Lol Blood Craze

[steveee]

With that "fix" now rogues can beat warriors.

Balanced.

PD: Why they didn't "fix" rogues yet? We're on the same thing...

They should fix rogues but theres lots of randomness, but warriors are in a really fine state right now (if your a warrior) and they are disgusting if you wear cloth.

I play both a disc priest and a lock on beta - on the lock which had at the time 90k hp, 3000 resilience, i was killed in 5 seconds by a warrior - he literally charged, knockdown, collosus smash then a bunch of 20k numbers came up and the duel was over.

On the priest i have to use pw:barrier/pain suppression almost immediately, when those expire and he gets another colosus smash, i get globaled.

Atleast with the rogues i know i have little chance of killing them (sometimes with luck on the lock i can because he also has alot of self-heals), but i can tank them 10x as long as i can warriors

[Autumn xD]

Well, all of the people crying about the change obviously are not on the Beta.
Having played as and against a Warrior, this change was much needed, ESPECIALLY for Prot.
As a matter of fact, before the restart, there were at least 4 people on a single Prot Warrior, and with no roots being put on the Warrior, he was not dropping. Then a Holy Paladin came and I walked away.

The change was needed. When I can get kited by a Frost Mage, play half-ass, and still stay in a reasonable health range, something is wrong.

[Freedom]

I just guess it seemed like a silly thing to nerf but if that's what was happening on beta the nerf was needed. Mainly thinking from a PVE DPS viewpoint too.

[Alianthos]

This talent, with my tanking gear on, would easily put me #3 overall HEALING in BG's.

I can totally see why its nerfed.

[Vojka]

If you combine second wind heals and blood craze heals even with this nerf, thats 8% of your HP, and considering that warriors will have around 100k HP at 85 thats 8000 hp, not to mention blood craze is practically always up, dont forget field dressing talent bumps it up even more, the nerf is justified, stop QQing and learn to adapt, and the talent was mostly a pvp talent thats where it was useful mostly lol.

[Neichus]

He just misunderstood the person he quoted. It was poorly written to be honest. Saying that stamina received a 40% buff is misleading. Saying we have about 40% more stamina at 85 makes more sense. 3% heal at 100K hp should be close to 7.5% heal at 60K hp makes even more sense. The way it was wrote was as if there was some buff that happened where stam had a higher value or worth conversion compared to now. Instead he just meant health totals.

Actually, there was, at least according to ArenaJunkies: http://www.arenajunkies.com/showthread.php?t=214382

The relevant point being that stam got buffed from 10 to 14 HP per point, so the guy was right with his 40% statement and now my question is answered.

[JustintimeSS]

Actually, there was, at least according to ArenaJunkies: http://www.arenajunkies.com/showthread.php?t=214382

The relevant point being that stam got buffed from 10 to 14 HP per point, so the guy was right with his 40% statement and now my question is answered.

See things like that should be a little easier to find. I tried searching for it and found jack. I also never even noticed it in Beta at 85 (herpderp on my part).

And yeah, regardless the point is still there I suppose. The change to stamina or not BC will be about the same it is now at 85.

Thanks for the find, that is good business.

[Neichus]

Yeah, I ran across it in a thread over on the DK forums. I would have thought that this *little* detail of buffing the average health of level 85s by around 20k would have warranted some mention in the patch notes.

[WTBskillplz]

better just change blood craze to some useless junk now i'd rather have "3/3 You suddenly drop your weapon to the ground and asks for a time-out"

HA! Now that is a talent i would like to see

[Deleted]

getting a bit tired of posting this, but it seems the community has still not understood it.

These changes are being modeled for lvl 85. IN cata HP pools will be twice as big, and incoming damage will only increase by roughly 1.5%. 3% HP regeneration is still a lot. - lets just see how it works out on lvl 85 okay? and than start complaining if you are no longer invincible...

[JustintimeSS]

getting a bit tired of posting this, but it seems the community has still not understood it.

These changes are being modeled for lvl 85. IN cata HP pools will be twice as big, and incoming damage will only increase by roughly 1.5%. 3% HP regeneration is still a lot. - lets just see how it works out on lvl 85 okay? and than start complaining if you are no longer invincible...

Not the warrior community in general. Just some people who always cry nerf. It really is nothing new for a vast amount of people to not grasp a change.

Also, I just checked on beta. I have 150K hp as a premade warrior unbuffed. 60 stam gems give you 840hp. That would be 14 hp per 1 stam.

[Racetrack]

Don't care about PvP.

A little annoying for tanking but there are other talents to take.

Very annoying for soloing old content and leveling 80-85.

[xebtria]

I wasn't going to take this in my raid spec anyways. however, my "I can solo old stuff"-heart crys...
luckily, this is only a beta patch, so it stays on live until well until cata hits... currently, it heals for about 900 per tick (50k life, 9% over 5 seconds = 900 per second), which is pretty good for soloing old stuff. this on live would be like 3%*1,2 (field dressing) * 0,2 (5 ticks in 5 seconds) * 50.000 per second = 360 per second. that's a joke.

compare that to 150k tanks (3 times the health), it is 1080 per second. sorry, but this is NOTHING.

Not that I liked it that much anyways (except for soloing stuff, right?), but now it's really shit.

[cococabana]

I wasn't going to take this in my raid spec anyways. however, my "I can solo old stuff"-heart crys...
luckily, this is only a beta patch, so it stays on live until well until cata hits... currently, it heals for about 900 per tick (50k life, 9% over 5 seconds = 900 per second), which is pretty good for soloing old stuff. this on live would be like 3%*1,2 (field dressing) * 0,2 (5 ticks in 5 seconds) * 50.000 per second = 360 per second. that's a joke.

compare that to 150k tanks (3 times the health), it is 1080 per second. sorry, but this is NOTHING.

Not that I liked it that much anyways (except for soloing stuff, right?), but now it's really shit.

I'm sorry, but 1k hps for a non healing class is pretty good. Before the nerf, warriors healed themselves for a good deal more than a healer would have spamming their efficient heals. I'm sorry, but a warrior, rogue, or dk or anybody else should not do more passive healing in pvp than a dedicated healer provides. And with the mana constraints on heals, poor regen and throughput stats on pvp gear, that's exactly what was happening. If I am following a warrior around with the purpose of keeping him alive, he should not do more healing than I do, simple as that.

Also, this has some bad pve implications as well. In an environment where healer mana is constrained, dps/tank talents like this are good because they save healers mana. But if it's too good, then the healers don't have to heal you. You'll just top yourself off without their aid. Thus, the healers will not be challenged and content will be trivial.

So, to challenge the healers, raid damage must be brought up to the point where it counteracts this. That, in turn, will make the talent mandatory for all specs of the class for raiding because the healer's would not be able to keep you alive otherwise.

Also, this would increase the burst damage on the raid and require more healing for the classes that don't have as good self healing. Meaning that the healers will go oom faster because they have to use more and larger heals to counteract the damage. Meaning healers will in turn need more mana and a healing buff. Dps classes will need a dps buff to counteract the self healing in pvp (meaning healing will again need a buff) and will need a dps buff in pve as well to counteract the dps loss of speccing into all the survivability/healing talents as well as having to use any non passive ones frequently to meet enrage timers.

So, the system that blizzard is trying to build just comes crashing down, and we end up right where we were in wrath, just that everyone has a lot more health, but nothing has changed.

[Xenryusho]

I'm sorry, but 1k hps for a non healing class is pretty good. Before the nerf, warriors healed themselves for a good deal more than a healer would have spamming their efficient heals. I'm sorry, but a warrior, rogue, or dk or anybody else should not do more passive healing in pvp than a dedicated healer provides. And with the mana constraints on heals, poor regen and throughput stats on pvp gear, that's exactly what was happening. If I am following a warrior around with the purpose of keeping him alive, he should not do more healing than I do, simple as that.

.... A healer at 85... Spamming an efficent heal.. Won't heal more then 1000 health per second.. So it would take over 150 seconds to heal a character to full health. Is 2.5 minutes not long enough for someone to die at level 85? I'm not on beta but I can't imagine that damage in pvp is that bad at level 85.

[cococabana]

At 85, the efficient heal heals for 6-7k on a 2.5s cast time. On the premade with full epic 359 gear, my priest had well under 10% haste. The cast time with haste was 2.4s. That amounts to just under 3k hps. Before the nerf, that lone talent was worth 2500 hps. Now figure in things like second wind, field dressing, and blood thirst along with healer pushback, interrupts, silences, etc and warriors were healing themselves more than the healer was. Yes.

edit - oh, and I forgot victory rush as well.

[Spondoo]

They said they're thinking of buffing the HP pools even more, thats why most of the self healings from some classes got nerfed, so it _should_ balance out in the end.

Besides fury is OP with 57% HP enraged regen w/ full mastery XD

[Enkidulgaa]

I wonder why they havent fixed Rogue self healing yet. Even without the recent change to Subtlety mastery Recuperate healed you for 2% HP/sec while taking 6% reduced damage from all sources.

[Volitans]

As much as i hate to admit it, i think this was deserved.

I have 3/3 blood craze, and find my healing done more than spriests (i do have the glyph too)

Good to get in the Cata- self healing, healers' mana preservation mode now imo.

[Shyzhi]

Seeing at 85 in pvp items (blue) you have around 130 - 140k hp or somthing stupid, 3% isnt that bad seeing as it heals slightly more if you have that talent in arms tree.