrfunctory]

Do you have a method of detecting name, faction and server changes?

[Deleted]

Do you have a method of detecting name, faction and server changes?

Name changes are easy, faction and server however are most defiantly not. With a name-change, you can track it yourself by adding the 'ninja' as a friend and placing a note using the blizzard friends system saying something like "<original name> is a ninja "

[Deleted]

This addon sounds like a great idea, the only way this could possibly go wrong is if you let the average playerbase get a hold of it by putting it on Curse or something.

b) You need a lot of email accounts... you need a lot of ips... you need to fill a lot of captcha boxes ... Doable, but not easy for you. Easy for me to detect & stop. :-)

With the people I refer to in the opening comment of my post, this will NOT be a problem. Plus how exactly would you stop it. The only method I could conceive by which you would be able to police this would be if you were gathering all of the reports from all of the servers and individually vetting them yourself.

[Deleted]

You need a lot of email accounts...

http://www.10minutemail.com/

you need a lot of ips...

http://www.hide-my-ip.com/

you need to fill a lot of captcha boxes

http://caca.zoy.org/wiki/PWNtcha

Were you saying anything?

EDIT:

Easy for me to detect & stop

When a genuine ninja gets reported, 9/24 raid members report them.
When a person is grief-reported, 9/24 reports are filed.

Where's the difference?

[llDemonll]

this addon will not work based on the simple fact that majority rules. if you want someone tagged as a ninja, you can get them tagged as a ninja. there is no way to enforce (or confirm / deny) people ninja'd by using something that allows the masses to vote. hell, i can go on and vote for anyone i want probably. maybe it's restricted to the server i'm on (if i have to fill that out when i register) or what faction i am (ditto), but there is no way to prove / disprove that i was in the raid that contained (or didnt contain) a ninja. you leave far too many options open to make this function properly.

will it get used? yes. will it be widely used? no. i dont see this addon having a foreseeable future of being used often

[Deleted]

OMG Make a script to do this auto requires programming skills. Can someone cheat? Of course. I can ban all services like 10minutemail or trash-mail.com, detect if you are connecting throught proxy, show more stronger captcha (this soft do not break google's captcha :-) )... then you work again on break then me ... ouch! Like the cat and mouse ... or a hackers movie. It is not something normal! Really going to judge in these terms? Do not see the point. :-)

EDIT:

When a genuine ninja gets reported, 9/24 raid members report them.
When a person is grief-reported, 9/24 reports are filed.

Where's the difference?

The difference is the evidence

---------- Post added 2010-10-01 at 09:28 PM ----------

I wasn't talking about a bug. You're simply violating naming rules by placing your function in a global variable.
Either create a global table that holds your functions, or use the addon table as described earlier.

Sorry, i am a bit lost with that. I am newbie with lua, so i will make a lot of mistakes. I will search info about and i will try to fix asap.

---------- Post added 2010-10-01 at 09:36 PM ----------

Name changes are easy, faction and server however are most defiantly not. With a name-change, you can track it yourself by adding the 'ninja' as a friend and placing a note using the blizzard friends system saying something like "<original name> is a ninja "

The armory provides information on each player. The more information you have and find more matches between two players, you can have more confidence that it is the same player (eg, comparing dates of achievements).

Is a daunting task and is beyond my resources to have a bot constantly crawling the armory and making these comparisons ... The only system I've seen this guy has WoWProgress.

In the short to medium term I have no intention even to find that functionality. Too much effort for now, sry.

[Deleted]

It's simple.
In the LUA file that is loaded first, do:

NinjaRaider = {}
local NinjaRaider = NinjaRaider

In all other LUA files, do:

local NinjaRaider = NinjaRaider

Replace all your function definitions (and calls) with:

NinjaRaider:functionname(arguments)

and

function NinjaRaider:functionname(arguments)

respectively.

PS: You can only detect if I am connecting through a proxy if the proxy tells you. If I use an anonymous proxy you can't know (unless you keep a database with the IPs of all proxies that exist).

[Patty]

a) You're violating global namespace in Functions.lua line 1. Use the addon-specific table passed to you using ... .
b) The system is flawed. If I don't like somebody, I can just spam-create accounts to keep reporting him.

THIS..

Also.. As far as I know, following the Human Rights we are all innocent untill proven otherwise.. And let's face it.. What REAL proof could you come with that are solid enough to actually mark someone as a Ninja? Screenshots? Yeah they are not hard to fake right?

[Deleted]

Yeah they are not hard to fake right?

Give me a text (can include item links and stuff) that you want to see in the in-game chat box. I give you a macro that displays exactly that text. There is no difference to a genuine screenshot.

[Darkagial]

armory shows items a person has looted.. proof enough if the program checks the armory.. but i think he said he doesnt have the resources to do that...

[Lagwin]

I agree that we can try to misuse. But do not think we should judge this way the tool. Its aim is not that. Its aim is to present information objectively about an event that is repeated too often in MMOs. We protect those who want to enjoy a game and not to those who break the rules repeatedly.

Has gearscore taught you nothing about how the avreage player misuses a simple tool...they shouldnt missuse it but they do and that will happen to this addon.
The intention might be to "help" others who play the game and avoid ninjas but what will happen is they will report someone for no reason and so will others and as stated there is nothing to stop ppl from ganging up on someone compleatly innocent.
So please do us all a favor and do not develop this addon any further.