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  1. #1
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    Post Low DPS, any suggestion?

    Hi all, i got some serious DPS problem in raid. I spent a lot of time watching logs and reading EJ but i just can't find a solution to my low dps compared to other classes.

    my stats are:

    Ilvl 345
    5316 Spell Power (kinda low i think, but everything is enchanted/gemmed)
    5.36% Haste
    Hit capped
    17.38% Crit
    13.90 Mastery
    Hurricane Enchant + Engineering tinker on gloves(480 int every min)

    some number from last raid(short fights, many wipes)

    Chimaeron:

    FROST

    dps / seconds of fight

    14343 / 55
    13580 / 79
    13582 / 54
    11398 / 82
    10511 / 80
    14871 / 80
    10904 / 137


    FIRE

    dps / seconds of fight

    10482 / 124
    10357 / 68
    9960 / 98
    8992 / 143
    12049 / 117
    12348 / 92
    10441 / 168
    9940 / 178
    11894 / 84
    13020 / 89

    The highest problem seems endurance, the more a fight lasts the worse my DPS become.
    My specs are standard Fire and Frost raiding specs + standard rotations + standard glyphs.
    I just.. don't know what's the problem, if anyone got some kind of advice i would be grateful.

  2. #2
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    everyone has the problem of loosing dps as the fight goes on, but you shouild try get more crit on your fire spec so you can get hot streak, i know a lot of mages in my guild are stockpiling gear of crit and staying frost till they get a high enough % to be able to proc it

  3. #3
    get as much crit as you can without losing out on hit, crit should be your priority in both fire and frost iirc

  4. #4
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    Yeah i'm grabbing every crit rating i can, but still.. Yesterday full raid buffed (even +3% crit chance from arcane mage) + Critical Mass i had 35% critical strike chance, fireball glyph gives me another 5% on it, so on my primary cast i had 40% critical, that isnt bad i think.. Still dps was low.

  5. #5
    Dreadlord nimryas's Avatar
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    You are using scorch weaving for your fire spec? It is mandatory since you will run OOM in notime if you will only cast fireballs. Clever use of mana gems/evocation differ in every other boss encounter, so make sure they are not wasted.

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  6. #6
    Deleted
    try a arcane specc

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Allera View Post
    try a arcane specc
    No, don't do that. :P

    Reforge any Haste and/or Mastery you might have on your gear to Crit, it'll help you out some.
    If I go crazy then will you still call me Superman?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by nimryas View Post
    You are using scorch weaving for your fire spec? It is mandatory since you will run OOM in notime if you will only cast fireballs. Clever use of mana gems/evocation differ in every other boss encounter, so make sure they are not wasted.
    It's what Nimryas said, you should be using scorch weaving as fire mages.
    This means when your reserving mana your casting about 5 scorches to 1 fireball.

    The cycle for fire, is basicly set at, burn mana till you spend 12.5k (so about 4-5 fire balls) use a mana gem, burn down to about 38%, then evocation, burn down again to about 30-40%, use a mana gem, then scorch weave. Till the boss is on about 35% then hopefully by this time your 3rd mana gem will be out of CD, and you'll deal 12% more dmg against that target.

    Also, you should be using fireball when you got procs of trinkets, or using "on-use" trinkets.

    I'm unsure if it's wise to cast fireball spam during a heroism/bloodlust, my fireball is 1.7second cast, hits for about 11k non-crit, and 23k crit, and costs close to 2k mana each time. I tend to scorch spam, and scorch weave during heroism/bloodlust, to save mana, because you can easily oom yourself if you don't pay attention.

    Scorch casting is 1.0 seconds during a bloodlust with low haste (i got about 5%), hits for about 5-7k dmg for me (6.1k sp with int), and crits upto 14k. So for every 2nd scorch i get out, it's like casting a normal fireball without heroism, that's if they don't crit, if they crit i get the instant pryoblast! without spending any mana.

    Also, having higher crit rating really does help, dropping mastery and haste into as much crit as possible is the best route. I manage about 24% crit with molten shield, then the scorch debuff (29%).

    Edit;
    Just to let you know my numbers maybe abit off in the rotation, it's on elitist jerks site for the exact percent when to use gems and evocation.
    Last edited by Kosic; 2010-12-24 at 03:35 PM.

  9. #9
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    Nice Post Kosic

  10. #10
    /Agree great post but i think frost is the best way atm

  11. #11
    Old God Swizzle's Avatar
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    I'm just wondering how your ilvl is so high but your spellpower is so low.
    BfA Beta Time

  12. #12

  13. #13
    I've seen too many mages spec'd FIRE go oom at higher gear levels simply because they refuse to scorch the hell out of a boss.... ya gotta stop that fireball casting mentality and weave in the scorches.. FIRE in this case is not bad
    FIRE GOOOOOOOOOOOD

  14. #14
    Honestly, a BIG part of it is rng. I've seen myself pull 7-9k constant, and other times do 16k constant. A large part of it is just crit rng, due to the large contribution that pyro/ignite bring to fires damage. I do however usually find myself being out dps'd by other guildies in raid, 99% of the time our enhance shaman is #1 ( I think they're broken or something rofl ), and then it's a shuffle between myself, a lock and an ele sham. However, on most fights it feels uphill. Might just be gear/rng or balance.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Vlaria View Post
    Honestly, a BIG part of it is rng. I've seen myself pull 7-9k constant, and other times do 16k constant. A large part of it is just crit rng, due to the large contribution that pyro/ignite bring to fires damage. I do however usually find myself being out dps'd by other guildies in raid, 99% of the time our enhance shaman is #1 ( I think they're broken or something rofl ), and then it's a shuffle between myself, a lock and an ele sham. However, on most fights it feels uphill. Might just be gear/rng or balance.
    Well crit % is always RNG, that's why you get alot more crit to make it less RNG and more precised on how you want to play. With low crit the whole Hotstreak will be RNG, after about 35% you start playing into your own choice of when spells should proc.

    The only real RNG to a fire mage is impact proc, it isn't as timed as i'd like it to be. On one trash pack in 5man heroics i can make upto 35k dps if impact wants to proc right after Hotstreak, combustion, Living bomb and ignite are up on the table. But other times i could be pulling 6k dps because impact, and hotstreak don't proc at all.

    Fire mages will come into play and feel OP again once we're at about 45% crit rating (probably T12/13 lvl). This is counting, buffs, gear, food, pots etc.


    Also to note, i read that Ret paladins, Ench shamans and i think it was locks were broken before cata came out, they were the strongest of the lot. But ret paladins got tweaked as cata was releasing, so they are now under what they should be (?).

  16. #16
    Make sure you can spam fireball during the boss's last 35%, scorch weave on bloodlust, make sure you dump all the useless haste after the soft cap into crit and get more INT , yes your SP is too low. Those should help.

  17. #17
    I'm guessing the low spell power is due to non-int trinkets.

    In any case, don't think I can help much since i never raided yet, but here are my 2 cents:

    - Hard cast 3-4 pyros in the beginning to fish for big combutions. (40% is a very nice crit chance). Make sure you filler between the pyros with other spells to check if it critted or not. You don't wanna hard cast another one if one already critted. The early big combustion would boost your dps and allow for another combust later in the fight.
    - Scorch, scorch and scorch. I personally dropped fireball off the rotation and reglyphed to living bomb. Infinite mana + full rotation on the move > 1k dps increase. Fire is too RNG that I never noticed this difference. Then again, I didn't raid yet, this is my experience in 5 mans.

  18. #18
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    Crit is the bread and butter of a mage. Try reforge haste and mastery to crit after you got enough hit. Don't be afraid of scorch weaving!

  19. #19
    Old God Swizzle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arsene Lupin View Post
    I'm guessing the low spell power is due to non-int trinkets.

    In any case, don't think I can help much since i never raided yet, but here are my 2 cents:

    - Hard cast 3-4 pyros in the beginning to fish for big combutions. (40% is a very nice crit chance). Make sure you filler between the pyros with other spells to check if it critted or not. You don't wanna hard cast another one if one already critted. The early big combustion would boost your dps and allow for another combust later in the fight.
    - Scorch, scorch and scorch. I personally dropped fireball off the rotation and reglyphed to living bomb. Infinite mana + full rotation on the move > 1k dps increase. Fire is too RNG that I never noticed this difference. Then again, I didn't raid yet, this is my experience in 5 mans.
    N...no. Just...no.
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  20. #20
    Pandaren Monk Crush's Avatar
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    I'm no mage expert but, do you use your rotation? Regardless of dps you usually have, Rotation will guarantee you to get good dps up

    Did it for the first time on my warrior i was never higher then healer .... hey i was a hunter, didn't know how to dps as a warrior

    Then i came here and read rotation and WOOM got to 2 highest dps

    Stolen ... from elyssia .... mad elyssia?

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