Frostbrand Weapon vs PvP

[Mello]

So the Frozen Power talent was made to make us use Frostbrand Weapon in main hand, sence firebrand was obvious for offhand.

Yet Elemental Weapons don't give any bonus for Frostbrand Weapon at all, nor does Unleash Elements... Are we supposed to go for WF in MH again?

[Aleksej89]

Windfury is ALWAYS on our main hand as Enhancement. Always. Both PvE and PvP. ALWAYS!

Frostbrand is not strong enough compared to the new Flametongue since the new Lava Lash gets heavily boosted by Flametongue.

So completely forget about Frostbrand.

Do use Frozen Power for Frost Shock root, tho.

[LyskaWF]

Uh no, Frozen Power was absolutely not made to make us use Frostbrand on our MH...

[Lylz]

Frostbrand will be viable for PvP again with the updated Glyph that allows for the bonus damage when the OH is not enhanced with Flametongue.

[Aleksej89]

Frostbrand will be viable for PvP again with the updated Glyph that allows for the bonus damage when the OH is not enhanced with Flametongue.

Please do not post incorrect data!

You are talking about the Glyph of Lava Lash, which is changed to give 20% more Lava Lash damage regardless of the Flametongue enhancement.

However the Lava Lash itself gains 40% more damage if offhand is enhanced with Flametongue, which is a huge bonus to the Enhancement's hardest hitting nuke.

Flametongue also gives a truckload of Spell Power and deals Fire damage on every attack.

Frostbrand is DEAD in both PvE and PvP.

As far as Enhancement goes, in both PvE and PvP, Windfury is MainHand and Flametongue is OffHand.

[Yozsh]

Wait...what? maybe I missed something, but the general idea was that frostbrand/Flametongue was the weapon enchants to use for pvp now and at 85. Unleash element for windfury is a haste buff (lol) and on top of that a day or two ago I read a thread on the beta forums about wanting a damage buff for windfury because it was doing less damage than frostbrand...

Despite all of that i still actually play with windfury/flametongue all the time and just frost shock and earthbind to slow...

Edit* i just reread the beta thread and someone said that windfury will still out perform frostbrand in a raid setting...there maybe just a small difference in damage for pvp though.

[airbornehippie]

Windfury is ALWAYS on our main hand as Enhancement. Always. Both PvE and PvP. ALWAYS!

Frostbrand is not strong enough compared to the new Flametongue since the new Lava Lash gets heavily boosted by Flametongue.

So completely forget about Frostbrand.

Do use Frozen Power for Frost Shock root, tho.

this quote... dont pay attention to it. Windfury is not "always" your go-to chant for main hand. not only do our enchants have good situational use to them (/macro fun yay!) but for pvp, you would definitely want to go with a consistent proc which slows 50% and, with UE's effect, up to 70%. definitely a handy way to kill the "kiters" since that means you have frost shock to root them/slow them, earthbind to slow them, your wolves for all their awesomeness, and ANOTHER cd (UE) to slow them down to 70%. not to mention with the frozen power talent, your spells hit for 10% harder... 10% more to a 40k LL? yes plz! Now when you compare that to WF which has a low chance proc and it's UE effect only gives you haste... it's a no-brainer. Especially when you have the PvP set which gives your malestorm and additional 20% chance to proc. As for your offhand, it's another no-brainer to stick with flametongue. consistent damage; lots of spellpower; snazzy UE effect; and last but definitely not least... +40% to your LL. there is a recent glyph that allows you have a +20% to LL regardless if your offhand is enchanted with FT or not. So if one absolutely wanted to stick with the low chance; big proc of windfury on their mainhand, they could do it and just put frostbrand in the offhand. It really comes down to an individual playstyle. Personally i would base it on the character i am fighting. is it a melee? then i will go windfury/flametongue. (they will be in melee range the whole time.) is it a caster/range? then i would go frostbrand/flametongue. (they wont be in melee range, and i would need to keep them slowed and next to me as much as possible) and i would always keep a macro to quick swap a weapon with rockbiter-enchanted-weapon and use it to taunt that hunter's/mage's/priest's/lock's pet right before the player tries to CC me. mwahahaha! thank you pet for breaking that sheep/fear/ice. (that example would be hard to pull off but i've done it with my warrior. hehe)

and of course... for pve, sim stuff out! =D and also, those target dummies/random world elites are very handy to test/play with. so go with what you figure out on your own. you'll have more fun that way! =)

[Nopi]

You're putting way to much onto LL, ALeks. We have a whole arsenal of potent spells, don't dump everything you have into that big LL. I personally don't like using FB/FT, but I know with high mastery it will really start to shine. And the loss of a near permanant, undispellable 50% movement speed would be terrible, even if you do get a big LL crit.

[Nitz]

I personnally use FB/FT in pvp, and in pve it's ~200dps under WF.. Why ? Because, it's constant dmg, it's a spell effect that is affected by our mastery AND it's frost dmg, so it ignores your target's armor. I don't like RNG especially in pvp and WF glyph is not worth (for less RNG) due to SS/LL/Wolves glyph beeing by far better glyphs.

[Omanley]

Please do not post incorrect data!

You are talking about the Glyph of Lava Lash, which is changed to give 20% more Lava Lash damage regardless of the Flametongue enhancement.

However the Lava Lash itself gains 40% more damage if offhand is enhanced with Flametongue, which is a huge bonus to the Enhancement's hardest hitting nuke.

Flametongue also gives a truckload of Spell Power and deals Fire damage on every attack.

Frostbrand is DEAD in both PvE and PvP.

As far as Enhancement goes, in both PvE and PvP, Windfury is MainHand and Flametongue is OffHand.

Uuuum has there ever been a decription saying the 20% extra damage of ll glyph only apply when using ft? Cant remember that. From how i took it, it works like lylz said: the 20% extra damage from the glyph you had, have and always will have regardless of your imbue. the new glyph adds to that, that your ll does not require ft on your offhand to deal those extra 40% dmg on the tooltip of ll.

The questeion remains however: Just with having that glyph, will it mean that wf/fb will be indee best imbue setup? from hitting the argent crusade dummy for 10 minutes each with a wf/ft, fb/ft and wf/fb combination each, wf/ft beat fb/ft by roughly 200dps, but wf/fb was roughly 800 dps lower than wf/ft. dont ask me how it came about. I guess ft's sustained fire damage is indispensable.

[Kralljin]

Frostbrand is affected by Unleash elements, if you use Unleash Elements with Frostbrand on your weapon the target will be slowed by 50% for 5sec, if the target is already slowed, it's a 70% slow.

[rdaccord]

Frostbrand is affected by Unleash elements, if you use Unleash Elements with Frostbrand on your weapon the target will be slowed by 50% for 5sec, if the target is already slowed, it's a 70% slow.

I could see that being usefull as another slow against druids trying to kite, but beyond that it seems like a loss of dmg sense we have FROST SHOCK!!! that can root/slow.

[airbornehippie]

Uuuum has there ever been a decription saying the 20% extra damage of ll glyph only apply when using ft? Cant remember that. From how i took it, it works like lylz said: the 20% extra damage from the glyph you had, have and always will have regardless of your imbue. the new glyph adds to that, that your ll does not require ft on your offhand to deal those extra 40% dmg on the tooltip of ll.

The questeion remains however: Just with having that glyph, will it mean that wf/fb will be indee best imbue setup? from hitting the argent crusade dummy for 10 minutes each with a wf/ft, fb/ft and wf/fb combination each, wf/ft beat fb/ft by roughly 200dps, but wf/fb was roughly 800 dps lower than wf/ft. dont ask me how it came about. I guess ft's sustained fire damage is indispensable.

if this is true about the glyph, that....is.....AWSM! my time on my account ran out, and i'm not renewing it till cata hits. so i haven't tested that =( can you confirm that LL hits 40%+20% harder regardless of imbue? say like.... 50 LLs with FT, and 50 of em without?