Page 1 of 2
1
2
LastLast
  1. #1

    Please Help! Disc Healz Having Heroic Problems

    I have switched from dps to disc healz so i can get instant ques instead of waiting 40mins. i have 1600 spirit 336 item lvl and i just cant keep up in heroics. Is anyone else having the same problems ?

  2. #2
    Nope, since I spec'd out of Evan/Archangel, I've been having 0 problems. It does take a little getting used to, but I feel perfectly comfortably healing heroics and raids.

  3. #3
    Deleted
    get away from using smite/archangel, the only reason for picking it would be the mana restore but with only getting max. 5% mana back it's totaly not worth risking a dead player simply because atonement has healed the wrong person...put the 5 talentpoints into reduced weakend soul debuff instead.

    And try to get more spirit with that itemLv you should be around 2000+

  4. #4
    2000+ u say. Maybe thats my problem. Ill gear up in normals for awhile and see what happens.

    thanks ppl =D

  5. #5
    You just need to be more efficient:

    - Macro Inner Focus into every single spell it applies to
    - Use gheal as your bread and butter heal (with train of thought) to reduce the cooldown if IF, with Train of thought every 9th gheal (worst case) is effectively free
    - Use Penance every time its available
    - Dont use renew (extremely inefficient for disc)
    - PW:S only on the tank, hit him everytime the debuff is gone to try to proc rapture everytime the internal cooldown (12s) is up
    - Use your shadowfiend, bring mana pots, use hymn

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Rivicen View Post
    Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I also need help with disc. Usually for really intense AoE moments. I had to start playing holy in order to prevent wipes.

    PoM goes out, quickly bounces 5 times, and I need to wait another 8 seconds for that, people are still going down. I do a IF + PoH which heals everyone for maybe 7k (more on crits + shield + glyph) I'll say that handles 10k. Well now what? Shield spam doesnt work, maybe...renews on people? Maybe? I'm at a loss here.

    I know AoE usually does not go on for very long, but there are some fights where im struggling to find solutions. Notable moments where I need help are..

    Rajh (the "last" boss in HoO, the fire guy) when he does his really long aoe pulses. That has me sweating usually and is where I throw out the pom and IF + Divine Hymn, but sometimes still isnt enough

    Tolvir 2nd last boss in the shadow phase. Maybe the dps i played with were bad, but the constant damage was too much for me to keep bouncing PoM (or I should say it was used up so fast I had to wait another 7 seconds or something to reach for it again). I cant hammer PoH and I dont have the time to Heal one at a time

    Forgemaster in GB. Again couldve been bad dps, but the damage that goes out on this fight is too much for me, especially "shield" phase. I've yet to successfully heal through this boss

    Wind Drake in VP. Again could be terrible luck, could be bad dps, but I'm also unsuccessful on healing this one. Same reasons.


    All gear has spirit, and im in all 346s, except 1 333 and 1 359. My regen is okay since the rapture patch, its usually just being unable to throughput enough aoe healing. I know shield spam doesnt work. I dont know if rolling renews on everyone works or doesnt (in the hopes that it does, i currently have renew glyph + imp renew + inner will). Any AoE problems I've had as disc I've so far solved as holy.

    I guess I'm throwing my lot in with OP as a cry for help. Maybe I play disc bad, maybe it needs work, maybe I'm just not thinking of something?
    As a disc priest you counter intense aoe moments with PoH spam (and keeping prom bouncing ofc). Forget about renew or shields on your party, just spam PoH a couple of times, and make sure you conserve mana during the non-aoe moments. Just don't panic, PoH is a powerful enough tool to keep up your party during those moments (assuming the rest of your group is doing their jobs properly), and with your gear you should have enough mana / regen to spam quite a few of them.

    The wind drake in VP is just a crap fight imo. -.-


    edit: oh, and get the PoH glyph if you don't use it already
    Last edited by Acidz; 2010-12-20 at 04:18 PM.

  7. #7
    I'd have to agree with Acidz. Get the Prayer glyph, Rivicen.

    Also, don't be hesitant to weave a shield and/or Penance between them, to top up someone with a little more damage than anyone else (or missed a charge on Mending).

    Shield spam alone won't pull you through, but Prayers will.

    Also a tip for Rajh: Drop Barrier on the boss, and have even ranged move into it.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  8. #8
    Field Marshal Orapronobis's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Hiding behind the tank
    Posts
    62
    I also second Acidz advise, as it's pretty much what I've been seeing, though it's most of the Lost City bosses that give me trouble over the wind boss, but part of that is that I've gotten a tip on where to stand to avoid the tornadoes if I need time to catch back up on my heals (though it often leaves a couple people out of range, so you can't stand there all the time).

    Also, in case it's not clear, if the damage lets you let the PoH glyph hot fall off before you cast it again. And for Rajh, it might be worth while to switch out your PW:S glyph for PW:B, so when you do pop it you get that sexy +10% to healing for everyone under it.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by oneeightytwo View Post
    2000+ u say. Maybe thats my problem. Ill gear up in normals for awhile and see what happens.

    thanks ppl =D
    By running normals you can get:

    Grim Batol


    http://www.wowhead.com/item=56136 or http://www.wowhead.com/item=56138

    Halls of Origination


    http://www.wowhead.com/item=56107
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=57860
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=56105
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=55276
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=56097
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=55995

    Lost City of Tol'vir

    http://www.wowhead.com/item=55878
    http://www.wowhead.com/item=55869

    This is what I'm aiming for as a Holy Priest, been 85 for about a week yet still doing Normals

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Orapronobis View Post
    I also second Acidz advise, as it's pretty much what I've been seeing, though it's most of the Lost City bosses that give me trouble over the wind boss, but part of that is that I've gotten a tip on where to stand to avoid the tornadoes if I need time to catch back up on my heals (though it often leaves a couple people out of range, so you can't stand there all the time).

    Also, in case it's not clear, if the damage lets you let the PoH glyph hot fall off before you cast it again. And for Rajh, it might be worth while to switch out your PW:S glyph for PW:B, so when you do pop it you get that sexy +10% to healing for everyone under it.
    Also to note, sometimes overhealing to stack DA with PoH is not bad. For me personally it stacks up to 25k, right not thats about a quarter of peoples health. I use Forte Exorists to watch my DA on all Party/Raid members. When it gets down to 3 sec, cast another PoH. Does not really use that much mana to cast it every 9 sec or so.

    Heck on some 10 Raid bosses, if I know the raid was GOING to take damage, I would pre-stack PoH. I was peaking at 80k HPS.


    As for the mana regen, as others have said, atm Spirit, Spirit, Spirit, and more Spirit. I am sitting at 2.2k and its still not enough. (Although I am not totally gemed and enchanted due to the high rate of gear collection this week.)

    And then Haste.
    Last edited by Apostolic; 2010-12-20 at 05:42 PM.
    I don't heal STUPID, Stupid SHOULD HURT!
    Syntyche - Disc Priest

  11. #11
    Field Marshal Orapronobis's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Hiding behind the tank
    Posts
    62
    Unless things have changed in the last few days the Disc thread on EJ is kinda cluttered and the first post is a poorly edited copy of the Holy thread.

    Stat wise you want it to be roughly Int>Spirit>Haste>Mastery>Crit last time I looked and have found that to work fairly well for me so far.

    Renew is fairly bad for Disc right now, though it gets fairly powerful if cast when BT is up, but you'd get much better mileage if you drop the glyph and put any talent points pretty much anywhere (unless I horribly remember my math wrong the glyph and Improved Renew are less powerful for you than the PW:S glyph by itself).

    And yes, Heal is our filler spell, as pretty much every thread hear as mentioned ;P If you fall behind Gheal is fairly efficient and Penance should pretty much always be on cooldown.

    A rough cast priority that has worked really well for me in most heroics is to bubble the tank and cast PoM on him right before the pull and cast Heal on him if the shield has popped to use SoS to get WS off and bubble him again. If at least 3 people (including the tank) aren't topped off I'll consider using a PoH, and if 4-5 are I use it in a heart beat. That's the general formula for my healing, with Gheal and Penance used to spot heal. I also have IF macroed to Gheal and PoH which has really helped stretch my mana.

    Also, the idea of pre DAing to a fairly high absorb is really interesting to me, though not something you should really need to worry about in a Heroic.

  12. #12
    The Patient Marraphy's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Baradin Hold
    Posts
    219
    Quote Originally Posted by Rivicen View Post
    Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I also need help with disc. Usually for really intense AoE moments. I had to start playing holy in order to prevent wipes.

    PoM goes out, quickly bounces 5 times, and I need to wait another 8 seconds for that, people are still going down. I do a IF + PoH which heals everyone for maybe 7k (more on crits + shield + glyph) I'll say that handles 10k. Well now what? Shield spam doesnt work, maybe...renews on people? Maybe? I'm at a loss here.

    I know AoE usually does not go on for very long, but there are some fights where im struggling to find solutions. Notable moments where I need help are..

    Rajh (the "last" boss in HoO, the fire guy) when he does his really long aoe pulses. That has me sweating usually and is where I throw out the pom and IF + Divine Hymn, but sometimes still isnt enough

    Tolvir 2nd last boss in the shadow phase. Maybe the dps i played with were bad, but the constant damage was too much for me to keep bouncing PoM (or I should say it was used up so fast I had to wait another 7 seconds or something to reach for it again). I cant hammer PoH and I dont have the time to Heal one at a time

    Forgemaster in GB. Again couldve been bad dps, but the damage that goes out on this fight is too much for me, especially "shield" phase. I've yet to successfully heal through this boss

    Wind Drake in VP. Again could be terrible luck, could be bad dps, but I'm also unsuccessful on healing this one. Same reasons.


    All gear has spirit, and im in all 346s, except 1 333 and 1 359. My regen is okay since the rapture patch, its usually just being unable to throughput enough aoe healing. I know shield spam doesnt work. I dont know if rolling renews on everyone works or doesnt (in the hopes that it does, i currently have renew glyph + imp renew + inner will). Any AoE problems I've had as disc I've so far solved as holy.

    I guess I'm throwing my lot in with OP as a cry for help. Maybe I play disc bad, maybe it needs work, maybe I'm just not thinking of something?
    Well one Prayer of Healing most likely won't cut it in those situations.

    First of all you should macro Power Infusion into your Prayer of Healing macro, and if the AoE is persisting then what I do is:

    1. Shield one or two people who are taking a lot of damage
    2. PoM
    3. Spam Prayer of Healing (w/ 20% Haste and mana reduction from PI up and the first one is usually free thanks to IF).

    depending on how much damage there is it usually only needs to be used two or three times, leaving you with a haste buff for you to quickly Heal everyone back up if they're still low.
    85 Priest/72 Druid/85 Mage/24 Shaman/56 Paladin

  13. #13
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Zorat View Post
    You just need to be more efficient:

    - Macro Inner Focus into every single spell it applies to
    - Use gheal as your bread and butter heal (with train of thought) to reduce the cooldown if IF, with Train of thought every 9th gheal (worst case) is effectively free
    what you said otherwise was fine, but this is wrong.

    use innerfocus for specific heals, use it for flash to top off tank, or for a prayer for aoe. use it asap, but dont waste it on agreater gear on a reasonably high health target.

    Greater heal as bread and butter heal means far too much incomming dmg, heal shoudl be your main heal, with shields on CD, 3stack of grace on tank, pennace on CD, then the tank should be fine. Use inspiration on CD. Only up healing when needed.

    If you constantly need to spam greater heal or flash, then get better dps and tanks. Most dmg in heroics is avoidable, if they are taking that much dmg then they suck.

    Incidentially I glyphed prayer, it was that or barrier, and tbh, barrier glyph sucks for 5mans (though shove it back in for raids where its value is raised massively), its a minor increase in healing over time due to the CD and its reliant on people being under the shield which is not often! (please all tanks and dps, get under the sodding bubble). Prayer+DA+hots is nice and always effective (and use an IF to boost it if you can). If you need more aoe than that and PoM then the problem is not the healing.


    Make sure your gear has spirit on it, but dont reforge or gem it unless its a hybrid to get a decent socket bonus, gem int enchant int, love int. reforge crit to mastery, or haste if gear already has mastery. (dont let crit drop too low, but generally you should be able to reforge it to haste or mastery).


    Oh and Archangle/attonement is a raid heal playstyle, not a tank or solo heal style. its used to put a smite priest on the melee. In 5mans or tank healing, you need inspiration. Ditch the attonemet talents, pick up inspiration, makes life much easier.
    Last edited by mmoc90d0d3f279; 2010-12-21 at 12:15 AM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Orapronobis View Post
    Stat wise you want it to be roughly Int>Spirit>Haste>Mastery>Crit last time I looked and have found that to work fairly well for me so far.
    If you look at the Discipline compendium on Elitist Jerks, under the Theorycrafted Spell Values and Stat Weightings section the initial data is for a holy priest but at the bottom is the one for discipline. Your stat priority seems to match the one for holy.

    The compendium seems to have much holy info baked into it but the disc stuff is there. It is a bit messy!

    From what I gather, not only from EJ, the priority for disc should be Int>Spirit>Crit>Haste>Mastery. Crit is a little better than haste but not by a mile so keeping them balanced seems the best. Mastery is very poor so it should be reforged into one of the others.

    This I have found works quite well for me so far!

    Quote Originally Posted by oneeightytwo View Post
    I have switched from dps to disc healz so i can get instant ques instead of waiting 40mins. i have 1600 spirit 336 item lvl and i just cant keep up in heroics. Is anyone else having the same problems ?
    My gear is around the same ilvl as yours (339, but armory says it is 337 equipped) and it only have around 100 spirit more than what you have. I do not have much problems with heroics except when the tank and dps take too much avoidable damage. But generally I do not go OOM now or even near.

    But yeah, most of what have been said in this thread already are valid points. I do think my spirit is a bit low and will reforge some stuff but still, for what you have it should be more than doable. Just make sure to not overheal and use mana inefficient spells.

    Is you are struggling on trash the group might not crowd control so try to talk them into doing that. That really can make a difference.
    Last edited by Gahijnu; 2010-12-21 at 01:58 PM. Reason: Typos and spelling errors.

  15. #15
    Also, don't forget about power infusion - it's a great spell to use for intense aoe moments to boost up your PoHs.

  16. #16
    Field Marshal Orapronobis's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Hiding behind the tank
    Posts
    62
    Quote Originally Posted by Tlacotl View Post
    use innerfocus for specific heals, use it for flash to top off tank, or for a prayer for aoe. use it asap, but dont waste it on agreater gear on a reasonably high health target.
    If you're tank healing in a raid then you will be spamming Gheal, as that's the type of tank damage I've been seeing, so macroing it makes sense there. And even in 5 mans it's a free Gheal when you need to save the tank's butt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gahijnu View Post
    From what I gather, not only from EJ, the priority for disc should be Int>Spirit>Crit>Haste>Mastery. Crit is a little better than haste but not by a mile so keeping them balanced seems the best. Mastery is very poor so it should be reforged into one of the others.
    At this gear level you're going to see a much better return if you devalue crit. Haste is going to be the stat you need once you have your mana stabilized, as you right now you need the ability to get your spells out there instead of having an unreliable proc happen. Maybe once you're in full t11 (I doubt it, but maybe) or later I can see crit being that high on our priority list, but you're just going to get a much better return on haste. And I personally put mastery in front of crit because I'd rather improve my guaranteed bubbles over the chance of procing a random shield.

  17. #17
    I had similar issues when I first started healing heroics...half my problem was the Archangel/Atonement spec, the other half was bad players in the group coupled with bad spell priority.

    Drop Renew completely...it is inefficient. Use heal as much as possible on the tank while keeping PoM and Shield up (Heal will barely bite into your mana pool). Don't be quick to switch heal target or else you lose the stack of Grace on the tank. Use Gheal and Penance according to damage the tank is taking...but always mix it in-between heals

    Most times I leave a dps anywhere from 60-80 percent and notice that they are a bit more conscious of dodging damage and playing smarter (you MUST make them notice they are being dumb or you will eventually OOM). If they are melee and they are still taking stupid avoidable damage yank them out of the melee group with Leap of Faith (Most intelligent players will understand why you did that and try to do better).

    Inner Focus, Power Infusion, Shield Barrier, Shield, PoM and lots of PoH during AoE damage phases is your friend. How you chose to use it all is dependent on your mana, level of damage etc. Sometimes all you need is 2 spams of PoH, other times you need to pop IF, PI and then spam lots of PoH. Also don't forget Divine Hymm...usually nice to cast this while under a shield barrier to avoid the channel being shortened.

    And on a final note....Utilize all your mana regen abilities!! Make sure to use your Shadow Fiend early into boss fights. I already pop mine at 80-85% mana so in case the fight lasts even longer I am ready to use it again. Keep in mind while the fiend is regening mana you are still spending it (Sometimes at an even higher rate). Use Pain suppression on the tank before you decide to use Hymm of Hope on a boss fight (That way you won't have to cut the hymm short just to top off a tank. If you are running with guild mates and are using vent then have one of them with healing spells take over for a sec while you regen (Everyone in my runs that has a healing spell uses it when they see a healer strapping on big damage)

    It will only get easier....stick with it and play the class you enjoy!!
    People that think they know it all are annoying to those of us that do

  18. #18
    Deleted
    @Preacherman

    I totally love your post. It represents mostly the way I play my disc and I haven't had any problems whatsoever, even in longer fights. The only thing I disagree is the complete drop of Renew. For example in Grim Batol Heroic, Erudax: You can't always get out of the voidzone quickly enough and you end up taking a little damage (roughly 20k). After I dispell the people from the movement debuff, I also drop them a renew to top them off and I don't have to worry about them for a while If i keep a nice and efficient heal rotation on the tank during the fight. Renew heals for a reasonable amount in a fight like that and the mana I've spent on it usually regenerates quickly enough so I haven't lost much time to drop Heals or other spells that would consume more time but a little less mana.

    Renew is the kind of spell that you can use in certain situations to your advantage, but shouldn't rely on too much as disc.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by wed View Post
    @Preacherman

    I totally love your post. It represents mostly the way I play my disc and I haven't had any problems whatsoever, even in longer fights. The only thing I disagree is the complete drop of Renew. For example in Grim Batol Heroic, Erudax: You can't always get out of the voidzone quickly enough and you end up taking a little damage (roughly 20k). After I dispell the people from the movement debuff, I also drop them a renew to top them off and I don't have to worry about them for a while If i keep a nice and efficient heal rotation on the tank during the fight. Renew heals for a reasonable amount in a fight like that and the mana I've spent on it usually regenerates quickly enough so I haven't lost much time to drop Heals or other spells that would consume more time but a little less mana.

    Renew is the kind of spell that you can use in certain situations to your advantage, but shouldn't rely on too much as disc.
    I am glad you could find similarities in our play styles. I guess I didn't really mean drop renew completely in the sense that it should never be used. When mobility is a factor it is wise to toss a Renew and Shield. I would advise against glyphing or speccing into renew and I would advise even more against using it within any normal rotations as a Disc priest (For now anyway). You are better off tossing a shield on a dps and let them regen HP themselves than top them off with renew each time you can. Gives PoM a chance to do its work
    People that think they know it all are annoying to those of us that do

  20. #20
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by wed View Post
    @Preacherman
    You can't always get out of the voidzone quickly enough and you end up taking a little damage (roughly 20k). After I dispell the people from the movement debuff, I also drop them a renew to top them off and I don't have to worry about them for a while
    If they cant get out of the void zone then dont bother healing them, its incredibly easy, you are not there to cover other people's mistakes, that was wraths problem, you could heal through anything, so why bother moving? They move or they are a drain on your mana, and therefore a liability.

    healers are to heal unavoidable dmg, not avoidable stuff.


    I prefer to run with people who dont fuck up.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •