Ice Lance

[Nevian Moore]

Is the current state of this spell (read: retarded damage) intended or is it getting looked at? Thanks.

[Leialyn]

Whats wrong with it?

[PlatedPriest]

Whats wrong with it?

a lot of non mages think it is hittin to hard

[Nekrow Stilborne]

a lot of non mages think it is hittin to hard

I'm hitting roughly 11k with it on Frozen targets, even more so when I've got mirror image popped. It's really nice on PvE, but on PvP against non-resilience targets, it's way OP.

[underdogba]

a lot of non mages think it is hittin to hard

It's horribly broken in a pvp environment, because there is essentially no point casting frostbolts as a nuke. All you do as a frost mage is run around icelancing.

To make the playstyle remotely compelling, they need to beef up frostbolt and nerf icelance hard. This is not necessarily about non-mages complaining about mages, it's also a matter of mages being concerned that with the current design, their class runs the risk of being skill-less faceroll and enduring the resulting stigma. The moment 4.0.1 hit, mage became 3.0.2 ret.

[Deleted]

I'm hitting roughly 11k with it on Frozen targets, even more so when I've got mirror image popped. It's really nice on PvE, but on PvP against non-resilience targets, it's way OP.

Highlighted the importand part..
Wrathfull is almost free for just honor points.
so on resilience capped targets hits for 4-5k max. so no it's not op.

if you just started doing pvp then there is no point in expressing a view of a spell ment to do half damage with resilience.

[Skarrd]

It's horribly broken in a pvp environment, because there is essentially no point casting frostbolts as a nuke. All you do as a frost mage is run around icelancing.

To make the playstyle remotely compelling, they need to beef up frostbolt and nerf icelance hard. This is not necessarily about non-mages complaining about mages, it's also a matter of mages being concerned that with the current design, their class runs the risk of being skill-less faceroll and enduring the resulting stigma. The moment 4.0.1 hit, mage became 3.0.2 ret.

Frostbolt is worth casting on nova'd targets becasue IL will break the nova with one spell, while FB+IL will allow two and about twice the damage. Frostbolt is worth casting on deep freezed targets as it hits harder than IL if you have the glyph. Ice Lance is good, it is by no means our only or our best source of damage. People who qq about IL damage are just bad. I'm still running a mix of pve/pvp gear at about 970 resil and I do just fine. Good players and high resil targets don't die as easily as all the baddies crying OP.

Hell, some kid with 0 resil dueled me last night, and I literally did nothing but spam IL (didn't even cast a nova) and won. Then he starts telling meme "you're gonna get nerfed, it's in the patch notes" and he refused to believe me when I said those nerfs were already applied. These are the kinds of people who are crying OP.

[Swizzle]

It's horribly broken in a pvp environment, because there is essentially no point casting frostbolts as a nuke. All you do as a frost mage is run around icelancing.

To make the playstyle remotely compelling, they need to beef up frostbolt and nerf icelance hard. This is not necessarily about non-mages complaining about mages, it's also a matter of mages being concerned that with the current design, their class runs the risk of being skill-less faceroll and enduring the resulting stigma. The moment 4.0.1 hit, mage became 3.0.2 ret.

When the class changes go live, damage is going to be very high relative to health for level 80 characters. We are spending most our PvP balancing effort at level 85, since that by far is what matters most to players. The health pools at 85, decaying combat ratings (because you'll be going from tier 3 gear to tier 0 gear), extra talent points and the 3 new abilities make a huge difference overall.

Since the current PvP season will end when these changes go live, they shouldn't have a lasting impact on ratings, titles and the like. We are prepared to just drop a temporary player damage nerf on all BGs and Arenas if necessary just so things don't feel too silly until everyone can level up to 85.

How things feel at 85 is of far more importance to us. We fully expect to see a lot of posts from freaked out players who imagine 85 will feel just like 80, but it won't. The gain in survivability is substantial.

QUIT TRYING TO BALANCE CATACLYSM AROUND LEVEL 80 HERP FESTS.

[allrightythen]

in pvp mine was critting (on a frozen target) for 4-6k, beause of resilience.

it would hit for what...1500? noncrit? no frozen effect?

ya, so OP with people in PVP gear with 40k hp.

[Leialyn]

I never saw a 5 digit number in PVP as Frost Mage. Only 18k Ferocious Bites and Hammer of Wraths against 1k Resi Oo

[Tokas]

oh but it's so fun to see people cry about all these things at 80, when Blizzard clearly stated not to

[Xiun]

It does high damage with no cooldown and no way of stopping it but a full out CC. It makes frost mages faceroll, and there is no reason to cast frostbolt anymore, reducing the risk of getting caught in a cast. On top of the unavoidable damage, frost still has it's insane survivability and control.

Frost is amazingly broken right now, and I have a feeling it won't change come 85.

[Skarrd]

It does high damage with no cooldown and no way of stopping it but a full out CC. It makes frost mages faceroll, and there is no reason to cast frostbolt anymore, reducing the risk of getting caught in a cast. On top of the unavoidable damage, frost still has it's insane survivability and control.

Frost is amazingly broken right now, and I have a feeling it won't change come 85.

I still say good luck killing anybody halfway decent without casting, especially a healer.

[Xuvial]

Ice Lance is indeed extremely broken, but for some reason I can't seem to kill Warlocks, Priests, Druids (and many other classes) when they're wearing PvP gear!

[Mossmantle]

Big chunk 'o Blizz text saying we're balancing at 85, don't worry about 80!

QUIT TRYING TO BALANCE CATACLYSM AROUND LEVEL 80 HERP FESTS.

The problem with this is Blizzard's implementation.

"Here's some big changes! But it's balanced at something two months away and in a fictional five levels you don't have yet!"

Balancing spells for 85 when no one on live will even hit 81 for at least another month and a half is a bit absurd. And people wonder why there is so much QQ about abilities.

[Swizzle]

The problem with this is Blizzard's implementation.

"Here's some big changes! But it's balanced at something two months away and in a fictional five levels you don't have yet!"

Balancing spells for 85 when no one on live will even hit 81 for at least another month and a half is a bit absurd. And people wonder why there is so much QQ about abilities.

And this was said when TBC changes hit, yet people leveled.
Then again when WotLK changes came...yet again people leveled quickly.

Beta PvP seems to be decently balanced now that people are gearing up and I haven't heard any war stories from there about people being one shot by anything. If you've played this game as long as me (started in September of 2005), then none of this complaining is new to you. If you're a wrath baby, then by all means go ahead and complain and watch as it balances itself out at level 85.

[Xiun]

I still say good luck killing anybody halfway decent without casting, especially a healer.

I have killed many people who are decent by spamming ice lance and MAYBE 3 frostbolts.

Also, healers don't die period, won't matted what spec you are, you're not going to take down a healer by yourself unless the stars align.

[Whyhello]

Frost is amazingly broken right now, and I have a feeling it won't change come 85.

Luckily you don't know what you're talking about!

[kdogdeluxe09]

I can take out melee easy, other spell casters arent to bad, but resto druids with res are impossible to kill...

[Xiun]

Luckily you don't know what you're talking about!

After playing frost since I started my mage back in BC, I have the feeling they won't change frost's playstyle, because they want to appeal to the pvers.

Will it remain OP? Maybe, maybe not, but I have the feeling it will remain as faceroll as it is now.