The Cat Guide - 4.3

[Macor]

wondering if I should go back to reforging 2pc t11 and 2pc t12 into haste/crit mastery instead of reforging for hit expertise cap

Well tbh i really don't see much profit in 10% rake dmg> stats on 378 offset gear and from my logs it ticks less than rip and 2ce less ticks during standard 5min+ encounter droping to about 12% our overal dmg or might go to like 15% if you stacked mastery and not hit/exp caped and miss a lot Shreds/melee. Also depends a lot of your gear i felt fine with around 7% hit and 15 expertize when i was using 2t11+2t12 and was able to keep mastery at 16=50% bleeds with haste just 20rating over for matrix proc. But still proc is tricky i had 30% uptime of 1624 crit rating on baleroc coz of EotC procs right b4 matrix QQ so now i can only w8 and hope for hungerer to disable that part of rng and get haste proc always :P


And Zheryn you can but you would like to drop some of your hit/exp especially coz you won't miss too much or get dodged/parried attacks, and drop mastery also than it should be fine. Also you can switch hands enchant for 50 exp. And i think your investing VPs in wrong parts hoping for BH drops since ring+relic is 1950VPs just a bit more and you could have bought legs and get nearer to 4t12 since you have shoulders already, but that's just personal i personally bought tier 1st coz no luck in BH with drops.
Tip: grab Martix if you can its damn good trink with insane uptime

[MasterNewbie]

The 2T11 bonus generally speaking is competitive with or better than 2 non-tier 378 pieces, even if it's normal 2T11. If possible I would recommend keeping hands and shoulders as they have the least amount of stats (so you are losing out on less stats by not using 378). As a general rule you shouldn't reforge to crit since ferals typically have a high crit chance already.

Regarding Zheryn's hand enchant. 20 agi is better than just about anything except 65 mastery; the two are competitive at higher gear levels.

[Newti]

I know it has been asked a lot, but after the Unheeded Warning nerf i have to re-evaluate my trinekts. I have the following choices:

Unheeded Warning
Quicksilver Alchemist Stone
DMC:Hurricane
Fluid Death

Rawr lists Fluid Death as the best choice but somehow doesnt rate the DMC or Alch Stone. Is the proc from DMC good enough to outdo 30 agi and 194 crit?
Or is Unheeded Warning still best on ilvl 359?

Thx in Advance!

[MasterNewbie]

DMC comparatively sucks. Of the 359 trinkets FD is the best. Given your options, I'd roll with FD+Alch. On a strictly per-point basis, UW is better than the Alch stone, but you will lose some rip uptime due to "stronger spell is active" which may or may not push Alch above UW.

[Aerden]

Hi.

Should I stick with FD/Unheeded after nerf or should I do the dailies (bah) to get that crystal-trinket-thingy?

Also, I currently roll with http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Aerden/simple - but tomorrow i'll get t12 gloves available.. so I am wondering if I should buy the t12 gloves and just roll with 1 piece of t11(since the damn shoulders never drop) or should I buy necklace of smoke signals and continue farming for t11 shoulders until I can afford gloves?

[Steellynx]

Hi.

Should I stick with FD/Unheeded after nerf or should I do the dailies (bah) to get that crystal-trinket-thingy?

Also, I currently roll with http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte.../Aerden/simple - but tomorrow i'll get t12 gloves available.. so I am wondering if I should buy the t12 gloves and just roll with 1 piece of t11(since the damn shoulders never drop) or should I buy necklace of smoke signals and continue farming for t11 shoulders until I can afford gloves?

It really is a shame that so many people are too lazy (or dumb?) to read the first post of this guide. I wonder how some get their things done in RL...

Trash UW, get T12 shoulders. As long as you're not progressing heroic T12 content, you'd be fine with 378 offset items. I wouldn't even think of farming old content to push my dps since it may very well be obsolete in a heartbeat.

[MasterNewbie]

The 2T11 bonus generally speaking is competitive with or better than 2 non-tier 378 pieces, even if it's normal 2T11. If possible I would recommend keeping hands and shoulders as they have the least amount of stats (so you are losing out on less stats by not using 378).

Regarding dropping 2T11 for 2T12. 2T12 is a bigger bonus so you should pick it up when you can, but depending on your FL progression (i.e. if you can't get 4T12) keep an eye out for a piece to reactivate your 2T11.

[Conatzer]

So, simming my dps with mew recently, it's showing that APS is around 1k dps higher than hunger/essence (no luck on matrix sadly)
Any suggestions on if it's actually better?

[Stevoman]

So, in light of the Rake nerf/bugfix, how does that affect the value of 2T11?

Basically the only two slots for consideration in my case are gloves and legs, and it's between 2T11H, or 2T12N. (That is until I can secure 4T12, but it's going to be a while for me before I can get there since I'm probably going to have to go casual and be demoted from core raider for the next ~2 months due to RL issues.) Sims haven't been updated yet, so can anyone who has the gear comment on the Rake change possibly making the higher item level of the T12 outweigh the bonus of the T11?

[Healingftw]

There isnt Rake nerf.Now after the patch the logs are just showing the initial rake hit damage sepаrate from the dot so you dont lose tick...it just show it sepаrate and not merged like it was before the patch.It was sepаrate in 4.1 and before, merged in 4.2 and now again sepаrate in 4.2a thats why you think you get less ticks...

[Vedmak277]

Why do you rate APS that low?
Having 4t12, hit/exp capped, max reforging towards haste (1650 haste, 920 crit, 830 mastery), have raggy trink... so mew shows APS > Hungerer, difference is 80-90 dps.

[Ragekitty]

I've got a question relating to Glyph of Berserk vs Glyph of Savage Roar.

Basically, with my current gear level + reforging/gemming, I've dropped a lot of haste since using T11 gear. I was really dumb and didn't think to use Glyph of Berserk then so now I see it listed as the Prime Glyph to use in place of Glyph of Savage Roar. Now, with my T11 gear, my haste was high enough that I could have theoretically gotten the most bang by using Berserk and not worry too much about running out of energy. With my current gear, my primary concern is that my haste isn't high enough and I'd run OOE long before my extended Berserk is over.

Is there some sort of magical golden number in terms of haste that I should get before switching my glyph?

[tangedyn]

No, GoBerserk is always better.

[MasterNewbie]

Basically, with my current gear level + reforging/gemming, I've dropped a lot of haste since using T11 gear. I was really dumb and didn't think to use Glyph of Berserk then so now I see it listed as the Prime Glyph to use in place of Glyph of Savage Roar. Now, with my T11 gear, my haste was high enough that I could have theoretically gotten the most bang by using Berserk and not worry too much about running out of energy. With my current gear, my primary concern is that my haste isn't high enough and I'd run OOE long before my extended Berserk is over.

The extra 10 seconds on berserk means you'll get at least 110 energy over the extra duration (assuming 10% haste raid buff). This is 5+ half-cost shreds (2.5 free) which is around a 350 dps increase. Glyph of SR tacks on an extra ~2.7% (base roared melee damage is 180%) damage from autoattacks while it is active. I want to say that would be around a 60 dps increase. I feel that my math is off, though, so there you go.

Energy regenerates always, remember that (unless you're at max energy).

[Xenerix]

Why do you rate APS that low?
Having 4t12, hit/exp capped, max reforging towards haste (1650 haste, 920 crit, 830 mastery), have raggy trink... so mew shows APS > Hungerer, difference is 80-90 dps.

Exactly same for me. Saving DKP for hc Hungerer since normal version doesn't seem to be DPS gain at all. It's kinda tricky tho. Rawr or pages like askmrrobot are suggesting that Hungerer is better than APS by 150 - 250 DPS, which is huge. It's possible that the internal cd of APS in latest Mew is wrong or something like that.

[tangedyn]

Rawr and Mrrobot use Formulation modelling. We have already determined that Formulation modeling simply doesn't work for Cat anymore, that's why Mew has abandoned the Toskk Formulation model.

If you average the agility bonus of APS over time as the Formulation models do, it will suck compared to the Hungerer. However, if you are a smart cat, you would macro the use of APS to coincide with Tiger's Fury and Berserk. Mew Simulation models this strategy and shows that the APS pulls ahead of the Hungerer if you do it right.

[Ipsissimus]

Mihir you rock! Chop chop down Raggy before Numen!

[Xenerix]

Rawr and Mrrobot use Formulation modelling. We have already determined that Formulation modeling simply doesn't work for Cat anymore, that's why Mew has abandoned the Toskk Formulation model.

If you average the agility bonus of APS over time as the Formulation models do, it will suck compared to the Hungerer. However, if you are a smart cat, you would macro the use of APS to coincide with Tiger's Fury and Berserk. Mew Simulation models this strategy and shows that the APS pulls ahead of the Hungerer if you do it right.

This is interesting, thanks for answer.

[Mihir]

Verified. Changed trinket order to:

http://db.mmo-champion.com/i/69150/m
http://db.mmo-champion.com/i/69112/t
http://db.mmo-champion.com/i/68994/m
http://db.mmo-champion.com/i/69001/a
http://db.mmo-champion.com/i/68927/t
http://db.mmo-champion.com/i/65026/p

[tangedyn]

So, simming my dps with mew recently, it's showing that APS is around 1k dps higher than hunger/essence (no luck on matrix sadly)
Any suggestions on if it's actually better?

Note that in Mew, checking/unchecking the trinket proc effects only enables/disables the proc effect.
You have to manually add/subtract static stats like Agility and Mastery