Kuni's Frost Mage PVE Guide (Cataclysm)

[Deleted]

i am not sure how to share only a few cells,
would be great if everyone would open his own copy of the spreadsheet when clicking the link, instead of everyone opening my copy,
this way i could just unlock every cell without risking people messing up my spreadsheet
(and they could get a working spreadsheet again by just reopening it)

is this possible (and does it makes sense at all?)

[Holtzmann]

So I've read somewhere (probably earlier in this thread) that you should use Flamestrike then cast Blizzard on top of that when AoEing. It sort of makes sense to me, given Blizzard receives pretty much no synergy from our talents, and just a minor boost from Frost Specialization, so taking the time to stack another AoE, even if really weak and without any bonuses either, under it would probably be a net gain. Have you tried that out, Kuni?

I've been soloing Burning Crusade raids for fun and to build my Aldor set (and the red PvP version too), and that's one of those situations that really shows just how weak Blizzard is at the moment. On any other character of my characters (melee or otherwise), I can pretty much just pull a full room of the non-elite trash in Karazhan and AoE-spam them all down before reaching half-health. On the mage... a lot more difficult. I guess I'll start using Flamestrike in those pulls, too.

I really miss Blizzard interacting with Fingers of Frost.

[Kuni Zyrekai]

Have you tried that out, Kuni?

I have. What I haven't figured out is what the point recasting flamestrike is a loss over just continuing to spam blizzard after it wears off. It's a nice boost to an otherwise crap AOE, but we really do need FoF blizzards back.

[Holtzmann]

Wait, I think it was Frostbite + Shatter that made the snare-talented Blizzard more powerful back in pre-4.0 days. 8 one-second ticks at a 15% chance of freezing the target and then the next tick pretty much guaranteed to crit... that was beautiful. Also, lots and lots of Fingers of Frost procs.

Sadly, I don't think the devs would ever go back to that model, at least not with Blizzard doing decent damage. My bet is that if Frost AoE gets revamped, it'll be to add extra steps to our AoE rotation. Maybe make the Pet Freeze or Cone of Cold give us a 300% damage bonus to our next Blizzard within 10 seconds if it hits any enemies, or something like that. Well, I guess as long as it's not like Shaman AoE, I'll be happy with an extra step or two to be able to do decent multi-target damage.

[Alvito]

Wait, I think it was Frostbite + Shatter that made the snare-talented Blizzard more powerful back in pre-4.0 days. 8 one-second ticks at a 15% chance of freezing the target and then the next tick pretty much guaranteed to crit... that was beautiful. Also, lots and lots of Fingers of Frost procs.

Sadly, I don't think the devs would ever go back to that model, at least not with Blizzard doing decent damage. My bet is that if Frost AoE gets revamped, it'll be to add extra steps to our AoE rotation. Maybe make the Pet Freeze or Cone of Cold give us a 300% damage bonus to our next Blizzard within 10 seconds if it hits any enemies, or something like that. Well, I guess as long as it's not like Shaman AoE, I'll be happy with an extra step or two to be able to do decent multi-target damage.

Ppl or mobs would get stuck in the frost snares and get crushed with that and fof both in effect. Another example of Blizz changing or fixing something that went from hitting like a truck to a wet noodle. Mix in the high cost for blizzard and its not worth it in many cases.

[Kuni Zyrekai]

Wait, I think it was Frostbite + Shatter that made the snare-talented Blizzard more powerful back in pre-4.0 days. 8 one-second ticks at a 15% chance of freezing the target and then the next tick pretty much guaranteed to crit... that was beautiful. Also, lots and lots of Fingers of Frost procs.

Sadly, I don't think the devs would ever go back to that model, at least not with Blizzard doing decent damage. My bet is that if Frost AoE gets revamped, it'll be to add extra steps to our AoE rotation. Maybe make the Pet Freeze or Cone of Cold give us a 300% damage bonus to our next Blizzard within 10 seconds if it hits any enemies, or something like that. Well, I guess as long as it's not like Shaman AoE, I'll be happy with an extra step or two to be able to do decent multi-target damage.

It was indeed at least partially frostbite. Frostbite would always proc with 2 FoF charges, and then an extra target would get shatter damage. As it stands, a holy priest using mind sear is better damage than straight up blizzard...

---------- Post added 2011-08-30 at 07:01 PM ----------

Ppl or mobs would get stuck in the frost snares and get crushed with that and fof both in effect. Another example of Blizz changing or fixing something that went from hitting like a truck to a wet noodle. Mix in the high cost for blizzard and its not worth it in many cases.

Yes, but they have since neutered the 80% slow that was on it at the time, as well as removed frostbite. I still think it would be viable to return FoF usage to blizzard without touching the damage. It'll allow our AOE to benefit from mastery, there's not enough points to really put more than 1 point in the talent, and the usual raid build doesn't put more than 1/3 permafrost, so the slows and random freezes aren't an issue anymore.

[Kimpan]

Where did the crit spreadsheet go? :| Anyone got a similare spreadsheet they care to share? or maybe can create one with all the crit buffs / debuffs?

[Deleted]

Here is the small app I was talking about :
http://opendevelop.fr/shatter/Shatter.html

Let me know if you spot a problem/have a suggestion.

[Kimpan]

Here is the small app I was talking about :
http://opendevelop.fr/shatter/Shatter.html

Let me know if you spot a problem/have a suggestion.

Used this app and the spreadsheet posted yestoday, both gave me diffrent result on what crit rating I needed.. yours told me 1151 and the sheet told me 1331.

Dont suppose it's like your app counts flask / raid buffs while the sheet didnt?

[Deleted]

Well since the spreadsheet is no longer available I can't really tell who is wrong

Looks like it's a 180 rating difference, close to 179,28 (rating need for 1% crit), don't know where the difference comes from... When I use my app to calculate the crit rating I need for the shatter cap on my frost mage, I have 100% crit on Simulationcraft for Deep Freezes.

[Deleted]

mmm, my signature got removed for some reason, and i cant link links on these forums yet (havent posted enough)
and i seem to completly overlook the 'edit signature' button as i cant find it anywhere

i did some comparing though, all our numbers are the same up until "=B12*179.28" to calculate the actual rating needed (what number do you use?)

[Deleted]

I use 179.28 too

[Asera]

Here is the small app I was talking about :
http://opendevelop.fr/shatter/Shatter.html

Let me know if you spot a problem/have a suggestion.

You should really put in options for flask/food.

I used Rawr to calculate my buffed intel (6459) and plugged it in this app, and got 540 crit rating for shatter cap.

The weird thing though, Rawr thinks the crit softcap is 33.33%... yet it makes me get more rating (about 580) to reach 33.2% or something.

[Deleted]

Rawr is pretty buggy if I'm not mistaken, try to play with or without molten armor buff, with or without the glyph, I think it counts the molten armor's 3% even if you don't check the buff, and maybe even counts it twice (I don't have it right now).
3% is about 540 rating.

[Kimpan]

So who is right? :| atm I got 4973 int, 1331 crit rating and im at 19.00% crit unbuffed.

and aint the crit cap at 19 % if you got all buffs (glyphed molten etc) but no focus magic?

[Deleted]

Your unbuffed 19% come from : 0.91 (mage bonus) + 3 (talent) + 4973/648.91 (unbuffed intellect bonus) + 1331/179.28 (gear crit rating)

You still have to add :
+ 5 crit buff
+ 5 spell crit buff
+ 5 molten armor with glyph
+ (90 + 300) / 648.91 (intellect bonus from flask + food) = 0.60
+ 0.05 * (4973 + 90 + 300) / 648.91 (buffed intellect bonus from kings) = 0.41

~ 35%, which is above what you were aiming I guess, by... 1% !

[Kimpan]

Yeah you're right, seems like your app counted flask and raid buffs while the spreadsheet didnt.

I'd get crit capped without flask, food and kings with what I have now :P Time to reforge abit again then! gaaah, I was at exactly 19.00 crit and 17.00 hit looks so nice on my chars stats!

[Deleted]

I uploaded the new version, taking in account the 1.05% flask/food, with a new line to verify your crit % on the character sheet.

[Deleted]

Hello,

First I wanted to congratulate kuni for his good job

I play mage as an alt for some extensions but has never raid with this toon. but now i have an opportunity. I would play frost with fire as second spec.

I tried it yesterday, but am disappointed with my performance ... Here is a log of the evening : www . worldoflogs . com/reports/mmg06cqnsq23m3zd/ (too young to link ..) i played frost on shannox, fire for beth / ryolith, a couple try on baleroc as frost and some as fire

it is an alt raid, dps looks terrible, and i'm aware that my mage is very unstuff, but I still thought to be a little better. simcraft sim me at ~18k with buffs present yesterday (no 10% spellpower) ...

oh, and the armory of my mage : eu . battle . net/wow/fr/character/hyjal/%C3%82ube/advanced

where am i wrong? any advice?

thank you in advance and sorry, English is not my native language but frost mage french community is fairly poor

[Kimpan]

I can't really read your armory, it's all in french! But if I'm seeing right, you don't have hit cap. Get that! Missing a deep freeze is alot of DPS and get more crit