1. #781
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    Hard to say without seeing the rest of your gear.

  2. #782
    My armory is Drdraker of Aggramar (EU) ,i dont have a priority on loot or invs in my guild since im not an officer so i dont have access to 372 trinkets :/ what do u think mihir?
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...raker/advanced
    Last edited by Drdraker; 2011-02-10 at 02:38 PM.

  3. #783
    The Patient Manapaws's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mihir View Post
    Just tested, same goes for me.
    Hmmm... well I'll be trying it out anyway. It's already bound to me!
    [R] [80:Lingzhichen:2]: why is never peeple who are smart of the fighting
    [R] [80:Lingzhichen:2]: every time raiding
    [R] [80:Lingzhichen:2]: people are wheels on chair


    (( Manapaws ))

  4. #784
    First of all i want to say that i can't get mew working, so don't have math or simulations to back up my claims below.

    As far as i can see with the 4.0.6 changes Glyph of Ferocious Bite is a DPS increase because they made shred more valuable then Fero Bite.

    Now a little les obvious glyph change might be Glyph of Berserk. At higher gear levels haste overtakes crit. Even at my 353 Ilvl with 8.73 haste (without buffs) I noticed in my random HC (with 5% haste buff) that i couldn't seem to loose my energy during berserk. So my guess is Glyph of Berserk becomes more valuable then Glyph of Tiger's Fury when you are at a certain haste level. I am just curious as to when that is and if that is right.

    So discuss

  5. #785
    Quote Originally Posted by Thieme View Post
    First of all i want to say that i can't get mew working, so don't have math or simulations to back up my claims below.

    As far as i can see with the 4.0.6 changes Glyph of Ferocious Bite is a DPS increase because they made shred more valuable then Fero Bite.

    Now a little les obvious glyph change might be Glyph of Berserk. At higher gear levels haste overtakes crit. Even at my 353 Ilvl with 8.73 haste (without buffs) I noticed in my random HC (with 5% haste buff) that i couldn't seem to loose my energy during berserk. So my guess is Glyph of Berserk becomes more valuable then Glyph of Tiger's Fury when you are at a certain haste level. I am just curious as to when that is and if that is right.

    So discuss
    DPE of Shred > FB. This means that above 25% HP we should ideally never be using FB. By definition, that also means that if we need to FB to refresh rip that a shred+FB will do more dpe then a 70 energy FB. In addition, only using 35 energy on FB always means you can start regenning combo points sooner lowering the chance of Rip ever falling off. Personally I will swap in FB asap, unless theorycrafting proves me wrong, but it seems a better option to me.

    As for berserk vs. TF: say we indeed do not run out of energy during berserk: 5 seconds = 3 extra GCDs to spam shred: That equates to 60 energy every 3 minutes.
    TF= 60 energy and a damage buff every 30 seconds. Unglyphed thats 2 energy/second. 60/27 is=2.2 energy per second. 0.2 energy per second extra. Over 3 minutes thats 180x0.2-36 extra energy.
    For pure energy gain that means berserk > TF.

    However, there is the 15% damage buff. Normally there would be a 20% uptime when used on CD every time (except att the start and assumiing perfect play).
    When TF is used every 27 seconds we get an uptime of 22.2%. That means we get 2.2% longer 15% buff. My exact math is failing me, but I reckon that a long the lines of a 0.3% damage buff (feel free to correct me). This is excluding having more Rips/rake's buffed with 15%.

    Say over 5 minutes doing 20k dps you do 6 million damage-> 0.3% extra means you do 1.003x6000000=6018000 damage, is 18000 damage.
    Over 5 minutes berserk glyph you have exaclty 40 energy extra compared to TF glyph. The question is then-> Will this 1 extra shred do 18k damage? I reckon that once you are at the level at which you do 20k damage you'd have shreds doing 18-20k without a crit. while also adding 1-2 additional combo points.

    While my math might be flawed, and I hope someone will point that out if so, if I am not wrong that means that berserk will edge out TF glyph. Mind you, the difference being marginal, and contingent on perfect play and 100% uptime on the boss.

    Having to run away from boss during berserk or postponing berserk for a burn phase will lowevr the vlaue of the glyph, but downtime also affects TF, arguable less since thats easier to time around ripping/raking., but timing berserk so that you are on the boss should be easy enough. The difference is marginal either way, but with the extra effect of burst dps in burn phases (Magmaw) I reckon I will run with Berserk.

    Feel free to bash my analysis. Hope MEw/Rawr/FbN have stuff to say on it soon, but so far I would agree with you that FB+Zerker glyphs are the best options.

  6. #786
    Quote Originally Posted by Mihir View Post
    In 4.0.6, at ilvl 359+, crit, hit, exp and haste should all be roughly worth the same. After factoring in socket bonuses and reforging the highest stat to mastery, you end up with the following stats:

    T11 chest + nonset shoulders
    131 expertise
    142 haste
    20 hit

    T11 shoulders + nonset chest
    227 crit
    36 mastery

    Assuming crit=hit=exp=haste, you end up with 293 vs 227 + 36 mastery.

    This ofcourse depends a lot on how your current gear is, etc.
    Then you might as well put mastery there as well, since the gap between crit + haste and expertise + hit is as big as the gap between crit + haste and mastery, assuming ilvl 359 gear.

    Nevertheless, using the stats you provided, the dps values are 274.22 and 265.28 respectively, so it seems non-set shoulders is the way to go.

    Quote Originally Posted by Balbo View Post
    Quick question about trinkets, i have been using Fluid Death and Tia's Grace, would it now be better to use Fluid Death and the newly changed Unheeded Warning?
    Fluid Death + Unheeded Warning is roughly 200 dps better than Fluid Death + Tia's Grace, depending on your gear, so yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sinfonia View Post
    Are we weighing haste a little higher than crit now that we want to get as many shreds as possible in?

    (i.e... do I take the plunge and reforge all my crit to haste?)
    It depends on your gear. Here's a rough guideline:
    - Item level 346: Crit > Haste
    - Item level 359: Crit = Haste
    - Item level 372: Crit < Haste

    Quote Originally Posted by bavarcarus View Post
    anyone know why they decided all epic crafted items but agi leather needed gem sockets?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mihir View Post
    they probably forgot, even tho it was reported to them
    I read your thread regarding this matter on the official forums, Mihir, but I don't know if you two noticed this line in the patch notes:
    'A socket has been added to most crafted epic armor pieces that did not already have one.'
    Note the word 'most'. Blizzard always choose their words carefully. Although, I do very much agree on the fact that the crafted epic piece should definitely receive a socket. They barely beat ilvl 346 gear, if at all.

    Also, Mihir, it would be nice if you could tell us whenever you update the original post. I, at least, am not checking it for updates whenever I'm on these forums.

    While I'm at it, I want to ask you about one of the lines in the priority list in the original post. 'Use Ravage if TF is up.' I assume you mean the Ravage from the Stampede proc. TF's effect has a duration of 6 seconds and our priority is to refresh Rip and Rake. Is the remaining time really sufficient to run out, charge in and Ravage? ... Hm, I guess it might work if you time it and execute it very well. You most likely need to be at 5CP when you hit TF, or at least by the time you apply Rip, else you won't make it. Any hesitation in this process will most likely devastate it, as well.

    Regarding Synapse Springs from Engineering; here are some dps values compared to not using it at all:
    - Item level 346: +216.003 dps
    - Item level 359: +245.096 dps
    - Item level 372: +252.483 dps

    Lastly, you might want to update the enchant list and switch bracer enchant, and wouldn't it be worth adding Ebonsteel Belt Buckle combined with +40 agility to the list as well?

  7. #787
    Hey Mihir,

    I noticed you reforged crit on some of your gear to haste. Do you notice the energy regen being higher? When I reforge and try eyeballing 0 haste vs 1k+ haste, I cannot eyeball a difference in the haste.

  8. #788
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    Reforged it after the raid so haven't had the chance to test it out yet

  9. #789
    Guys im sry for posting it again but it seems that no-one saw my post :/
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...raker/advanced this is my armory,i have access to all 359 trinkets so can anyone tell me which will be the most valuable trinkets before the 372?
    Also i have 2k Valor points ,shall i go for hands T11 for set bonus (2items of t11) or go for FD?
    Please i need help ;/
    THanks in advance

  10. #790
    Trinkets are FD and UW, but I recommend you to go for 2T11 and use TG and UW 'till you get heroic Essence or points for FD. It would be an optimal strategy.

  11. #791
    atm BiS trinkets are Unheeded Warnig and Heroic Essence of the Cyclone....

    if you cant get the heroic one.... Fluid Death combined with Unheeded Warning is BiS

  12. #792
    Hello together, this is my first post here.
    Till now i was just following these thread, since i started playing cat in cataclysm.

    Now i have one question that, in my opinion, is not mentioned.
    In the guide on the first page it is explained, which items seems to be the BiS high end gear.
    But now since the patch, you discuss whether the other stats, primarily haste, gain more valuable.
    So what is exatly about the BiS - 372 gear?
    Last edited by Mifuro; 2011-02-11 at 01:56 PM.

  13. #793
    Quote Originally Posted by Rambear View Post
    DPE of Shred > FB. This means that above 25% HP we should ideally never be using FB.
    Ironically, this would make us pick Glyph of Ferocious Bite again, so we won't waste Energy during the <25% phase, allowing for a better uptime of SR and more CPs to put into the mandatory FBs.
    Currently my majors are Charge, Rebirth, FF, can easily drop the latter as Cat.
    It looks great, but Will It Mog? | Are you fully Glyphed?

  14. #794
    So wait unheeding warning or w/e the BoE one is BiS now? Fuck I just sold like two of them lol

  15. #795
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    yep, it is.

  16. #796
    I'm not sure if it's been asked yet, but since they put in the Epic Alch trinkets with agility/crit on it...Where does that land on the list of trinkets? Are herioc 346 trinkets better, or does the sheer amount of agility on it combined with crit put it above most of them?

  17. #797
    Quote Originally Posted by Mihir View Post
    yep, it is.
    How many shreds do y need to get off during its 10 sec proc for it to be bis? (or alteast to be better then al other 359 trinkets?)

    Edit* i understand its hard to answer since y have to take so many others stuffs into the calculation. but around^^
    Last edited by Sintua; 2011-02-11 at 08:23 PM.

  18. #798
    Well, considering how we are wasting CPs atm you could probably refresh Rip and Rake when the trinket proccs and it'll gain the full duration from it. I assume the procc stack with bleeds and stuff.

  19. #799
    Quote Originally Posted by gollie View Post
    Well, considering how we are wasting CPs atm you could probably refresh Rip and Rake when the trinket proccs and it'll gain the full duration from it. I assume the procc stack with bleeds and stuff.
    Iirc bleeds don't scale with weapon damage, only with AP. So, they shouldn't be affected at all.
    "Seeping crest of turbidity, arrogant vessel of lunacy.
    Boil forth and deny, grow numb and flicker, disrupting sleep.
    Crawling queen of iron, eternally self-destructing doll of mud.
    Unite, repulse. Fill with soil and know your own powerlessness."


    Primera - Elemental Shaman - <Vedo La Gente Morta> - Pozzo dell'Eternità IT

  20. #800
    Quote Originally Posted by Shornaal View Post
    Iirc bleeds don't scale with weapon damage, only with AP. So, they shouldn't be affected at all.
    Correct. What makes this trinket beast is Shred spam (or swipe on trash). Optimally it would proc during TF+Berserk, which you could probably get off at the beginning of the fight (hope your tank's threat is awesome), but intentionally delaying TF or Berserk for a proc after that would be a DPS loss in most cases.

    It buffs white damage/fury swipes/mangle/shred/fb/swipe.
    Last edited by Leinie; 2011-02-11 at 11:14 PM. Reason: forgot swipe
    Quote Originally Posted by Kiru View Post
    I don't PvP much, but I fought a Mage in Tol Barad one time. It was kind of like playing Wheel of Fortune. Except every space was Bankrupt.

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