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  1. #21
    Dreadlord Kenai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypernetic View Post
    I see focused insight as more of a PVP talent, with unleash elements doing a similar thing while healing someone in the process I'm not sure how much we'd be using it. I'm using it now though, and it's kinda fun =D.

    Also, I suspect there will be a sort of "soft cap" for mastery. Basically you'd want to stop stacking it once it's overhealing too much. That number will likely change as the expansion goes on and people have more stam.
    I could see sets based more around tank healing that used more Mastery, or perhaps if more fight like Dreamwalker were released. It will need more testing in the future.

    Regarding hit, hmm. I was one of the people complaining about Resto with regards to hit as well, but it wasn't just because of TC. It was TC, FI, Purge, Bind Elemental, Wind Shock and Hex all together added up that kinda irritated me. I didn't care about TC as much when I found out how good Mana Tide was, but even without FI as well, the rest are still basic spells we are expected to use as Resto Shaman that we don't have hit for. Add the two talents together and that's six spells. Is wanting hit for them without having to talent into another tree really outrageous?

    The chance of missing a CC spell even once or twice on a dangerous mob in a raid means that will we be lower on the totem pole for viability of the spells, and I'm especially irritated Purge suffers from this since it counted against us when Blizzard tallied healer cleanse abilities (nevermind that Purge is kinda pathetic defensive magic removal compared to a Priest or even a Mage, but that's another argument). So it will be that much harder to get any hit gear since it's simply not on caster mail gear anymore. Then again, I'm not sure hit gear would ever be viable, but it would have been nice to at least have the opportunity to test it.

  2. #22
    Here is the problem with giving healers easy access to +hit talents: They will always be asked to be the <spell> bitch. If healers can dispel without missing, why make the DPS do it? Since Cataclysm is moving away from bosses two shotting tanks if they aren't kept at 100% health at all times, healers will have free GCDs. If those free GCDs can be used for dispels, then raid leaders will let the DPS continue to DPS while the healer dispels.

    Bind Elemental and Hex aren't huge concerns since adds are not classified as bosses so your miss chance is much lower. If the mob is really dangerous and needs an immediate CC, multiple people will do it just to be safe.

    Alternatively, having no hit is can be a really bad thing. My guild, and likely others, used a paladin healer to heal the tank on Steelbreaker for both normal and heroic mode. That same healer was in charge of dispelling fusion punch. Multiple times, our healer had a miss on their dispel and we wiped. RNG determining a boss kill is not fun.

    So, what is a happy medium? Blizzard already made it. By changing bosses from 2 shotting tanks to steady moderate damage, there is no immediate need for a dispel or CC. Will there be some bosses that will need immediate dispels/CC? Of course. On those fights, you can make a DPS do it. Otherwise, anyone with a free GCD is a perfectly viable candidate.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Rahdik View Post
    Alternatively, having no hit is can be a really bad thing. My guild, and likely others, used a paladin healer to heal the tank on Steelbreaker for both normal and heroic mode. That same healer was in charge of dispelling fusion punch. Multiple times, our healer had a miss on their dispel and we wiped. RNG determining a boss kill is not fun.
    Which is why guilds that understood that that particular debuff required hit to dispel and brought a proper raid comp put a Spriest/Ret Paladin on it.

    No problem with the rest of your post though. You're fairly spot on.
    I love arguing! BRING ON THE TROLLS!

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  4. #24
    Dreadlord Kenai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rahdik View Post
    Here is the problem with giving healers easy access to +hit talents: They will always be asked to be the <spell> bitch. If healers can dispel without missing, why make the DPS do it? Since Cataclysm is moving away from bosses two shotting tanks if they aren't kept at 100% health at all times, healers will have free GCDs. If those free GCDs can be used for dispels, then raid leaders will let the DPS continue to DPS while the healer dispels.

    Bind Elemental and Hex aren't huge concerns since adds are not classified as bosses so your miss chance is much lower. If the mob is really dangerous and needs an immediate CC, multiple people will do it just to be safe.

    Alternatively, having no hit is can be a really bad thing. My guild, and likely others, used a paladin healer to heal the tank on Steelbreaker for both normal and heroic mode. That same healer was in charge of dispelling fusion punch. Multiple times, our healer had a miss on their dispel and we wiped. RNG determining a boss kill is not fun.

    So, what is a happy medium? Blizzard already made it. By changing bosses from 2 shotting tanks to steady moderate damage, there is no immediate need for a dispel or CC. Will there be some bosses that will need immediate dispels/CC? Of course. On those fights, you can make a DPS do it. Otherwise, anyone with a free GCD is a perfectly viable candidate.
    You make some good points I did not consider. As small as one GCD for dispelling can realistically be for a dps, even that sometimes is considered "too much to ask", apparently almost as much so as not standing in fire or something similar.

    Your Steelbreaker example reminds me of one of the main reasons I wanted a hit boost option as a Restoration Shaman, though. My guild's first night on the LK 10 man (fairly soon after release), I got pulled into Frostmourne on one of our better attempts. When the boss drained the ghost, I Windshocked like I was supposed to. I missed. I spammed healing spells again, then Windshocked once again when the time came, missing once again. I of course couldn't recover after that, he raged and we wiped. This situation of course does not happen very often, but I was quite unhappy that I was put into such a situation at all. It didn't seem fair to me and certainly not to my friends. I can't be sure there won't be similar mechanics elsewhere where my ability to CC would have mattered, but I do relent to say that more often than not it would hit.
    Last edited by Kenai; 2010-12-01 at 09:27 PM.

  5. #25
    Dreadlord Tehfred's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rahdik View Post
    Here is the problem with giving healers easy access to +hit talents: They will always be asked to be the <spell> bitch. If healers can dispel without missing, why make the DPS do it? Since Cataclysm is moving away from bosses two shotting tanks if they aren't kept at 100% health at all times, healers will have free GCDs. If those free GCDs can be used for dispels, then raid leaders will let the DPS continue to DPS while the healer dispels.

    Bind Elemental and Hex aren't huge concerns since adds are not classified as bosses so your miss chance is much lower. If the mob is really dangerous and needs an immediate CC, multiple people will do it just to be safe.

    Alternatively, having no hit is can be a really bad thing. My guild, and likely others, used a paladin healer to heal the tank on Steelbreaker for both normal and heroic mode. That same healer was in charge of dispelling fusion punch. Multiple times, our healer had a miss on their dispel and we wiped. RNG determining a boss kill is not fun.

    So, what is a happy medium? Blizzard already made it. By changing bosses from 2 shotting tanks to steady moderate damage, there is no immediate need for a dispel or CC. Will there be some bosses that will need immediate dispels/CC? Of course. On those fights, you can make a DPS do it. Otherwise, anyone with a free GCD is a perfectly viable candidate.
    I was the purge bitch on Jaraxxus, Deathwhisper (MC'd player buffs on her), etc., even with the WotLK healing model. Never had an issue with it. Maybe it's because I've PvP'd for so long I can manage multitasking like that well, but I've never seen the issue of making things easier for other raid members. That's what being a support class/role is all about, right?
    http://fredplz.wordpress.com/ - Thoughts of an obsessive Resto Shaman

  6. #26
    Spirit
    Haste
    Crit
    Mastery

    in that order

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