Spirit.

[harky]

Zeuq, it may be a smaller problem than you're imagining. I only have two pieces of gear without Spirit on them (not including two Int trinkets), but because I'm Haste stacking I'm quit capable of ramping up my healing with higher HPS spells, or higher casting frequency and it does effectively turn Spirit into a throughput gain. I've also been looking at ways to increase output more than increasing regen of late as I'm not having many problems with mana anymore. There is of course Chim, but until they change something we've been doing it with 3x Disc Priests and kind of shrugging... needs to be fixed.

As gear increases it's only going to become less of a problem. The only thing I've seen as a big problem is people who are keeping their Haste very low, but their Spirit very high. You wind up with a lot of mana and nothing to do with it.

[Bloodystump]

I think you missed the point of my post. If your combat regen reaches a point that you could spam large heals without having to worry about mana we'd end up being in the same position as WOTLK.

Downed Argaloth last night and got my Legs to drop.

In 10-mans I'm sitting around 4.5k combat regen now. It allows me to comfortably heal for extended periods of time, or use more large heals due to my regen.

At this point I'm really not sure the appeal of stacking int when I regen so much.

[harky]

If Int = SP + Regen and SP > Haste or Mastery, then Int > Haste or Mastery. I didn't miss the point. It's exactly why I'm gearing towards Int+Spirit+Haste and exactly why I'm trimming back slightly on Spirit. If you 'regen so much' then you should be dropping regen in favor of something else. If you drop Int you are dropping regen and output, not just regen. Int stacking is so strong because it's good regen and your best throughput stat at the same time. Spirit is just regen. Point per point it's higher regen than Int, but it is only regen.

[Aliahna]

...and I've seen Disc priests sacrificing Int for Spirit trinkets and gems. Boggles my mind. I guess they forgot Rapture, Shadowfiend and Replenishment were all based on Int. Not to mention crit for divine aegis and bigger heals and shields. /Shrug

[Koilie]

Well lets not jump the gun here. I mean having a lot of mana regen for some 5 man heroics is one thing. 4k mana regen may not feel so impressive in a 10-15 minute hard mode raid encounter ya-mean?

[harky]

You mean those same hardmodes that have 6 minute enrages...?


And Aliahna, Spirit is pretty close in regen terms to Int as Discipline. Especially as your Int raises well above Spirit. There are currently attainable points where Spirit is noticeably better regen for Disc. That said.... they occur at points where regen isn't a huge deal anymore... and yeah, I've seen some Disc Priests gemming straight +Crit and going for straight Spirit/Crit gear. I'd cry if I wasn't laughing so hard.

[Bloodystump]

If Int = SP + Regen and SP > Haste or Mastery, then Int > Haste or Mastery. I didn't miss the point. It's exactly why I'm gearing towards Int+Spirit+Haste and exactly why I'm trimming back slightly on Spirit. If you 'regen so much' then you should be dropping regen in favor of something else. If you drop Int you are dropping regen and output, not just regen. Int stacking is so strong because it's good regen and your best throughput stat at the same time. Spirit is just regen. Point per point it's higher regen than Int, but it is only regen.

Well regen allows me to heal longer than you and in turn allows me to cast more "Large Heals" than you. I agree that eventually evening out a bit to include int for more oomph would be appropriate, but if I'm getting 4k regen and you're getting 2.5k regen, let's look at the math on a typical 10-15 min raid encounter.

10-15 minutes = 600 - 900 seconds
that's 600/5 to 900/5 or 120 to 180 ticks of combat regen
120 * 2,500 = 300,000 mana over the course of the fight.
180 * 2,500 = 450,000 mana over the course of the fight.

So you will be regening anywhere from 300k-450k mana a fight

120 * 4,000 = 480,000 mana over the course of the fight.
180 * 4,000 = 720,000 mana over the course of the fight.

I will be regening anywhere from 480k-720k mana a fight

Stack a bit more spirit and you can easily push that to over 5k combat regen in a raid. Since it's passive, it will be always ticking no matter what you are doing. Would that not allow me to cast larger heals more consistently then someone not regening nearly as much?

taking a look at the 15 minute fight the difference in regen is 270k mana.
270,000 / 5,500 (typical amount of a large heal of any sort) = approx 49.

49 extra large heals a fight over 15 minutes is 3 extra large heals a minute or 1 per 20 seconds.

OK so now that I have calculated some numbers the 49 extra heals are not INSTEAD of normal heals, but in addition to.

Now to get really detailed you'd have to break down the amount of extra healing done by those extra heals versus the amount of extra oomph you'd get from spell power over the course of the fight on the standard amount of heals. That I don't have time to figure out, but if someone does that would once and for all tell us if stacking spirit would outweigh other stats.

[harky]

A 'typical' 10-15 min raid encounter? Longest successful kill I've seen is ~8.2 minutes. Many enrage long, long before that 10-15 minute mark... If you want a 'typical' fight use 6 minutes. Some are shorter than this, but it's a good benchmark. 10 minutes is an extremely long fight.

Also, where'd you get the idea that someone Int-stacking would be at 2.5k? I'm at 4.2k in-combat regen and stacking Int as Holy. You might be able to get ~300 more total. So you'd get something like 480k instead of 460k in a 6 minute fight... For the low-low cost of about 1k SP.

[Arlee]

The bottom line is you need both spirit and int. Most of the time the choice is between spirit and some other secondary stat and not between int and spirit. So this whole discussion is sort of moot.

From EJ:
Intellect
Intellect increases your Spellpower by 1, Spell Critical Chance by .001541, and Mana by 15. The
first 18 Intellect will not give mana, and the first 10 Intellect will not give Spellpower

Spirit
Spirit increases your Spirit Regen according to the following formula:
Spirit Regen = Sqrt(Intellect) * Spirit *.016725

Source: http://elitistjerks.com/f77/t110245-...st_compendium/

[Bloodystump]

On the avg 346 item level gear, what would the spirit difference be between someone stacking spirit and someone stacking int. Maybe I'm wrong. I have no problem admitting it.

On the original post though, with how good gear could get, coupled with stacking spirit, we could see combat regain well over 8-9k. At that point you could just spam large heals and practically never go oom. (granted you use your cooldowns efficiently). I can see Blizzard capping combat regen at some point.

[Cariborne]

What I do as a Disc Priest is, Gear for Spirit, Gem for Intellect. Blue Sockets get Int/Spirit. Red gets Int. Yellow gets Int/Haste. All pieces of gear have Spirit on them.

I don't have Mana Issues.

[Kamakiri]

I want to start getting my JC gems. Should I be getting the Spirit one or the Int one? o.O

Seems like the argument is completely divided.

[Gackto]

Until your Greater Heals start to become nearly free casts like Heal is for full 346 geared priests, having too much spirit is never a bad thing.