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  1. #141

    Addon Possibilities

    I have been kicking around the idea of doing an addon for Dark Intent. I was dondering what people would like to see. I have a few ideas listed below.

    1) something that simply shows a list like the one from the thread that is simply filtered by classes in your raid/party and by your lock type.

    2) similar to #1 but with additional support for identifying who to drop dark intent onto.

    3) again similar to #1 as a way to judge who to put DI on to start but with possible integration with recount or with its own calculations that would help you decide where it should go once you have seen the actual performance of the raid/party members.

    Other things such as alerts when you dont have dark intent on anyone or a better way to show the numbers of stacks of things or benefits gained are also possibilities.

    Feel free message/email me with suggestions although I will also monitor this thread as it is the best source of infor for DI I have come across.

    =V=

  2. #142
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    The problem is that this would be exceptionally complicated during multitarget fights, player playstyle, encounter, gear, etc.

    I think a better addon would be something very simple: For the last fight, DI gave you X damage and your target Y damage for a Raid DPS increase of X Damage.

    Thus you could swap it around on people for the biggest actual gain as opposed to "projected" gain. A Priest who doesn't multi-dot on Dragon Twins might still come out ahead of a boomkin who does. Who knows?

    Definately interested in helping get something going. I have an account on Curse if you want to get started.

    R.I.P. YARG

  3. #143

    Curse acct

    Thanx gherkin I have a curse acct also although I havn't used it for much yet. I have only created a few small addons for my personal use in the past but I do have 31 years of programming experience. This will be my first "real" addon and of course I get the idea just before leaving for Cancun and my Wedding/Honeymoon for a week. I will have internet access and should have wow installed on that laptop so I can start work on it while my fiancee/wife reads on the beach

  4. #144
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    Given the rather large difference between affliction and destruction in terms of how well they buff other casters (and how they benefit from getting the buff back), is it worthwhile to stay affliction (even with it being the lowest personal dps spec) in 4.0.6 assuming you always have a shadow priest/fire mage/boomkin or even for a resto druid on progression content at the least?

    I played demonology all through ICC so a small chunk of lost DPS really isn't a big deal for me, provided its picked up somewhere else with extra.
    When I'm sad I stop being sad and be AWESOME instead.

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Vollus View Post
    Thanx gherkin I have a curse acct also although I havn't used it for much yet. I have only created a few small addons for my personal use in the past but I do have 31 years of programming experience. This will be my first "real" addon and of course I get the idea just before leaving for Cancun and my Wedding/Honeymoon for a week. I will have internet access and should have wow installed on that laptop so I can start work on it while my fiancee/wife reads on the beach
    Working on WoW on your honeymoon - now THAT'S hardcore (And if she's that understanding then My God you're marrying the right woman)
    Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints.


  6. #146
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Killainstnct View Post
    Given the rather large difference between affliction and destruction in terms of how well they buff other casters (and how they benefit from getting the buff back), is it worthwhile to stay affliction (even with it being the lowest personal dps spec) in 4.0.6 assuming you always have a shadow priest/fire mage/boomkin or even for a resto druid on progression content at the least?

    I played demonology all through ICC so a small chunk of lost DPS really isn't a big deal for me, provided its picked up somewhere else with extra.
    Test: Kill a boss one week as affliction, the next as destro. Are your personal numbers close? Go Affliction. 2k+ difference? Destruction or Demonology.

    R.I.P. YARG

  7. #147
    To Vollus
    Prefer #3: This looks like it might be easier as a Skada or Recount addon. Percentage of contribution to the raid seems most relevant. For example, uptime on himself is a raid contribution, as also is the additional percentage of healing I achieve with it, or the additional DPS from a DI target. And too, there's the healing contribution from a Shadowpriest by increasing his dps, which should be considered. Altogether, it seems rather difficult to pinpoint what the percentage of contribution is, without doing long boring analysis of logs after the night is over, right now.

    If there are other buffs like this, Focus Magic or whatnot, they could easily be included later.

    Quote Originally Posted by Killainstnct View Post
    Given the rather large difference between affliction and destruction in terms of how well they buff other casters (and how they benefit from getting the buff back), is it worthwhile to stay affliction (even with it being the lowest personal dps spec) in 4.0.6 assuming you always have a shadow priest/fire mage/boomkin or even for a resto druid on progression content at the least?

    I played demonology all through ICC so a small chunk of lost DPS really isn't a big deal for me, provided its picked up somewhere else with extra.
    If you're good at demonology, the major consideration is the spellpower buff that we otherwise get from elemental shaman. Right now, demonology DPS is supposed to be much higher than elemental shaman, so that most raids prefer them over elems if they can find a good one.
    Last edited by Lyelu; 2011-02-04 at 04:54 PM.

  8. #148
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Base numbers updated to 4.0.6 mechanics. Key things to note:
    1) Fixed survival hunter math
    2) Fixed fire mage math
    3) Included both 2H and 1H Unholy DK
    4) Dropped 2H Frost DK due to lack of performance
    5) Still no warriors - not high enough to justify the time required

    Can someone confirm % of damage from dots for the following classes for me? Simcraft 4.0.3-32 (PTR ENABLED) was used.
    Shadow Priest - I have 70.2%
    Fire Mage - 42.75%
    Feral Druid - 44.3%

    Edit: Forgot to change the full spreadsheet dump. Will be done shortly.

    R.I.P. YARG

  9. #149
    Keyboard Turner
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    Hello Gherkin, for feral druid actually (patch 4.0.3a) it is more something like 55% (rip 30~32%, rake 24~28%); this is not Simcraft results but just sum up of what I can see browsing my own WOL and of course a lot a feral ones which are not mine.

  10. #150
    Based on revised numbers it's SPriest > Fire Mage. However, I see the H Maloriak fight touched on and I want to ask further about that. Assuming optimal play (having an eclipse ready to go etc) would you favor Boomkins for at least the aoe phases of this fight?

  11. #151
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Even factoring out optimal situations (pinning Solar early), and factoring in a priest who multi-dots, assuming equal skill and gear...
    A Boomkin in 4pc T11 >= Shadow Priest who multidots

    However, you as a Warlock must use Shadowflame on cooldown and throw out a corruption or two now and then to keep the DI stacked on your target. My rotation is Shadowflame, Corruption x 2, Hellfire, Shadowflame as soon as its off cooldown, Corruption x3, repeat

    @Kabutteur - thanks, I'll compare with new WOL when people have 4.0.6 logs to use. I know feral dots went down, but the amount it went down by seems to be a bit more than I was expecting.

    R.I.P. YARG

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Killainstnct View Post
    Given the rather large difference between affliction and destruction in terms of how well they buff other casters (and how they benefit from getting the buff back), is it worthwhile to stay affliction (even with it being the lowest personal dps spec) in 4.0.6 assuming you always have a shadow priest/fire mage/boomkin or even for a resto druid on progression content at the least?

    I played demonology all through ICC so a small chunk of lost DPS really isn't a big deal for me, provided its picked up somewhere else with extra.
    Current numbers in OP show ~450 dps in BiS gear between an affli and a destro buffing a SP (and lower depending on the SP gear); depending on how you find destro v affli decide. Demo should pretty much always have other reasons to get as primary choice.
    Though come 4.0.6 affli will get destroyed single target so should take that into account also.

  13. #153
    The Patient
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    Wouldn't using WoL for certain classes invalidate the data is some respect? Part of what makes the initial simulation craft information so good is that it creates information coming from the same source under the same variables.*

    If its an issue at the coding level, *%s could be fixed at the source to ensure you're still getting the information from similar situations. I assume this is what Gherkin would be interested in as he is almost like a private investigator when it comes to this stuff.

    If it is not an issue with the coding, then attempting to use WoL as a comparative tool for this analysis comes with some flaws. All classes with DOTS will probably experience a higher % of their damage from DOTS in practice as you factor in something as simple as run time.

  14. #154
    Well, I've done the math with a log of my Guild.

    Question: What brings more DPS to you raid?

    a) Two Warlocks (Destro), who can reach the new Immo Hastesoftcap with double DI Buff (losing the procc on two guildmembers)
    b) Buffing two Shadows (17k dps, 65% of their dmg is Dotdmg, uptime from Di is 70% with an avarage of two stacks)

    Well, the Uptimes and Stacks vary, but i Alternative A beats B for many dps.

    Gotta post the simcraft Sheets for A later, B is simple math.

  15. #155
    Sorry, maybe I was inattentive, but I have few questions.
    1. Is Shadow Priest's MindFlay(MF) counts as DoT ? Does it gain +9% damage from 3-stack buff?
    2. About fire mage: calculation are based on mastery-based mages ? Does it count mage's bug when dots disappear ?

    My opinion on dual-target bosses (Valiona, Council, Nefarian) druids and SP are the best DI targets.
    Last edited by vo1os; 2011-02-09 at 02:19 PM.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by networkz View Post
    Well, I've done the math with a log of my Guild.

    Question: What brings more DPS to you raid?

    a) Two Warlocks (Destro), who can reach the new Immo Hastesoftcap with double DI Buff (losing the procc on two guildmembers)
    b) Buffing two Shadows (17k dps, 65% of their dmg is Dotdmg, uptime from Di is 70% with an avarage of two stacks)

    Well, the Uptimes and Stacks vary, but i Alternative A beats B for many dps.

    Gotta post the simcraft Sheets for A later, B is simple math.
    Considering your SPs dps seems not so great (going by dot%), what's your dps vs theirs on those fights. Check fights where locks have 2xDI vs fights where SPs get DI. Also consider Balance druids here, especially on dual target fights, they seemed to get more dps on those, on last patch at least. And how good the players are at surviving. Also 70% uptime is really low from a warlock, even destruction, have seen mostly above 80% uptime on DI.

    If they whine too much, just be selfish on farm content, actual farm content. If they die too much, be smart and use on the players that are alive. The numbers here are very good when used as a variable when deciding and the calculations should be easy, simcraft for theoretical gains, logs for practical gains, survivability as the final variable.

    Generally though players in a guild are about the same skill so default starting point is SPs get DI on single target. Moonkins on dual target I guess. With a couple of hours of work you should be able to decide.
    Last edited by dakalro; 2011-02-09 at 03:18 PM.

  17. #157
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by networkz View Post
    Well, I've done the math with a log of my Guild.

    Question: What brings more DPS to you raid?

    a) Two Warlocks (Destro), who can reach the new Immo Hastesoftcap with double DI Buff (losing the procc on two guildmembers)
    b) Buffing two Shadows (17k dps, 65% of their dmg is Dotdmg, uptime from Di is 70% with an avarage of two stacks)

    Well, the Uptimes and Stacks vary, but i Alternative A beats B for many dps.

    Gotta post the simcraft Sheets for A later, B is simple math.
    I have this math forthcoming. I'm just wrapping up a few 4.0.6 updates before i do so.

    ---------- Post added 2011-02-09 at 08:38 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by vo1os View Post
    Sorry, maybe I was inattentive, but I have few questions.
    1. Is Shadow Priest's MindFlay(MF) counts as DoT ? Does it gain +9% damage from 3-stack buff?
    2. About fire mage: calculation are based on mastery-based mages ? Does it count mage's bug when dots disappear ?

    My opinion on dual-target bosses (Valiona, Council, Nefarian) druids and SP are the best DI targets.
    Mind flay counts. Direct damage from Devouring Plague does not (thanks New!).
    Mage calculations are based on whatever SimCraft BIS profiles indicate. If these are wrong and you can obtain higher numbers with something else, please let me know.

    R.I.P. YARG

  18. #158
    Let's begin:

    The simcraftet 359 T11 SP would cast with dots: Shadowword:Pain: 11,6%, Mindflay: 30,1%, Vampiric Touch: 19,2%, Devouring Plaque: 12,5%
    SO far: 73,4% from their DMG is Dotdmg. For their maximum

    SP gaining DPS by Haste: 703 dps
    SP gaining DPS by Procc (70%uptime, 2 stacks): 764 dps
    -> 1467 DPS


    The 17236 DPS SP in my Raid casts: Shadoword:Pain: 16,3%, Mindflay: 19,7%, Vampiric Touch: 19%, Devouring Plaque: 6%
    62% from their DMG is Dotdmg.

    SP gaining DPS by Haste: 670 dps
    SP gaining DPS by Procc (70%uptime, 2 stacks): 448 dps
    -> 1118 DPS



    Me, Simcraftet, gaining by Haste: 1130 DPS




    Sooo, i think I exaggerated. Conclusion: It shouldn't be, but it depends on your Raid and the people in it.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by gherkin View Post
    Mind flay counts. Direct damage from Devouring Plague does not (thanks New!).
    Imp DP deals 30% of the total damage thus benefiting from Dark Intent since it buffs the damage of the dot.

  20. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by cast View Post
    Imp DP deals 30% of the total damage thus benefiting from Dark Intent since it buffs the damage of the dot.
    That was my assumption as well. However, go out and test it yourself and you will see it does not affect the initial nuke from Devouring Plague. You will see the comment you quoted as being correct.

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