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  1. #1

    Speculation bout Next-Gen consoles

    Over the years the gaming world has changed a lot. Modern titles are very limited by the current console generations limited processing power (especially memory). If we want PC gaming to evolve, then so must consoles.

    While nothing concrete has been announced yet, and both MS and Sony have claimed they intend their consoles to have a 10 year life-cycle. So that would would mean we can expect the Next-Generation to pop up sometime around 2012.

    I'm going to ignore the Wii here as it doesn't really share much in common with PC gaming and has little direct impact on it.

    If we look at the hardware of the current models:

    XBox 360

    CPU: 3.2 GHz PowerPC Tri-Core Xenon
    Memory: 512 MB of GDDR3 RAM clocked at 700 MHz
    GPU: 500 MHz ATI Xenos
    Extra: HD-DVD drive
    HDD: 250 GB

    Strengths: hardware and chips close to PC hardware make it easier to program the games,
    Weakness: Less processing power compared to the PS 3

    PS 3

    CPU: 3.2 GHz Cell Broadband Engine with 1 PPE & 7 SPEs
    Memory: 256 MB system and 256 MB video
    GPU: 550 MHz NVIDIA/SCEI RSX 'Reality Synthesizer'
    Extra: Blu-Ray drive
    HDD: up to 320 GB

    Strengths: very very powerful processor for such a well-priced product
    Weakness: very limited memory and chip is hard to program

    Now there are a couple of things to bare in mind here when comparing console hardware with PC hardware:
    -Consoles can get you A LOT more performance for the hardware they offer compared to a PC, simply because they are easier to optimize.
    -Consoles weak-spot has always been memory, or rather, the lack thereof. That's why consoles games must often resort to "tunnel-levels" as they can't storage large levels in their memory.
    -Much more than PCs, consoles must be quiet an energy efficient. Hardware must be as cheap as possible while still offering performance.

    Based on that we must consider the following trends for future console gaming:
    -3D gaming will probably make a break-through, either with or without 3D glasses.
    -Online distribution has a very high profit margin and will become increasingly important.
    -Full-HD gaming will become standard (currently most games play at 1280x960)
    -Casual Gaming and movement controls will become even more important. However they require different things (unique controls, low price, simple games) to core-gamers.

    What to expect:

    -For the Next-Gen consoles to support stereoscopic 3D and 1980x1080 the visual processing power would need to be quadrupled (roughly double the pixels + twice the FPS). Not really too much to ask and is easily accomplished.
    -Full 64 bit-programming: While it is hard to predict what impact it might have, it would make sense since PCs have been 64-bit compatible for years now. (maybe consoles are too idk).
    -Direct X 12 visuals: While Direct X 11 hasn't really had much of an impact so far, by 2012 Direct X 12 should be well underway. The visuals should be greatly improved over Direct X 8 visuals the current consoles have.
    -A lot more memory: Memory nowadays is dead cheap and as it is the main bottle-neck on todays consoles. We can only hope they increase it by a lot. 4 GB dedicated memory minimum...
    -Online distribution: Potentially MS could decide to fully embrace online distribution with their new console. No more discs, just downloads similar to Steam/XBox Live. It would save them an expensive Blu-Ray drive and increase the profit margin by quite a bit, but would require large amounts of Hard-Drive space. Probably a Terra-Byte or more.
    -If Online distribution isn't fully embraced expect to see Blu-Ray drives for all consoles. That would allow a lot less Hard-Drive space.
    -SSDs: In theory SSDs are ideal for consoles. Fast loading times, very little power needed, virtually silent and hard to break. Unfortunately they are still very expensive and might still be so in 2012.
    -Serious MMOs are still very much a PC domain (one of the last few). If the Next-Gen consoles allow for keyboards to be connected, the increased memory might allow for some serious MMOs to finally get underway.

    Anyway, I can't wait for the Next-Gen consoles to finally get underway because it's time PC Gaming continued evolving instead of being limited by gimped consoles.

  2. #2
    The Hedgehog Elementium's Avatar
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    I'm gonna stick with microsoft all the way.

    Sony came out with the PS3 in such a dickish way.. "It's more than a game console! so we're gonna price it like a gaming PC! sure it can't download all the programs a gaming PC can.. but hey it's got blue ray."

    Meh, took them forever to knock that price down and even now they still put out PS2 games! lol.

    As far as the consoles go though.. I don't see how much better they can get with graphics and such without every game developer having the experience of working on the Avatar movie. I feel like we're at a good place now with graphics.

  3. #3
    For the record, Nintendo can make a console just as powerful as MS or Sony can, they don't make them as powerful to keep the price down. Not to mention Nintendo consoles are just better quality in the first place. My xbox started having problems after not even a year and was broken within two. My PS2 started having problems after a few years as well. My N64 however still works, mostly, after almost 14 years. My GC and Wii also run perfectly with no problems after having them longer then when my xbox and ps2 started showing problems. Quality > graphics. ALWAYS.

    PC gaming isn't limited by "gimped consoles" either. If you don't like the quality of the pc games or graphics thats not the fault of the console makers. Your beef is with pc gaming companies and/or their parts makers. You seem to not know a whole lot about the video game industry or business either if you think it would be a good idea for the next xbox to do just downloads and no physical disc. If you did you would know that would be the downfall of the xbox brand. They would fail. Utterly and miserably. If pc gaming hasn't gone to a download only approach then there is no possible way a console company would even consider that.

    One thing we can be sure of is that whatever Nintendo does that turns out to be cool and popular, Sony will copy it. Its the reason for their existence and success in video games.

  4. #4
    ahahahahahha dx12 level graphics



    ahahahahahahahahaa

  5. #5
    PS3 has 3D technology and you can play games in 3D if you own a 3D television. I doubt new consoles will be available to buy in 2012, maybe they will show off their new consoles, but I don't think they will go on sale that year.

    The PS3 is the better system out of all three, in my own opinion. The PS3 is held back on cross platform games thanks to the Xbox 360 and Wii. Developers on cross platform games are too lazy to take advantage of PS3 capabilities or they just have no idea how to. That is why so many games are better on the Xbox 360 than they are on the PS3.

    Sure the PS3 had a high price, but you were paying for a quality system that will last you for years and years, unlike the Xbox 360 that had faulty power adapters and the famous red ring of death. I bought my PS3 when it was first released, it is still running very strong with no problems (Knock on wood).

    Yes I am a PS3 fanboy. =)

  6. #6
    You're having a laugh if you think there'll be another PlayStation before 2015 at the very least.

    Personally I have all 3 consoles as they all offer unique experiences not available on the other.

    Though, not like I play much besides WoW these days. =)

    FYI: 64bit language is only really required in a system with 3.5Gb of Ram or over.
    Most games do not currently play in 1280*960 but 1280*720 (720p/i), few exceptions like Wipeout HD which runs at full 1080p (1920*1080) which to be honest, is a god damn engineering miracle.

  7. #7
    Mechagnome Gecko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianCC100 View Post
    Yes I am a PS3 fanboy. =)
    Thankfully you didn't mention the PS2... Disk Read Errors, anyone? That problem was as abundant as the RRoD, but at least Microsoft owned up to it, repaired/replaced each affected unit for free for 3 years, and has continually increased the hardware reliability.

    Oh, and PS3's aren't immune to hardware failures. Three of my friends with a PS3 have had hardware failures and have had to either purchase a new one or pay a ridiculous repair fee to have a working unit again.

    On topic - I'm in no rush for the next-gen consoles. They can take another 10 years to come out and I'd be happy.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianCC100 View Post
    PS3 has 3D technology and you can play games in 3D if you own a 3D television. I doubt new consoles will be available to buy in 2012, maybe they will show off their new consoles, but I don't think they will go on sale that year.

    The PS3 is the better system out of all three, in my own opinion. The PS3 is held back on cross platform games thanks to the Xbox 360 and Wii. Developers on cross platform games are too lazy to take advantage of PS3 capabilities or they just have no idea how to. That is why so many games are better on the Xbox 360 than they are on the PS3.

    Sure the PS3 had a high price, but you were paying for a quality system that will last you for years and years, unlike the Xbox 360 that had faulty power adapters and the famous red ring of death. I bought my PS3 when it was first released, it is still running very strong with no problems (Knock on wood).

    Yes I am a PS3 fanboy. =)
    I'm sure the lack of PS3 sales had nothing to do with the fact that the PS2 was the most craptasticly made system in history. It wasn't uncommon at all to read stories of people buying four or five of them because all the others they had broke down. Sony literally sold millions of PS2s from people having to buy a new one because of the previous one dying.

    Its also not the fault of the 360 or the Wii that people don't make games for the PS3. In the previous generation, except for exclusives, games were ALWAYS made for the PS2. It was the console with the most units out there. If thats not the case in this generation its the fault of Sony. The price tag of death they first slapped on the thing prevented console sales. So right now it is the 'least popular' of the three in terms of units sold, so of course thats going to effect what games are made from it.

    To be honest, I think people are just getting kind of sick of Sony. They can't do anything themselves, they have to copy Nintendo in everything they do. Every major innovation or idea Nintendo has for consoles, Sony copies. They have been doing it for 15 years since the original Playstation and I think people are just getting bored with Sony's lack of original ideas. Yeah MS has copied some stuff to, Kinect for one, but they come up with some stuff on their own, or at least not blatently copy everything Nintendo does right away. Other then kinect of course.

  9. #9
    What did Sony copy from Nintendo other then Playstation Move? I never played on a Nintendo console, but I do know Sony was teamed up with Nintendo until Sony decided to come out with the Playstation. I don't know what Sony copied from Nintendo other then the Playstation Move, but everyone copies everyone these days. Look at the the MMO, you can claim many MMOs copied stuff from World of Warcraft and you can say World of Warcraft copied from earlier MMOs and books like Lord of the Rings.

    Back on topic.

    I agree that we wont see anything new from Sony for at least another few years, but only Sony knows when they want to announce another console. I expect the Playstation 4, or whatever they decide to call their next system, will be a very powerful system and will be successful. I know I will be buying one. =)

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianCC100 View Post
    What did Sony copy from Nintendo other then Playstation Move? I never played on a Nintendo console, but I do know Sony was teamed up with Nintendo until Sony decided to come out with the Playstation. I don't know what Sony copied from Nintendo other then the Playstation Move, but everyone copies everyone these days. Look at the the MMO, you can claim many MMOs copied stuff from World of Warcraft and you can say World of Warcraft copied from earlier MMOs and books like Lord of the Rings.
    The Playstation for starters. Nintendo was working with Sony to make a disc based console after the snes. Well nintendo changed their minds about the deal and pulled out it seems, but apparently didn't get a copyright for the work and so sony was able to take what they were working on and make a video game console themselves. You know this as the original playstation.

    Next would be analog controllers for consoles. Sure it wasn't new, but sony didn't come out with the analog controller for the PS until after the n64 came out and they saw how popular the controller was with accuracy and being able to handle stuff. The original ps controller didn't have the analog sticks on it. Imagine trying to play PS games with just a D pad. Next would be the rumble pack that nintendo came out with and then sony copied. I'm not sure about the memory cards. I think those were on the ps at launch, but I can't remember.

    Games are also something sony has copied to try and counter the popularity of nintendo's characters. Crash bandicoot was sony's answer to mario kart. Though it was never anywhere near as popular or as good, and is now an all but dead franchise. Although I will say that I do love ratchet and clank which is the counter to mario for platformer games. I have only played the first three on the ps2, but I love them and have tons of fun.

    Fast forwarding to more recent years. Wireless controllers and motion sensing is the latest to be copied from nintendo. Nintendo isn't even always the ones to first to invent some of this stuff, but the fact remains that sony doesn't do it themselves until after nintendo does. The one thing I wish sony would copy from nintendo though is the quality of their consoles. I don't know where sony gets the playstations built, but I have no idea how their consoles can cost more money AND be made with inferior parts. The ps2 was the worst built console of all time.
    Last edited by Andrac; 2010-11-01 at 11:48 PM.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Andrac View Post
    PC gaming isn't limited by "gimped consoles" either. If you don't like the quality of the pc games or graphics thats not the fault of the console makers. Your beef is with pc gaming companies and/or their parts makers. You seem to not know a whole lot about the video game industry or business either if you think it would be a good idea for the next xbox to do just downloads and no physical disc. If you did you would know that would be the downfall of the xbox brand. They would fail. Utterly and miserably. If pc gaming hasn't gone to a download only approach then there is no possible way a console company would even consider that.

    One thing we can be sure of is that whatever Nintendo does that turns out to be cool and popular, Sony will copy it. Its the reason for their existence and success in video games.
    I can't take your response seriously, sorry, and I'm pretty sure I've got a pretty good idea of what's going on in the gaming industry. And since you don't offer any sources or proof of your points, I'm just going to have to assume you pulled them out of your arse.

    Fact: Microsoft generates almost 50% of its XBox revenues from downloadable content. Classic disc sales make up the remaining half.
    Fact: Publishers have a much higher revenue on d/l content. That's why they love DLC. No logistics, no "production" costs for disks etc. Source: http://www.gamestar.de/index.cfm?pid=675&pk=2318920

    What's stopping them from going full-download is customer acceptance. Currently most players still prefer to be "holding a disk in their hand" when buying a full-price game. However, this trend is dissipating slowly. Blizzards "digital download" is an example of that, as is STEAM.
    Last edited by Dee-Jay Delicious; 2010-11-05 at 12:32 AM.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Andrac View Post
    The Playstation for starters. Nintendo was working with Sony to make a disc based console after the snes. Well nintendo changed their minds about the deal and pulled out it seems, but apparently didn't get a copyright for the work and so sony was able to take what they were working on and make a video game console themselves. You know this as the original playstation.

    Next would be analog controllers for consoles. Sure it wasn't new, but sony didn't come out with the analog controller for the PS until after the n64 came out and they saw how popular the controller was with accuracy and being able to handle stuff. The original ps controller didn't have the analog sticks on it. Imagine trying to play PS games with just a D pad. Next would be the rumble pack that nintendo came out with and then sony copied. I'm not sure about the memory cards. I think those were on the ps at launch, but I can't remember.

    Games are also something sony has copied to try and counter the popularity of nintendo's characters. Crash bandicoot was sony's answer to mario kart. Though it was never anywhere near as popular or as good, and is now an all but dead franchise. Although I will say that I do love ratchet and clank which is the counter to mario for platformer games. I have only played the first three on the ps2, but I love them and have tons of fun.

    Fast forwarding to more recent years. Wireless controllers and motion sensing is the latest to be copied from nintendo. Nintendo isn't even always the ones to first to invent some of this stuff, but the fact remains that sony doesn't do it themselves until after nintendo does. The one thing I wish sony would copy from nintendo though is the quality of their consoles. I don't know where sony gets the playstations built, but I have no idea how their consoles can cost more money AND be made with inferior parts. The ps2 was the worst built console of all time.
    Sony had every right to claim the console they were working on with Nintendo. Both companies put their fair share of ideas into the console. Just because Nintendo decided to back out on the deal does not mean Sony stole from Nintendo. Why should Sony stop developing the console just because Nintendo backed out of the deal?

    Controllers? Really? I don't have a response for this other then look at the Xbox controller. It resembles the N64 controller more then what the PS2 controller does.

    I never played the games you mentioned because I was not interested in those type of video games so I don't have anything to say about that.

    That is your opinion about the Playstation 2 being the worst console built. The PS2 is a solid system and as I said in my above post, the two PS2 I bought are still running like new and I have never had any issues with them. So, in my opinion, the PS2 is one of the best consoles built for it's time. See what I did there? That is whats so great about opinions is that you are never wrong. =)
    Last edited by AdrianCC100; 2010-11-02 at 03:00 PM.

  13. #13
    Pandaren Monk Nahte's Avatar
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    I just wonder what they'll be called.

    XBOX 720? PS4? Something else?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ayirasi View Post
    You're right. Blizzard shouldn't have temporarily banned you. They should have sent a couple employees to your residence to Jay and Silent Bob you.
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    I saved a man's life today by performing brain surgery and removing a tumor the size of a quarter from his frontal lobes. God damnit I wish I wasn't ignorant though, cause I have no idea what an LSAT is. I don't know the radius of the Moon either.
    I took part in the LSAT/Cataclysm release date thread.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Crowe View Post
    I can't take your response seriously, sorry, and I'm pretty sure I've got a pretty good idea of what's going on in the gaming industry. And since you don't offer any sources or proof of your points, I'm just going to have to assume you pulled them out of your arse.

    Fact: Microsoft generates almost 50% of its XBox revenues from downloadable content. Classic disc sales make up the remaining half.
    Fact: Publishers have a much higher revenue on d/l content. That's why they love DLC. No logistics, no "production" costs for disks etc.

    What's stopping them from going full-download is customer acceptance. Currently most players still prefer to be "holding a disk in their hand" when buying a full-price game. However, this trend is dissipating slowly. Blizzards "digital download" is an example of that, as is STEAM.
    So basically you are going to say you can't take my post seriously because I give no sources, but then go on to give me some "facts".......with no sources. Great logic, you would do the vulcans proud.

    Even assuming your numbers are correct, how much of that DLC is ACTUAL games. I'm talking about stuff like madden or fable or any other major published game. Not fun little mini game stuff or extra levels for a disc based game. But actual games you can download for the 360 thats also sold in the store.

    I find it hard to take your post seriously as you have given no evidence you know much about the video game industry. As I said, if PCs have not gone digital only then consoles won't. Blizzard and steam are not an example of a trend. Two companies. Almost every PC game is sold as a physical disc even if it has the option of it being downloadable, and not a whole lot do. There is a major difference between downloadable CONTENT and downloadable GAMES, and you give the impression that you don't understand that difference. Any console that went download only would all but kill the RPG and platformer genres on that system as those two most of the time single player and offline. Not to mention downloading only will NEVER catch on to the majority so long as companies continue to charge just as much to download the game as to buy the physical disc with the game manual and anything else in the box.

    Again I go back to my original point though, if you are upset with PC gaming then thats an issue with PC game developers and hardware makers. PCs have always been better in terms of power and graphics. So if you feel its not good enough you need to either buy a better computer, or complain to the makers to do a better job on the games/parts.

  15. #15
    The Hedgehog Elementium's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianCC100 View Post
    PS3 has 3D technology and you can play games in 3D if you own a 3D television. I doubt new consoles will be available to buy in 2012, maybe they will show off their new consoles, but I don't think they will go on sale that year.

    The PS3 is the better system out of all three, in my own opinion. The PS3 is held back on cross platform games thanks to the Xbox 360 and Wii. Developers on cross platform games are too lazy to take advantage of PS3 capabilities or they just have no idea how to. That is why so many games are better on the Xbox 360 than they are on the PS3.

    Sure the PS3 had a high price, but you were paying for a quality system that will last you for years and years, unlike the Xbox 360 that had faulty power adapters and the famous red ring of death. I bought my PS3 when it was first released, it is still running very strong with no problems (Knock on wood).

    Yes I am a PS3 fanboy. =)
    Well it's sony's fault they don't have the game variety. They shot themselves in the foot thinking people would spend nearly a grand for a game console. PS3 is better technology but who cares? Xbox 360 still looks great.

    The tech stuff can stay with real PC's. When it comes to consoles all it comes down to is, does it work? does it look good? and is it fun?

  16. #16
    We won't see the full potential of the current DirectX until the consoles have it. That's why it's important that the next generation consoles have at least DX12. It might be possible if Windows 8 is ready in 2 years.
    Last edited by haxartus; 2010-11-03 at 08:39 AM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Elementium View Post
    Well it's sony's fault they don't have the game variety. They shot themselves in the foot thinking people would spend nearly a grand for a game console. PS3 is better technology but who cares? Xbox 360 still looks great.

    The tech stuff can stay with real PC's. When it comes to consoles all it comes down to is, does it work? does it look good? and is it fun?
    Does the PS3 work: Yes

    Does the PS3 look good: Yes

    Is the PS3 fun: Yes

    =)

  18. #18
    Mechagnome Gecko's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianCC100 View Post
    Does the PS3 work: Yes

    Does the PS3 look good: Yes

    Is the PS3 fun: Yes

    =)
    The same can be said for all consoles currently on the market. They wouldn't sell otherwise. They all work, they all look great (and unique) and they all provide plenty of fun. It's whether or not any of that is a struggle for the manufacturer to accomplish which pushes the development of a new console. I think the current consoles have a lot of life left before they will be replaced (with the exception of the Wii which is quickly falling behind technologically).

  19. #19
    The Hedgehog Elementium's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdrianCC100 View Post
    Does the PS3 work: Yes

    Does the PS3 look good: Yes

    Is the PS3 fun: Yes

    =)
    BUT the PS3 works too well. It's overkill and (was)over priced. If people wanted to buy a PC (Which Sony was claiming the PS3 was) they'd buy a PC.

  20. #20
    Microsoft - Jumping on the 3D and Motion Control bandwagon. Hardcore games are scarce.

    Sony - Jumping on the 3D and Motion Control bandwagon. Hardcore games are scarce.

    Nintendo - SSDD

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