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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Dottibotti View Post
    Hello

    I know when there are warlocks you should not swap DI.
    But is it also wrong to have 2 warlocks using DI on the same person lets say the shadowpriest in your raid?

    sorry if this already answered couldn,t find it

    Dotti
    In general it would be better to not put it on the same target because you would be depriving the raid of a 3-stack of the DoT / HoT buff. If you can find an alternative target that you would expect to be able to keep the buff at 2 stacks then it would be better to put it on them.

    However, in 5-mans it can sometimes (read: very rarely) be a good idea.

    Example: I ended up in a guild 5-man heroic group with a warrior tank, a resto druid healer, and 2 other warlocks. We all put our DI buff on the healer, he got 3x 3% haste, all the warlocks never lost our 3-stacks :P

    Doomhammer EU

  2. #62
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    The heal from Vampiric Embrace cannot crit. You will receive a larger self-heal based on a DOT's higher damage on a critical strike, but the heal itself is not a crit. This should disprove the idea that Vampiric Embrace has been proccing Dark Intent by Shadow Priests.

  3. #63
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Good catch I'll review when I get back to my home pc.

    R.I.P. YARG

  4. #64
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by New View Post
    The heal from Vampiric Embrace cannot crit. You will receive a larger self-heal based on a DOT's higher damage on a critical strike, but the heal itself is not a crit. This should disprove the idea that Vampiric Embrace has been proccing Dark Intent by Shadow Priests.
    Vampiric Touch isnt Vampiric Embrace tho :P

    Looked at some logs of a few days ago, it seems there's 3 types of DI procs, with different spell ids.

    http://db.mmo-champion.com/s/94310/dark-intent/ (94310) is the stacking buff the warlock himself gets when someone he got DI on crits with their dots (Duús and Zharkoon are the 2 warlocks in the raid I looked at).
    Code:
    [19:08:55.198] Zharkoon gains Dark Intent from Zharkoon
    [19:08:55.997] Zharkoon gains Dark Intent (2) from Zharkoon
    [19:08:57.587] Duús gains Dark Intent from Duús
    [19:08:57.587] Zharkoon gains Dark Intent (3) from Zharkoon
    [19:08:57.632] Zharkoon's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:08:58.042] Duús gains Dark Intent (2) from Duús
    [19:09:00.409] Zharkoon's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:00.804] Duús gains Dark Intent (3) from Duús
    [19:09:02.411] Duús's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:04.012] Duús's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:04.822] Zharkoon's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:04.822] Zharkoon's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:05.230] Duús's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:05.622] Zharkoon's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:06.432] Duús's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:06.432] Zharkoon's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:07.252] Duús's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:07.636] Duús's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    http://db.mmo-champion.com/s/94318/dark-intent/ (94318) is the stacking buff the target of the DI gets when the warlock crits (boomkin in this case):
    Code:
    [19:08:55.198] Mephz gains Dark Intent from Duús
    [19:08:55.581] Mephz gains Dark Intent (2) from Duús
    [19:08:55.964] Mephz gains Dark Intent (3) from Duús
    [19:08:57.587] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:08:58.042] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:08:59.207] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:00.036] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:00.409] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:01.611] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:04.012] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:04.822] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:06.432] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:07.252] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:08.056] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:08.832] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:10.043] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    [19:09:10.413] Mephz's Dark Intent is refreshed by Duús
    Then there's http://db.mmo-champion.com/s/94311/dark-intent/ (94311):
    Code:
    [19:08:53.989] Zharkoon gains Dark Intent from Zharkoon
    [19:08:54.359] Ekkyo gains Dark Intent from Zharkoon
    [19:08:54.433] Zharkoon gains Dark Intent (2) from Zharkoon
    [19:08:54.808] Ekkyo gains Dark Intent (2) from Zharkoon
    [19:08:55.588] Zharkoon gains Dark Intent (3) from Zharkoon
    [19:08:55.997] Ekkyo gains Dark Intent (3) from Zharkoon
    [19:08:57.195] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:08:57.632] Zharkoon's Dark Intent fades from Zharkoon
    [19:08:58.042] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:08:59.581] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:00.036] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:01.611] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:02.826] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:03.218] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:03.606] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:04.460] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    [19:09:06.031] Ekkyo's Dark Intent is refreshed by Zharkoon
    As you can see for some reason both the warlock and the shadowpriest (Ekkyo) get stacks of these for a while...

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mihir View Post
    Vampiric Touch isnt Vampiric Embrace tho :P
    I don't understand what you mean by this.

  6. #66
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    I posted about vampiric touch, you replied talking about vampiric embrace.

  7. #67
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    I appologize. I was speaking about the post after yours in my post. Had I taken more care in the review of the previous posts, I would have seen your point in your response. All my testing had revolved around the Vampiric Embrace heals from Devouring Plague and Mind Flay. I'm interested in testing the idea that Vampiric Touch may have some unique properties in relation to Dark Intent.

  8. #68
    Fluffy Kitten Mihir's Avatar
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    After some more investigating it didnt seem to be related to VT however

  9. #69
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    That would have helped our legitimacy for the buff even more; tragic. Thank you for relating that information back before having to test it myself later.

  10. #70
    Devouring Plague heals the shadowpriest without vampiric embrace, maybe these crits count as critical heals and can proc the heal version of dark intent

  11. #71
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    That is true. But critical strikes of Devouring Plague through Vampiric Embrace and it's own healing mechanic do not appear to be able to crit so they cannot proc Dark Intent.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by gherkin View Post
    Frostfire mage is a primarily Frost spec using Frostfire bolt instead of Frostbolt.

    ---------- Post added 2010-12-16 at 02:24 PM ----------

    One thing I'd like to add - if you pick a target with less than 66% uptime on the warlock (basically Combat Rogue and lower) you run an increased risk of just never hitting 3 stacks of the buff, and therefore getting a lot less dps than listed.

    Probability sucks sometimes.
    What about Fire specced mages who use Frostfire bolt (and glyph) instead of Fireball? Would that be the same uptime as a regular Fire mage, or would it be higher due to the glyph?

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by neubs986 View Post
    What about Fire specced mages who use Frostfire bolt (and glyph) instead of Fireball? Would that be the same uptime as a regular Fire mage, or would it be higher due to the glyph?
    A fire mage using frostfire bolt and glyph of frostfire will unquestionably have better uptime of the buff IF both players have equal game skill, gear, talents etc and the fight is the same (they have an extra DoT rolling, and frostfire glyph critical ticks do refresh the dark intent buff). I can't comment on how using frostfire bolt over fireball will affect the mage's dps though.

    Doomhammer EU

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by TobiasX View Post
    A fire mage using frostfire bolt and glyph of frostfire will unquestionably have better uptime of the buff IF both players have equal game skill, gear, talents etc and the fight is the same (they have an extra DoT rolling, and frostfire glyph critical ticks do refresh the dark intent buff). I can't comment on how using frostfire bolt over fireball will affect the mage's dps though.
    Well since that is the case, I would be curious to see if that would trump Boomkin on the charts. Certainly shadow priest is still the best option, but perhaps a FFB mage would be better than a Boomkin.

    As for DPS, they are SUPPOSED to be equal in theory, as it was Blizzard's intention to balance them out, but I haven't been following mages in Cata so I have no clue if they actually are.

  15. #75
    I have to say if you used the default simcraft list of actions for a balance druid it is rather sub optimal, not to mention as I have heard the balance druid module isn't finished.
    Last edited by dark666105; 2011-01-02 at 12:35 PM.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Volviga View Post
    On a side-note:
    Is Hellfire considered a DoT? I read somewhere (Wowhead I think) that Drain Soul and Drain Life were considered a DoT, and since both Hellfire and Drain Life are channeled...
    To answer my own question:
    Yes, Hellfire is considered a DoT. I just noticed my Felguard got the proc (I was farming Embersilk, and I had to put it on something, didn't I?:P), but I only used Hellfire. So, Hellfire is considered a DoT, and therfore it will benefit from the +3/6/9% buff?

  17. #77
    Since this is just simulcrafting of the ability, I assume accepted typical spec and glyphs are used for showing the numbers and also player mistakes are removed from runs.
    My question is what is the avg upkeep of each of these classes listed? I'm geussing that the lower gains from classes such as MM hunters is primarly due to low Periodic Damage abilities and therfor a lower upkeep.

  18. #78
    Hello,

    I just wanted to get a second opinion on something. Would it be worth double stacking dark intents on a destruction warlock between 2202 and 2639 haste rating, thus giving them an extra tick of immolate (assuming my math was correct). I'm trying to leave out my own thoughts on this, but passing the threshold itself was an ~800 dps increase using the EJ priority list and BiS list in a simulation. That number won't be completely accurate since EJ's BiS list could use some work, but it should be accurate enough to draw some conclusions.
    Last edited by Faradin; 2011-01-03 at 07:54 PM.

  19. #79
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dark666105 View Post
    I have to say if you used the default simcraft list of actions for a balance druid it is rather sub optimal, not to mention as I have heard the balance druid module isn't finished.
    If you would be able to provide a better action list I would be happy to oblige. As for "finished", none of the classes will ever be "finished" but SimCraft will constantly revise as we get more information about the game. Based on projected numbers, it's as close as it can be without more people looking at it.

    ---------- Post added 2011-01-04 at 09:38 AM ----------

    Hello,

    I just wanted to get a second opinion on something. Would it be worth double stacking dark intents on a destruction warlock between 2202 and 2639 haste rating, thus giving them an extra tick of immolate (assuming my math was correct). I'm trying to leave out my own thoughts on this, but passing the threshold itself was an ~800 dps increase using the EJ priority list and BiS list in a simulation. That number won't be completely accurate since EJ's BiS list could use some work, but it should be accurate enough to draw some conclusions.
    It could be used in such a way providing Healing is not an issue and the Shadow Priest/Moonkin/Fire mages all already have it. Remember that there is more of a gain to putting it on different classes than just raw numbers - Fire Mages excel at aoe, Shadow Priests (with hasted SWP) gain more dps while moving, Moonkin dot crits are very very large. There will be instances we can never simulate where a non-warlock target is a better target regardless of the haste thresholds simply due to the fight mechanics.

    ---------- Post added 2011-01-04 at 09:42 AM ----------

    @Mihir - There seems to be a bug where applying DI to one target does not remove it from another properly. I cannot reliably repeat it, but based on your combat log it looks like its a pulse 3-5s after applying it to a target that searches for another target with DI and removes itself. This would explain the pet DI bug quite well, and it makes me wonder if you could put it on the entire raid by having them disconnect immediately after application.
    Last edited by gherkin; 2011-01-04 at 05:38 PM.

    R.I.P. YARG

  20. #80
    Thanks, this guide inceased my dps a lot

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