Ret priority change?

[RehabOC80]

So now that Exo got a buff, and I'm seeing it do more damage than TV...Does Exo pass TV on the priority list? or do you still do a TV first so you are able to generate more HP, since letting TV sit ultimately messes up your rotation and doesn't allow you to generate another HP because you would be full.

Just checking so I can adjust my addon accordingly.

[Badpaladin]

Yes it does. Your priority should be exactly as it was on beta, ie:

(inquisition) > Exo > TV > CS > TV(HoL) > J > HW > Cons

[belfpala]

Exo only with AoW proc, just to clarify.

[RehabOC80]

Yes it does. Your priority should be exactly as it was on beta, ie:

(inquisition) > Exo > TV > CS > TV(HoL) > J > HW > Cons

I was never on Beta, so I didn't follow the Beta priority, but thank you.

Why is an HoL Proc of TV lower than CS, but a normal TV(3HP) is higher?

Also, is HoW still above everything?

[Badpaladin]

I was never on Beta, so I didn't follow the Beta priority, but thank you.

Why is an HoL Proc of TV lower than CS, but a normal TV(3HP) is higher?

Just sort of the way HP generation works. If you use TV -> CS then you lengthen the time it takes to get to 3HP unless you proc DP, but that's relying on DP in the first place. Also, CS -> TV -> filler -> CS(1 proc) is better than TV -> CS -> filler -> filler -> CS. Obviously if DP proc'd twice in a row both would be equal, but that's not very likely to happen to it's inadvisable to do that.

[RehabOC80]

Just sort of the way HP generation works. If you use TV -> CS then you lengthen the time it takes to get to 3HP unless you proc DP, but that's relying on DP in the first place. Also, CS -> TV -> filler -> CS(1 proc) is better than TV -> CS -> filler -> filler -> CS. Obviously if DP proc'd twice in a row both would be equal, but that's not very likely to happen to it's inadvisable to do that.

^^ That confused me a little bit, but I'm assuming it has to do w/ the fast that you can basicly get 4 HP at once(summazrizing the EJ post) about it proccing a HP and what not...bla bla.

Either way, I can't adjust my addon to show if it's a HoL TV Proc or a 3HP TV Proc, but while leveling it won't matter, when raiding I'll fix that if it's still the case at 85. It's sad that Ret priority is kind of such a giant mess w/ the FCFS, the haste/latency for CS and with fillers...I love the FCFS playstyle of the pally and all the procs, but it's not smooth at all.

[Badpaladin]

^^ That confused me a little bit, but I'm assuming it has to do w/ the fast that you can basicly get 4 HP at once(summazrizing the EJ post) about it proccing a HP and what not...bla bla.

That too. My reasoning was:

CS -> TV -> filler -> CS -> filler -> filler -> CS is better than

TV -> CS -> filler ->filler -> CS -> filler -> filler -> CS, assuming no procs. Obviously if you get the probably "right" amount of DP procs both would be equal, but that's rather unlikely. And yes, CS(@2HP) -> TV -> TV is better than TV -> CS -> TV because you can potentially start with 2HP for the next cycle.

Either way, I can't adjust my addon to show if it's a HoL TV Proc or a 3HP TV Proc, but while leveling it won't matter, when raiding I'll fix that if it's still the case at 85. It's sad that Ret priority is kind of such a giant mess w/ the FCFS, the haste/latency for CS and with fillers...I love the FCFS playstyle of the pally and all the procs, but it's not smooth at all.

Eh, that sucks about the addon. I'd PM requital about it, there may be some kind of code snipet for you to input into Clcinfo so it'll do that. As for FCFS, the new spell queue screwed up any sense of normalcy we had with a 3.0s CS. Oh well, I don't like less consistency but we'll have to live with it.

[RehabOC80]

That too. My reasoning was:

CS -> TV -> filler -> CS -> filler -> filler -> CS is better than

TV -> CS -> filler ->filler -> CS -> filler -> filler -> CS, assuming no procs. Obviously if you get the probably "right" amount of DP procs both would be equal, but that's rather unlikely. And yes, CS(@2HP) -> TV -> TV is better than TV -> CS -> TV because you can potentially start with 2HP for the next cycle.



Eh, that sucks about the addon. I'd PM requital about it, there may be some kind of code snipet for you to input into Clcinfo so it'll do that. As for FCFS, the new spell queue screwed up any sense of normalcy we had with a 3.0s CS. Oh well, I don't like less consistency but we'll have to live with it.

I feel like they said their aim was to have less bursty and more consistent DPS...and yet I constantly get procs of Exo for 11k, HoL Procs for TV Crits at 8k(Yes my DPS is horrid, but this was an Alt toon w/ Prot main spec so he's in Naxx/Ulduar - 200ish gear lol) but none the less, the statement stands. I've been out farming and it feels every 3rd mob I start w/ an AoW proc to Crit and Exo and Hit it w/ HoW before it even really aggros to me lol. I just don't see any reduction in a burst like they had said they were doing(mostly for PvP) but instead an increase in Procc/RNG Burst.

[Badpaladin]

I've got mixed views. After watching(and posting) some beta videos it's pretty clear to me that burst is nowhere near as bad as it was in wotlk. Obviously if you're low health it matters, but if you're that low then you pretty much lost anyways. At least in PvP, you have enough health such that you can Judge and run around a pillar long before you die...and that I like. At the same time, reliance on procs has gone up, and that I don't like.

Oh, and I'm a moron and forgot to read the HoW part. It should be:

Inquisition > HoW > Exo > rest

[RehabOC80]

I've got mixed views. After watching(and posting) some beta videos it's pretty clear to me that burst is nowhere near as bad as it was in wotlk. Obviously if you're low health it matters, but if you're that low then you pretty much lost anyways. At least in PvP, you have enough health such that you can Judge and run around a pillar long before you die...and that I like. At the same time, reliance on procs has gone up, and that I don't like.

Oh, and I'm a moron and forgot to read the HoW part. It should be:

Inquisition > HoW > Exo > rest

Has inquistion been formulated to see if it REALLY is a DPS increase? I remember reading on EJ that it was only a 2-3% increase at best, and eventually it might be more of an inc to just drop it from the rotation altogether.

I know as of now it should be, but did any of the changes effect(Affect? I forget which it would be) the outcome on that thus far?

[Badpaladin]

Has inquistion been formulated to see if it REALLY is a DPS increase? I remember reading on EJ that it was only a 2-3% increase at best, and eventually it might be more of an inc to just drop it from the rotation altogether.

It's around a 5-7% DPS increase, so nothing spectacular. It will get worse in t12 if there aren't any modifications to it via spell itself or set bonuses because physical scaling is better than holy scaling. Other than that, yeah, it's nothing spectacular at all.

I know as of now it should be, but did any of the changes effect(Affect? I forget which it would be) the outcome on that thus far?

Exorcism change increases the value, Censure change decreases it, heh. It's say it's around the same area give or take 1%.

[slider]

with exo increaing in priority, do you thing the exo glyph will become viable?

[Alindra]

with exo increaing in priority, do you thing the exo glyph will become viable?

This was asked in a different thread, and it very well may become one of our primary glyphs. The problem is that the glyph is still bugged and is only adding a dot for 20% of the base damage dealt, not 20% of the total damage.

[Badpaladin]

with exo increaing in priority, do you thing the exo glyph will become viable?

Yes, it should be one of your glpyhs now, replacing CS.

[Deleted]

Yes it does. Your priority should be exactly as it was on beta, ie:

(inquisition) > Exo > TV > CS > TV(HoL) > J > HW > Cons

I know it's a situation that is very unlikely to occur but if we were somehow at 3HP with CS off cooldown and a HoL proc up, we would then prioritise the HoL TV, correct? Just checking because I would feel dumb if there was a reason to use CS at 3HP and I was missing it.

[Badpaladin]

I know it's a situation that is very unlikely to occur but if we were somehow at 3HP with CS off cooldown and a HoL proc up, we would then prioritise the HoL TV, correct? Just checking because I would feel dumb if there was a reason to use CS at 3HP and I was missing it.

What I posted was just the "basic" stuff. If you had a HoL proc at 3HP you use it, obviously. Using CS keeps your real TV off cooldown longer, which is bad. What I meant with later explanation is:

@2HP - CS -> TV -> TV is better than TV->TV(assuming DP procs), because the first one can start you off with 2HP for the next cycle even if the damage is the same.

[Deleted]

What I posted was just the "basic" stuff. If you had a HoL proc at 3HP you use it, obviously. Using CS keeps your real TV off cooldown longer, which is bad. What I meant with later explanation is:

@2HP - CS -> TV -> TV is better than TV->TV(assuming DP procs), because the first one can start you off with 2HP for the next cycle even if the damage is the same.

Yeah, I understand. Thanks for clearing it up though.

Do you know if we're still using AW first then Zealotry straight after, btw?

[Badpaladin]

Yeah, I understand. Thanks for clearing it up though.

Do you know if we're still using AW first then Zealotry straight after, btw?

I'd say yes simple because AW is a much bigger DPS increase thatn Zealotry, but perhaps using them together now won't be as detrimental because you can't chain together CS->TV anymore due to the queue change, allowing you to weave HoW in there. I'd wait for more math on that though, and stick to the first.

[Deleted]

Don't really like using them together anyway, feels so slow when waiting to get back to damaging spells.

Thanks for the help.