Sorry for the confusion chrth, I only meant the first part as an address to you. The rest was more my general take on the state of "omg pugs" which is in guild as well. I wasn't part of the first group of my guild to get up to 85, so I PuG'd my normals for gear, and then a fair chunk of heroics before we started to cycle enough members through guild groups. The biggest problem is usually lack of explanation for people unfamiliar with what to watch out for.
But guildies suffer that too.
My address is not to you, chrth, but to everyone. A wipe isn't that bad, give them a bit of credit and they might just surprise you