Soloing vs. groups: do your specs differ?

[ddk]

I don't do much PVP. I used to be really into it. Loved ganking clothies sitting down to drink behind some tree somewhere, thinking they're safe behind the front line skirmish. Yes, I'm one of those people. But these days it just doesn't do it for me. So my two specs are PVE-based. But I find that Ass-spec just doesn't cut it soloing. It's great for groups when you can stab the crap out of something from behind, but when I'm prowling around by myself, killing things, I find that Sub-spec just can't be beaten.

My two standard attack configurations go: Shadowstep > Ambush > Kidney Shot > Shadow Dance > Ambush > Ambush > Ambush... few mobs survive that; in fact, most die before the third Ambush if all of them crit and given Sub's high Ambush crit chance, that happens more often than not. The few times a mob does survive that, the 5-point Eviscerate that follows generally does them in, whether it crits or not. Given that I usually end up with 5 combo points remaining, I usually pop a Recuperate on the off-chance that I took any damage at all on that kill, or that I might take damage on the next one.

The second attack configuration is for when Shadow Dance and Shadowstep are on CD. Yes, I kill things that quickly: Cheap Shot > Backstab > Backstab > Kidney Shot > Backstab > Backstab > 5-point Eviscerate. Again, mobs rarely survive all of that and even if they do, a couple of Hemo's and they're done.

Now... I'm not in spectacular gear. In fact, I'm barely iLevel 330. I'm not in a big guild and we don't chase first kills. We're just nerds who play an MMO together for fun. So my rogue isn't going to set records. And yet, even with his gear, I can do this over and over and over and virtually never have to stop to eat. Whereas with Ass-spec or Combat-spec, I'm constantly hammering away at mobs for combo points in a desperately boring battle to kill stuff before it kills me; or at least wears away my hit points to the point I have to stop and eat/bandage. The average kill time for a mob is also far, far quicker with sub. And if that wasn't enough, the shadowstep jump cuts grinding time by a third at least, simply because it closes that distance for you in a blink.

So, that's my story. Do you use a different spec for farming/soloing/questing/dailies? Or do you stick to the tried and true of your main spec?

[gaymer77]

With my rogue I still use assassin spec for soloing but my opener & rotation is a little bit different. Either I'll open with a CS > BS > BS > KS >BS >BS > Envenom if not dead already or I'll Garrote > Mut x3-4 > envenom and things seem to be dead by then.

---------- Post added 2011-01-10 at 02:07 AM ----------

Oh but if I'm going to be killing multiple mobs in a certain area I'll put a recoup in on the first mob because it likes to refresh itself

[Rooflesstoofless]

I am not level capped yet, so this is worth a grain of sand on the beach...but...

I love playing as Sub and it is perhaps the most fun I've had in the game....but I have Assassination as my offspec and will be using it for dungeons and raids once I get level capped unless Sub gets some much needed buffs.

I only started playing a rogue about a month ago (now at level 76) and pretty much went Sub from level 10. I love the play style...and I am not above stating that I like being in complete control while I beat a mob to death and not giving them a chance to hit my rogue. I also like the 'planning' of routes and how the defensive abilities turn into huge offensive abilties (Vanish just to Amush/Evis again...woot...big numbers!)...

Plus, Shadowstep > Feral Cat Charge in every way. My main was a druid and was dps till the end of LK. Can't tell you how many times I would charge only to end up facing the wrong way on a mob/boss. It would get to be more than a little annoying when doing chain heroics. Still haven't had that problem once with Shadowstep.

Unfortunately, Sub has started to fall well behind other classes/specs at doing damage in dungeons for a few levels now and the gap between my best Sub DPS and my half-assed Mut DPS continues to get wider with every level. While questing Mut is winning out as well since Deadened Nerves + 100% uptime on ImpRecup means never having to stop and heal except in very rare cases. Moving between mobs is faster too since, at my level, I have both Quickening and Nightstalker and it trumps the 20second cooldown on Shadowstep.

I did a regular dungeon on my druid a few days back. There were three level 85's and two 84's. The assissination rogue in the group was level 84, his gear was half questing greens and half pre-85 dungeon blues. His overall dps was over 8.9k....I didn't even pull his numbers for the boss fights, but my jaw was on the floor since he was pulling more than me with a 333 average ilevel. It was just sick and one of the few times I really wished I had taken a screen shot. I was seriously 'jelly' that a rogue who wasn't even level capped was out dps-ing me who was in better gear and I had played my class for a long time...

[Deleted]

I am not level capped yet, so this is worth a grain of sand on the beach...but...

I love playing as Sub and it is perhaps the most fun I've had in the game....but I have Assassination as my offspec and will be using it for dungeons and raids once I get level capped unless Sub gets some much needed buffs.

I only started playing a rogue about a month ago (now at level 76) and pretty much went Sub from level 10. I love the play style...and I am not above stating that I like being in complete control while I beat a mob to death and not giving them a chance to hit my rogue. I also like the 'planning' of routes and how the defensive abilities turn into huge offensive abilties (Vanish just to Amush/Evis again...woot...big numbers!)...

Plus, Shadowstep > Feral Cat Charge in every way. My main was a druid and was dps till the end of LK. Can't tell you how many times I would charge only to end up facing the wrong way on a mob/boss. It would get to be more than a little annoying when doing chain heroics. Still haven't had that problem once with Shadowstep.

Unfortunately, Sub has started to fall well behind other classes/specs at doing damage in dungeons for a few levels now and the gap between my best Sub DPS and my half-assed Mut DPS continues to get wider with every level. While questing Mut is winning out as well since Deadened Nerves + 100% uptime on ImpRecup means never having to stop and heal except in very rare cases. Moving between mobs is faster too since, at my level, I have both Quickening and Nightstalker and it trumps the 20second cooldown on Shadowstep.

I did a regular dungeon on my druid a few days back. There were three level 85's and two 84's. The assissination rogue in the group was level 84, his gear was half questing greens and half pre-85 dungeon blues. His overall dps was over 8.9k....I didn't even pull his numbers for the boss fights, but my jaw was on the floor since he was pulling more than me with a 333 average ilevel. It was just sick and one of the few times I really wished I had taken a screen shot. I was seriously 'jelly' that a rogue who wasn't even level capped was out dps-ing me who was in better gear and I had played my class for a long time...

nah, you just suck

[Adalwolf]

I don't do much PVP. I used to be really into it. Loved ganking clothies sitting down to drink behind some tree somewhere, thinking they're safe behind the front line skirmish. Yes, I'm one of those people. But these days it just doesn't do it for me. So my two specs are PVE-based. But I find that Ass-spec just doesn't cut it soloing. It's great for groups when you can stab the crap out of something from behind, but when I'm prowling around by myself, killing things, I find that Sub-spec just can't be beaten.

My two standard attack configurations go: Shadowstep > Ambush > Kidney Shot > Shadow Dance > Ambush > Ambush > Ambush... few mobs survive that; in fact, most die before the third Ambush if all of them crit and given Sub's high Ambush crit chance, that happens more often than not. The few times a mob does survive that, the 5-point Eviscerate that follows generally does them in, whether it crits or not. Given that I usually end up with 5 combo points remaining, I usually pop a Recuperate on the off-chance that I took any damage at all on that kill, or that I might take damage on the next one.

The second attack configuration is for when Shadow Dance and Shadowstep are on CD. Yes, I kill things that quickly: Cheap Shot > Backstab > Backstab > Kidney Shot > Backstab > Backstab > 5-point Eviscerate. Again, mobs rarely survive all of that and even if they do, a couple of Hemo's and they're done.

Now... I'm not in spectacular gear. In fact, I'm barely iLevel 330. I'm not in a big guild and we don't chase first kills. We're just nerds who play an MMO together for fun. So my rogue isn't going to set records. And yet, even with his gear, I can do this over and over and over and virtually never have to stop to eat. Whereas with Ass-spec or Combat-spec, I'm constantly hammering away at mobs for combo points in a desperately boring battle to kill stuff before it kills me; or at least wears away my hit points to the point I have to stop and eat/bandage. The average kill time for a mob is also far, far quicker with sub. And if that wasn't enough, the shadowstep jump cuts grinding time by a third at least, simply because it closes that distance for you in a blink.

So, that's my story. Do you use a different spec for farming/soloing/questing/dailies? Or do you stick to the tried and true of your main spec?

NEVER use Ambush as Assassination Rogue. Why? Because Garrote alone does more damage than Ambush. Not only that, but when you have a bleed on the target, you can proc Venomous Wounds, which increase your Energy Regen and does as much damage as a 5 stack of Deadly Poison tick. Something important is to have Imp. Recuperate, it does wonders...

As for Subtetly, when you get 333+ gear you will find out that Shadowstep -> Premeditation + Ambush -> Eviscerate combo takes away more than 70% of the mobs' HP. You can just finish it off with a couple Hemorrhages.

Anyway, if you want to be more resilient, you could try Combat spec, it stays alive longer than both Subtlety and Assassination.

[loki504]

NEVER use Ambush as Assassination Rogue. Why? Because Garrote alone does more damage than Ambush. Not only that, but when you have a bleed on the target, you can proc Venomous Wounds, which increase your Energy Regen and does as much damage as a 5 stack of Deadly Poison tick. Something important is to have Imp. Recuperate, it does wonders...

As for Subtetly, when you get 333+ gear you will find out that Shadowstep -> Premeditation + Ambush -> Eviscerate combo takes away more than 70% of the mobs' HP. You can just finish it off with a couple Hemorrhages.

Anyway, if you want to be more resilient, you could try Combat spec, it stays alive longer than both Subtlety and Assassination.

plss reread his post. since when can assa rogue use shadow step and shadow dance?

[Bobbojonno]

plss reread his post. since when can assa rogue use shadow step and shadow dance?

did you read his post?

[Doleo]

I did a regular dungeon on my druid a few days back. There were three level 85's and two 84's. The assissination rogue in the group was level 84, his gear was half questing greens and half pre-85 dungeon blues. His overall dps was over 8.9k....I didn't even pull his numbers for the boss fights, but my jaw was on the floor since he was pulling more than me with a 333 average ilevel. It was just sick and one of the few times I really wished I had taken a screen shot. I was seriously 'jelly' that a rogue who wasn't even level capped was out dps-ing me who was in better gear and I had played my class for a long time...

It isn't surprising to see an 84 out dps an 85. As soon as he/she hits 85, their hit/crit/mastery/expertise take a significant hit, and his/her dps will drop significantly. Simple fact is, you need less rating at 84 than you do at 85 to increase any given stat's %. That being said - a good player often puts up better numbers than someone in better gear who isn't being as efficient.

[Disarmonia]

I have a PVE mute and PVP mute spec, and for questing I use my pvp spec because of better dmg reduction, increased survivabilty, and lack of opportunity to use backstab under 35%.

Also normally quest in pvp gear incase some baddy tries to jump me.

[Rooflesstoofless]

nah, you just suck

Um yeeeah....this is someone who's posts are a solid 95% of QQ's and one line attempts at sarcasm/rudeness.

Fail troll still fails.

[devilPanda]

At the time of writing this, I'm level 64 on a new rogue I rolled for a dif server than my mains, and I've been using Sub spec since level 10 in PvP and PvE situations. PvE wise I mostly quest since sitting in the LFD tool isn't my thing. But, since level 10, I've been using the usual ShS > Ambush combo; and PreMed > ShS > Ambush/Garrote once high enough. Those two there USUALLY drop a mob to about 20-35%, and it puts a fwe combo points on the mob as well, so I just finish them off with one quick Evis, or for higher levels, instead of Evis, I'll sometimes just use Rupture and finish them off with a few Hemos. I've been doing that since level 10 and as you can se its usually just a quick 1-2 shot death for most mobs except rares and elites.

PvP wise, I just PreMed > ShS > Ambush > Evis; by then most cloth wearers will be dead. If they aren't, I just wise up, Prep (if needed) > Vanish > PreMed > ShS > Ambush/Garrote > Rupt/Evis > Hemo, that usually gets the job done unless the target is just in flat out better gear or has a lot more stam.

I tried Mut, but that just didn't kill things fast enough in my eyes. With Sub, it was quick effortless kills, and seemed to fit the 'assassin' role better.

In dungeons, I really feel out of place because at lower levels, with Sub, I was always topping dmg meters. But I'd say around level 45-50 or so, things started to take a dive, and I could keep up some, but I wasn't as far ahead on damage as I'd used to be. Now at 60+ its a struggle to even keep up with ~80% of the dmg others are doing it seems like. Theres more adds, and other classes have AoE, and don't require as much 'setting up'. Sub is a spec thats great against single targets with a lot of HP, but other wise, it sucks.